Black Sabbath: Classic or Dud?

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I've seen the original Black Sabbath, plus "Black Sabbath" with Mike Bordin from Faith No More on drums, so no. Also, there have been lots of other Black Sabbath permutations on the road. Always business, never personal.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 18 May 2012 11:49 (twelve years ago) link

but then sharon bought the rights to the name from Iommi.

it looks like something rupert the bear would wear (Algerian Goalkeeper), Friday, 18 May 2012 11:55 (twelve years ago) link

When did that happen? Because I don't think there's ever been a Black Sabbath minus Iommi. In fact, I want to say that Iommi is the only one who has never been replaced in Black Sabbath, and weren't there lawsuits regarding the name as recently as a year or two ago?

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 18 May 2012 12:48 (twelve years ago) link

presumably when ozzy rejoined late 90s. thats why dio sabbath couldnt use the name

it looks like something rupert the bear would wear (Algerian Goalkeeper), Friday, 18 May 2012 12:57 (twelve years ago) link

tbf for a huge % of the population the black sabbath name = ozzy, so billing the dio band as "heaven & hell" was probably a good idea just for bringing in just the audience that wanted to see that lineup, which was large enough to suggest the name change didn't hurt them

some dude, Friday, 18 May 2012 13:00 (twelve years ago) link

tbf for a huge % of the population the black sabbath name = ozzy

^then a huge % of the population is idiots who don't know a fucking thing about what they are talking about.

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 13:09 (twelve years ago) link

For me Bill Ward>>>>>>>>Ozzy

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 13:09 (twelve years ago) link

When did that happen? Because I don't think there's ever been a Black Sabbath minus Iommi. In fact, I want to say that Iommi is the only one who has never been replaced in Black Sabbath, and weren't there lawsuits regarding the name as recently as a year or two ago?

― Josh in Chicago, Friday, May 18, 2012 8:48 AM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Correct, the settlement on the use of the name was very recent.

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 13:10 (twelve years ago) link

Ward apparently was not a party to the settlement, if all this crap is hitting the fan.

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 13:12 (twelve years ago) link

So, what constitutes a bottom-line Black Sabbath now? Ozzy, and Sharon on Bongos?

Mark G, Friday, 18 May 2012 13:13 (twelve years ago) link

summary:

On 2 February 2012, Ward publicly announced that he would not participate in the Black Sabbath reunion unless he was given a "signable contract." The following day, the other group members announced they had "no choice but to continue recording without him," but also said "our door is always open" for Ward to return to the band.[13] In February 2012, the band announced that they will not continue the world tour but will play the Download festival in June 2012. Instead of Black Sabbath, the tour will feature Osbourne and a revolving line-up of guest musicians, billed as "Ozzy and Friends".

On 11 April 2012, Lollapalooza founder Perry Farrell announced that Black Sabbath will perform at Lollapalooza 2012. Farrell said this will be Black Sabbath's only American concert in 2012.[151]

Some time in late April 2012, Bill Ward was added back to the band's official Facebook page as a member of Black Sabbath.

On May 15, 2012, Bill Ward posted on his website that "after a final effort to participate in the upcoming Sabbath shows a failure to agree has continued" and that he would not be participating in the reunion shows, but "will remain with an open mind and a position of willingness to negotiate 'signable' terms with Sabbath’s representatives in the future."[152]

Mark G, Friday, 18 May 2012 13:15 (twelve years ago) link

Misread part of the above as the tour will feature Osbourne and a revolting line-up of guest musicians.

Tarfumes The Escape Goat, Friday, 18 May 2012 13:18 (twelve years ago) link

maybe members of Velvet Revolter will be involved

some dude, Friday, 18 May 2012 13:23 (twelve years ago) link

It would be so cool if Ward got to sing for Velvet Revolver.

how's life, Friday, 18 May 2012 13:25 (twelve years ago) link

Fuck THIS shit:

https://twitter.com/#!/basementgalaxy/status/203532603314274305

Oh this is priceless, the new Black Sabbath website has old photos of the band with Bill Ward cropped out. Classy! http://t.co/HnzKrrrY

Ned Raggett, Friday, 18 May 2012 17:12 (twelve years ago) link

Related:

https://twitter.com/#!/basementgalaxy/status/203533198871887873

Sabbath fans are really letting the band have it on Facebook. As if the band cares what they think. http://t.co/2y1ASsgu

Ned Raggett, Friday, 18 May 2012 17:14 (twelve years ago) link

man that's a shame. I just watched Classic Albums: Paranoid and Ward came off as the coolest dude. I hate to see musical vendettas.

WARS OF ARMAGEDDON (Karaoke Version) (Sparkle Motion), Friday, 18 May 2012 17:14 (twelve years ago) link

It's only a matter of time before they announce new remasters with Ward's drums replaced. Geezer and Tony are assholes for going along with the Osbourne clan down this path.

EZ Snappin, Friday, 18 May 2012 17:16 (twelve years ago) link

omg @ that website

Roger Barfing (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 18 May 2012 17:19 (twelve years ago) link

unbelievable

Roger Barfing (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 18 May 2012 17:19 (twelve years ago) link

definitely sinking into "more ridiculous than spinal tap" territory.

tylerw, Friday, 18 May 2012 17:20 (twelve years ago) link

not cropped out here
http://www.blacksabbath.com/history.html

am0n, Friday, 18 May 2012 17:33 (twelve years ago) link

kelly o's still growing out her mustache to shoot the new band photos

some dude, Friday, 18 May 2012 17:35 (twelve years ago) link

I'd rather see a reunion of the Tyr era band than this shit. this is not Black Sabbath by any stretch. They wont be getting any of my dough.

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 17:37 (twelve years ago) link

As for this weekend's warm-up show in Birmingham, the drummer only learned of the concert at the end of April, from an online advert. "I had no prior knowledge of the date and location, and I felt totally excluded." After about a week of back and forth, Ward claims he received the following offer: "Come to the UK, play for free and see how the first show goes."

"I was tempted," he said. "Playing for free would not have been a problem for me, but … I can't come to Birmingham and 'see what happens' knowing there is a risk of not being able to play Download or Lollapalooza … I had to say 'no' to Birmingham on the principle of wanting to play all the shows."

While Ward maintains an "open mind" about future work with Black Sabbath, the 2012 negotiations seem to have reached a dead end. "I hold no malice or resentment towards the other band members," he said. "My fight has never been with them. I'll love them forever. In my opinion, nobody wins this time; the band doesn't win; the fans for an original lineup don't win. Nobody wins, nobody. Even the ones who thought they did."

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 18 May 2012 18:07 (twelve years ago) link

Arik 'Moonhawk' Roper talking about the Hipgnosis sleeve art to Technical Ecstasy in the current issue of WIRE = classic.

Ima Skim Read That Bitch (Doran), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:00 (twelve years ago) link

link?

am0n, Friday, 18 May 2012 19:07 (twelve years ago) link

Bill Ward seems like a guy with a pretty great attitude.

WARS OF ARMAGEDDON (Karaoke Version) (Sparkle Motion), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:11 (twelve years ago) link

"Come to the UK, play for free and see how the first show goes."

This is unbelievable.

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:15 (twelve years ago) link

yeah. dude is putting on a brave front but I can't imagine wanting to play with those other assholes after this kind of treatment.

Roger Barfing (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:19 (twelve years ago) link

I hope he gets some good guest spots or something out of this. Like, if I had a famous band, I would be all like "Bill Ward, you want to play with us?" right now.

Lee Morgan Come Again (how's life), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:23 (twelve years ago) link

Can I play devil's advocaat for a mo?

This sounds like they have a problem with Bill's ability...

Mark G, Friday, 18 May 2012 19:33 (twelve years ago) link

Maybe I could buy that if the Osbornes already didn't have an EXTENSIVE history of fucking people over and doing extremely childish things (like cropping people out of photos, erasing them from albums, throwing eggs at them onstage etc etc etc). As soon as I saw the images popped up in their website with Ward cropped out, it was confirmation enough for me.

heated debate over derpy hooves (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:35 (twelve years ago) link

When I saw Sabbath 13 years ago I had a major problem with Ozzy's ability, he still seems to be there though...

A++++++ would deal with again (Matt #2), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:40 (twelve years ago) link

Although yes it wouldn't surprise me if Bill has trouble keeping up these days.

A++++++ would deal with again (Matt #2), Friday, 18 May 2012 19:41 (twelve years ago) link

this is pitiful bush league fuckery that has the Osbournes' fingerprints all over it

Vermicious Knid A (Noodle Vague), Friday, 18 May 2012 20:00 (twelve years ago) link

This sounds like they have a problem with Bill's ability...

― Mark G, Friday, May 18, 2012 3:33 PM (28 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Have you heard Ozzy recently?

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 20:02 (twelve years ago) link

And if that was the case, why not talk to Bill and reach some sort of detente behind closed doors. Give him a golden parachute or something in return for saying he's "retired". Dont tell the guy he can show up and play for free as a tryout-its Bill fucking Ward!

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Friday, 18 May 2012 20:04 (twelve years ago) link

its Bill fucking Ward!

― One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill fucking Magill)

am0n, Friday, 18 May 2012 20:16 (twelve years ago) link

I mentioned upthread that when I saw Sabbath a decade ago, I thought Ward was having trouble keeping up. This was after his return from his heart attack. But then, he did keep up, so I'm not sure what the prob is. Maybe he got worse? But of course, if he couldn't do it, it's not a "I think I can, I think I can" situation. If he couldn't do it he couldn't fake it, so it seems unlikely that performance is an issue.

Geezer and Ozzy have it easy. All Geezer has to do is sleep through his rote-simple (but don't get me wrong, still awesome!) riffs, and Ozzy just has to be subtle about peeing his pants.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 18 May 2012 20:29 (twelve years ago) link

at least he's being subtle about something for once

bailiwaka flocka (some dude), Friday, 18 May 2012 20:31 (twelve years ago) link

By "subtle" I meant "subtly dumping buckets of water over himself to hide the fact that he is incontinent."

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 18 May 2012 20:35 (twelve years ago) link

I don't think it's a secret I like these guys a little bit. This kind of stupidity really bothers me. But I'm an idiot for thinking it's not about money at this point.

One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Saturday, 19 May 2012 00:07 (twelve years ago) link

this is fucking infuriating bullshit

cosi fan whitford (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Saturday, 19 May 2012 00:57 (twelve years ago) link

I'd find some satisfaction, at least, in how hated Sharon Osbourne is in the metal community, if not for the fact that so many housewives love her now

Chris S, Saturday, 19 May 2012 01:16 (twelve years ago) link

Ever since the Iron Maiden debacle, Sharon has had no cred at all.

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 19 May 2012 01:43 (twelve years ago) link

cause she had so much before?

Tailpipe Store (some dude), Saturday, 19 May 2012 01:51 (twelve years ago) link

for exasperating lols go find the few defenders of this move on Black Sabbath's Facebook page, including one especially aggro clueless dude who opines that "the drummer [is] the most expendable position in any band" - lol anyone who believes this knows literally nothing about bands

cosi fan whitford (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Saturday, 19 May 2012 04:14 (twelve years ago) link

couldn't resist

http://whatdrummer.tumblr.com/

ma ck ro ma ck ro (mackro mackro), Saturday, 19 May 2012 05:42 (twelve years ago) link

Geezer Butler sez...

Tarfumes The Escape Goat, Saturday, 19 May 2012 18:33 (twelve years ago) link


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