Joni Mitchell: Classic or Dud

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I got "Blue" and "Ladies of the Canyon" for my parents, not thinking I'd ever want them for myself. And why is it that 'warbling' should be considered a bad sound to listen to? Her voice on those two records is lovely!

More to the point, did anyone see that Norwegian girl doing Joni Mitchell on Stars In Euro Eyes?

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Norman, it's funny that you mention Joan Baez in relation to this. Joan Didion has this essay about her in which she writes: "When it was time to go to high school, her father was teaching at Stanford, and so she went to Palo Alto High School, where she taught herself "House of the Rising Sun" on a Sears, Roebuck guitar, tried to achieve vibrato by tapping her throat with her finger, and made headlines by refusing to leave the school during a bomb drill." I love the myth that's suggested by these facts, esp. in relation to the setting.

as i am allergic to the entire countryside, i liked that they paved over paradise and put up a parking lot: asphalt = better than pollen dust, IMO

1. The completely unique sound she gets out of an acoustic guitar on "Blue". 'A Case Of You' = classic.

2. "The Hissing Of Summer Lawns": my definition of Pazz & Jop. Also includes Burundi music way before it was fashionable to do things like this.

3. A band like Nazareth can do great covers of her material. Also her vocal lines are ideal fodder for bootlegs (as Fluke demonstrated years ago). Recontextualisation and all that.

4. She kept Jaco busy - hence fewer shitty Jazz Rock records were made.

(I'm joking about No.4 alex!)

and/or multiple alternate tunings, some of her own invention, i believe?

she's one of the greats, compositionally, subject-matter-wise and maybe persona-wise. and yes, arguably hot, if you like the personality. and probably harder than anyone who thinks she's "twee".

Both For the Roses and Court and Spark are arguably better than Blue. Her best singing (and guitar-playing?) may be on the otherwise middling though convenient pre-C&S-greatest-hits live Miles of Aisles

i wish i liked anne briggs more.

just noticed gygax's post. well, a 2nd opinion then.

That should read v. famous SCOTTISH guitar player etc., hope you never meet Bert on a dark night!

Expanded 2CD remasters of "Court And Spark", "Hissing Of Summer Lawns" and "Hejira" were supposed to have been released by January this year. They are not yet in the shops half a year later.
Does anyone know what happened and when and if they are due?

she dumped them in the ocean, I heard.

The album jacket is a photomontage and includes three photographs of Mitchell. In the foreground she is in blackface as her "reputed alter ego, a black hipster named Art Nouveau".

The David Yaffe and forthcoming Ann Powers book go at lengths to describe wtf was on her mind (the Powers book best).

https://static.cambridge.org/binary/version/id/urn:cambridge.org:id:binary:20171016100701055-0366:9781316569207:68091fig18_1.png

tastelessness takes many forms. the new cover art is horrendous

I would've suggested an outtake from her "Skating on Lake Mendota, WI" photo session, but she already used one for the Songs of a Prairie Girl compilation. (Granted so did Hejira, but mostly for the inner sleeve.)

Kind of like this one the most though, with Joni mysteriously in the distance I'd buy that as 'Don Juan's Reckless Daughter.'

I might be wrong but the photo of Joni with the wolf/dog they superimposed on the original blue/orange background is actually from the mid-80s and not from the 70s? I think it's from a photoshoot she did with Norman Seeff (who also did the one of her skating on Lake Mendota btw) for Dog Eat Dog, almost a decade after DJRD? Such a weird choice. I mean, I'm glad they didn't use the original artwork but surely she must have some painting from that era lying around in the attic they could use instead? Or just have some nice simple typography over the original background?

Great, underrated album; deserves a better cover than the two it got.

Archives Vol. 4: The Asylum Years 1976-1980 is out today, starts with her performances from Rolling Thunder Revue, features Hejira, Mingus and DJRD demos / alt versions, and finishes with recordings from the 1979 Shadows & Light tour, 7 hours total.

Joni, Stevie and me. See y'all tonight 🫶🏾 pic.twitter.com/g07DQd94FW

— jon batiste (@JonBatiste) October 20, 2024

I went to last night’s Joni Jam at the Bowl and it was, by some stretch, the most I have ever cried at a concert in my whole life

awww

so jealous!

I went tonight and it was just amazing. And yes I cried too.

setlist of these nights blowing my mind a bit, love that she's doing some deep cut stuff and not just the obvious.

setlist of these nights blowing my mind a bit, love that she's doing some deep cut stuff and not just the obvious.

Yeah the song selection was unbelievable. Some of the big ones you’d expect (“Big Yellow Taxi”, “A Case of You”, “Both Sides Now”, “The Circle Game”), but no “River” or “Blue” or “Woodstock” or “Help Me”. Plenty of deep cuts, like “God Must Be a Boogie Man”, three songs each from Turbulent Indigo and Night Ride Home, a bunch of stuff from Hejira. The selection of songs definitely felt like a reckoning with the world at large, couldn’t help but notice how much of it was some of her more politically-minded material.

And she was positively beatific on her throne with all her friends around her. She was cracking jokes and chuckling throughout the night, with a glass of Pinot Grigio in hand. And maybe she doesn’t possess the pipes that she once had but I still thought she sounded wonderful and she seemed genuinely pleased to be there. I really just couldn’t believe it was happening the whole time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5UgYwkEW00

This is from last year but I love how Annie Lennox sounds:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_N4rtxj4sqM

I saw the show last year at Hollywood Bowl, which was billed as "Brandi Carlisle and Friends". A lot of the same people as last night (Blake Mills, Wendy & Lisa, Annie Lennox, Allison Russell, Sista Strings, Lucius). I was really glad to see both shows - the first one elevated my experience of this one. Last year all these people came out one at a time, peppering a setlist of Brandi's songs with their own moments in the spotlight, doing their own songs. And you could see how great they each were. That all built to Joni coming out for the conclusion and they did I think just three songs. Joni seemed much more fragile/shaky, and they all seemed to do a lot more to lift her up.

I was expecting something similar this weekend, even it was obviously going to be much heavier on Joni's songs. But in fact Joni had SUCH a presence and really drove nearly every song. She was really brilliant. She obviously can't hit the high notes we've all memorized, but now the impressive thing is how (and when!) she hits the low notes. She just (vocally) danced around everyone else - you could feel everyone, especially those trying to sing harmonies, trying to keep up with where she was taking each phrase. She was powerful.

I'm not sure if it was the same group on Saturday night, but in the second half of the Sunday set they were joined by Jon Baptiste, Elton John (!!), Marcus Mumford, and a few others. That's also when Annie, Allison, Wendy & Lisa came out. Also for some reason Meryl Streep and Rita Wilson?

The only people who stepped forward to sing lead on anything were Marcus Mumford (California) and Annie Lennox (Ladies of the Canyon). I really was expecting all these other people to come up and take their turn and allow 81-year-old Joni to rest, but they never did. Even Brandi, who was sitting right next to Joni all night and clearly there to just take care of her and support her, always stayed in a supporting role. And I think that's why I appreciated seeing the version of the show last year - I knew how phenomenal they all were, and how any of them could easily keep a sold-out Hollywood Bowl crowd rapt, but they ALL very gladly stayed in their supporting roles and just let Joni shine. (I will say though, by the end I was really wondering why Elton John was there. He was sitting on stage, had a microphone like everyone else, and I honestly think he almost never opened his mouth. He was exuding "I'm just happy to be here" vibes on the same level as Meryl and Rita... but his presence created a sense of anticipation that was never fulfilled.)

Any way, a truly magical night. I was brought to absolute tears by "Both Sides Now" and "The Circle Game". I think Joni got roughly a dozen standing ovations over the course of the night.

just reading scott's post made me cry. I probably won't end up seeing her but her to get these flowers is so wonderful.

Side note - a surprising sense of community in my corner of the stands because we were all checking the Dodgers scoreline before the set began and then during intermission. The Dodgers very conveniently won the game during intermission so no one had to feel rude when they cheered about that.

“Both Sides Now” had me full-on ugly-crying. A stranger even handed me a tissue at one point lol

Some of the big ones you’d expect (“Big Yellow Taxi”, “A Case of You”, “Both Sides Now”, “The Circle Game”), but no “River” or “Blue” or “Woodstock” or “Help Me”. Plenty of deep cuts

I can’t let you go without saying something about Joni Mitchell at the Bowl.
Carlile: The tea I can spill is that I’ve spent these last five, six years in the passenger seat with Joan, and in this case I’m in the backseat. She’s chosen to learn songs that I never heard before, that have been an incredible challenge for us all to learn. It’s gonna be a long show. She wants to give everybody a full-spectrum performance of who she really is and what her career has done. It’s different than [Mitchell’s shows at the Newport Folk Festival and the Gorge Amphitheatre] — it’s gonna be even crazier. I’m seeing her be inspired in ways I haven’t seen before. And we’ve got some people that have joined the party that are just an inspiration to watch work.

Phil: Probably half the songs on our next record are gonna be in weird tunings because of working with her.

Carlile: He’s having to do [bassist] Jaco [Pastorius’ parts] on songs where Jaco tripled his bass. Phil’s got to play all the licks — and not piss off Joni in the meantime.

Phil: You can’t get anything by her.

Last night we got into the Bowl *just* as the first song started and hilariously I didn't know it was her at first. I didn't know about the rotating stage, the lights were very low, she was singing very low, and suddenly everything lit up and omgomgomg. Most of section L seemed to be crying.

I love how her cane became a prop: sometimes a conductor's baton, other times a gearshift lever, and throughout "Both Sides, Now" - an ice axe she was using to climb an infinite mountain

omigod Elvis that's fabulous

He was sitting on stage, had a microphone like everyone else, and I honestly think he almost never opened his mouth

I did clearly hear him begin the chorus to "I'm Still Standing" but he realized that he was early, so he only got as far as "I'm..." before correcting himself

Wonderful description of the cane Elvis

Elton wasn’t there on Saturday but she did sing “I’m Still Standing”

Yeah, great description!
Here's another report ("I'm still sitting.") Mentions live debut of song from Shine--is that a good album?

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2024/oct/21/joni-mitchell-lets-rip-at-donald-trump-at-rarity-laden-us-concert

I was so curious to hear how she did "I'm Still Standing," and it turns out she's done it before. This sounds better than the phone videos from this weekend's show (though the ones online are phone recordings of an amazing performance).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxqFJLm6Hp4

(This is from PBS coverage of the Gershwin Prize.)

My wife and I also went to the Sunday night Joni Jam show at the Hollywood Bowl. We were out in California for a wedding near San Diego on Saturday and drove up for the Sunday night show. Our seats were way up high but it was still a great night. I really liked new song “If I had a Heart ( I would cry)” where Joni’s was mostly just backed by piano. “Amelia” and “A Case of You” also stood out .

Carlile mentioned that Joni changed some of the words to the Elton John song when she was first asked to participate at the Gershwin Prize event and do one of his songs .

Years ago she changed a little of Rudyard Kipling “If” poem when she put it to song .

I hope at least one album, live and/or studio, comes out of this era---with new songs and new versions of early ones that were always demo-only, like "Eastern Rain."

holy shit I never knew she wrote that, prob in my top 5 Fairport songs

Mine too! Here's Joni doing it, via Archives Vol. 1:
http://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-e&sca_esv=f3c510255100d4e3&tbm=vid&q=%22Eastern+Rain%22+song+written+by&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjK2M6G-aKJAxUXRzABHcEyLTUQ8ccDegQISxAH&biw=1082&bih=502&dpr=1.25#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:a2ab6cd8,vid:h68LXXCGnDM,st:0

Wouldn’t be surprised if we got a video release out of this, lots of camera ppl all over the stage

Of the guests who got to lead , Marcus Mumford didn’t wow me. Am thinking he was a Brandi Carlile choice. He at least dueted with Mitchell though. Lennox powered through “Ladies of the Canyon “ and Mitchell couldn’t be really heard on that . But Mitchell was lead on virtually everything, so I guess I shouldn’t complain

Chappell Roan and Lucy Dacus were singing along backstage

https://www.brooklynvegan.com/watch-joni-mitchell-elton-john-chappell-roan-lucy-dacus-brandi-carlile-more-sing-im-still-standing-together/

https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/joni-mitchell/2024/hollywood-bowl-los-angeles-ca-2bab90c6.html

Amazing how many years it had been since she had done some of these songs live ( although she never toured a ton )

Can I say...she doesn't sound good at all on "I'm Still Standing."

Wouldn’t be surprised if we got a video release out of this, lots of camera ppl all over the stage

I was at the Saturday show, and feel lucky to have been there.

Really nice posts, pgwp, captured the vibe of the show really nicely.

should i do a poll of mingus bc it's the most amazing record ever

I just picked up Hejira and Mingus this weekend. I had never heard them bar a couple of songs and loved them both on first listen.

Mingus is wild

"The Wolf That Lives in Lindsey" is wonderful.

Mentioned this in the Eno thread, but in one of the versions of the Eno doc there's a Joni anecdote where Eno says he got so tired of being an ambient music ambassador, so tired of his name being a shorthand for ambient and (according to him) "wimpy" that he turned down a chance to work with her when she called him up and asked if he wanted to make an ambient album with her (whatever that might have meant). He calls it one of his greatest regrets.

For whatever reason, I learned every word of "The Dry Cleaner From Des Moines" when I was 13 and I still know it, every word, that cat's got luck, that cat's got luck

It is strange but my childhood introduction to Joni Mitchell was the tapes my mom had purchased for the car: Mingus, Chalk Mark In A Rainstorm, Night Ride Home. See also: Absolute Torch And Twang and Tracy Chapman s/t. My mom was def a lesbian in another life or perhaps even this one

come sit by me

good grief i can't even tabulate what my intro to joni was! i just _knew_ "help me." i'm serious: as far back as my memory goes, there's am radio and that song. curious child that i was, i must have asked as soon as i figured out how, "who is this singer?" because by the time "got til it's gone" came out, i appreciated the shoutout as much as a 13 year old at the time could.

(my neurodivergence was also quite happy to have the prior knowledge of THIS BEAT = THAT SINGER! before the shoutout even hit)

i must say: that's a remarkable joni starter pack, fgti.

my first album was court+spark, of course