an endorsement of endonyms! an excoriation of exonyms!

The world is getting smaller and I don't think we are going to have room soon enough to play our little English games with other people's words. I never knew that India's actual name was Bhārat Gaṇarājya until today! Why do we continue to live like this? Who are we trying to fool by calling Zhōngguó "China"? "Japan", man? Do I understand you to mean "Nippon", sir? Can I ask a friend to join me at a Bhārat restaurant the next time I crave Aloo Ghobi, or will I sound like a douche?

I like the (not often used lately afaik) Japanese exonym for America: 米国 - beikoku (literally, rice country).

is 米国 japanese though? what is used more often?

مصر
(Masr) instead of Egypt (though it used to be Kemet).

Munchen, Firenze, Wien, ...

In my heart, Livorno shall always be Leghorn.

to play our little English games with other people's words

This practice is by no means limited to Anglophones, btw.

I remember as a kid thinking it was weird that in the 3 languages I could speak (English, French, German), the name for Germany was completely different. I've since sort of figured out why this is, but it still bothers me a bit.

whoever decided osterreich --> austria, good marketing move.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_Germany

Trying to think of some New World localities for which there are common Anglicized spellings:

Guatemala City
Mexico City
Panama City
Quebec City
Brazil
French Guiana
Dominican Republic

Most of these have been Anglicized, though, because they contain common English words (city, republic). Cases like Brazil (Brasil) seem to be rare.

Romanian: Germania

Romania keeping the Empire alive

In French, le Mexique is the country and Mexico is Mexico City.

In French, several U.S cities and states are called by their French language equivalents (la Floride, la Nouvelle-Orléan, Nouvelle-Angleterre, etc.)

I like the (not often used lately afaik) Japanese exonym for America: 米国 - beikoku (literally, rice country).

― clouds, Wednesday, September 19, 2012 12:36 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I always found it funny/interesting that Korea uses 美 (beautiful) while Japan uses 米 (rice), given they are both pronounced the same (in Korean at least -- is this the case with Japan?)

I am confused about 國 and 国 ... are these the same thing? or they just mean the same thing?

la Floride, la Nouvelle-Orléans, Nouvelle-Angleterre

tbf, Florida and New Orleans were names that predate their being primarily anglophone places and la Nouvelle-Orléans is the original name of the town. Similarly francisized are names like Californie and Virginie.

It took me awhile in Mexico (the country) to get used to seeing roadsigns pointing toward "MEXICO" (the city.)

People always mention New York, New York, or just plain "Juarez", but you never hear anyone talk about Oklahoma, Oklahoma.

(Yes, I know that's because NYC's name is officially "New York", not that it matters in this sort of thing.)

http://g35driver.com/forums/attachments/lounge-off-topic/29524d1134633434-hottest-news-reporter-ever-jackie3.jpg

In French, several U.S cities and states are called by their French language equivalents (la Floride, la Nouvelle-Orléan, Nouvelle-Angleterre, etc.)

Similarly, in Spanish: Nueva York, Filadelfia

What happens to cyberpunk cities like NeoTokyo or NeoJersey?

Shouldn't it be called "York Nuevea" when you get right down to it?

man my local weathercast is just not... yeah.

Well, sure, I'll start using those names the day that we can go back to calling the country that I live in Lloegyr.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b5/Britain.peoples.original.traditional.jpg/323px-Britain.peoples.original.traditional.jpg

Shouldn't it be called "York Nuevea" when you get right down to it?

Nah, there's some flexibility in Spanish with adjective placement. Place names with "Nueva" generally start with it.

How come it's Ciudad Juarez on one side and Nueva York on the other?

Though I guess Juarez is more a name for the city than it is an adjective.

is 米国 japanese though? what is used more often?

― Philip Nunez, Wednesday, September 19, 2012 5:12 PM (Yesterday)

again, afaik: アメリカ (amerika). at least that's what's on all the maps in my japanese textbooks.

I am confused about 國 and 国 ... are these the same thing? or they just mean the same thing?

i think 国　is the simplified form of 國 -- they have the same pronunciations. can anyone verify?

i've also heard that the japanese couldn't hear the "a" in "america" when said by english speakers because the initial "ah" sound is so short, so they heard "'merica"

right. 國 is cool because it retains the phonetic element 或 that lets you guess at the pronunciation of the character. 国 is old, too, and there were lots of variants of the character that you could come across if you read old old chinese stuff.

both forms are pronounced the same, i guess, but they're pronounced different in all the languages we're talking about

guó in mandarin, gwok in cantonese, goku in japanese (right?), or guk in korean (a place where the pronunciation might be based on the chinese character but it would be more likely to be written in hangeul) (and would it be người in vietnamese?)

how can you know all those languages?

you don't have to! chinese script is the uniting thing with these languages. it would be like tracing a latin or greek root as it leads to romance languages and beyond.

look at all those similar pronunciations. if you sit down to learn korean or vietnamese with the ability to read chinese, you are always looking for those words that share pronunciation or have similar pronunciation across languages. vietnamese nouns, for example = 60-70% chinese vocab. so, if you figure out how chinese characters were pronounced in vietnamese or korean, you can make huge headway.

there aren't that many unique sounds in chinese (or reading of chinese script), so if you figure out the rule that UO in mandarin = UK in korean-- well, it's actually going to get you into trouble because the rule isn't going to hold, but it's interesting linguistic trainspotting or whatever.

also, i think i'm totally wrong on the vietnamese thing there. but i'm banking on the lack of vietnamese speakers on ilx to cover myself.

it should be quốc-- which again looks like the cantonese or korean pronunciation of the character!

anyways. back to endonyms!

goku in japanese (right?)

it's koku (han pron.) or kuni (native japanese pron.)

best thread!!!!

you may ask yourself why your idea has not caught on

http://weather.sg.msn.com/region.aspx?wealocations=Chos%C5%8Fn-minjuju%C5%ADi-inmin-konghwaguk

I give you some weather

also: who gets the rights to tell germany what its real name is? or scotland? etc.

Part of OTAN? What? I come from Estados Unidos? Can we just get the order of the initials right, here?

And of course, the initials for Estados Unidos is EEUU.

Wanna lead a chant at the next soccer match, going Eh Eh! Oo Oo!