Live Zappa

Yeah, that Stockholm show is a fun one. Just discovered that recently myself.

It's so cool to watch after having had years of listening to the audio from it. And it seems so incredibly alive when compared to the '81 show which is technically better -- almost note perfect -- but a bit soulless.

Visuals add so much, esp. the Roxy footage, which is amazeballs. I'll try to watch that '81 show at some point, but while those guys are technically brilliant, that band and that setlist are really not up my alley.

The only time I ever saw him was 1974, and I wish more I had more than the vague, fuzzy memories I'm left with. Damn teenage drinking. Kinda wish I would have seen him later too, although I was so far off the Zappatrain in the 80s.

I think all his 80s bands suffered from that soullessness. He had a harder and harder time reconciling conflicting desires -- he wanted that note-perfect execution, but he would also tell the players to "put some eyebrows on it" or "put some garlic in it." He never achieved better than the 73-74 bands, imo.
xxpost

Dan, I would say the '81 show is mainly worth watching for the solos. Steve and Frank really pushed each other into some crazy spaces. But yeah, the setlist is a bit of a shame. Pretty much every show post '78 or so is, as William put it, about conflicting desires. The perfectionist drove the life from his own work.

One of these days, William, we will find a way to meet halfway between our respective abodes and just chat over coffee or beer or something. Well worth the hours of driving to get you to wax eloquent about Zappa. Dan, your welcome to join too, wherever you may be coming from.

watched a bit of that 73 clip (75 is about as far as I go w/ frank) -- great stuff! being in zappa's band must've been hard.

Wow, just when I say I can't remember my only Zappa show, I discover there's a soundboard recording:

http://www.discogs.com/Frank-Zappa-Saint-Mothers-In-Saint-Paul/release/2203684

and I'm listening to part of it as I type. Lots of spoken word tomfoolery so far, which is basically one of my only memories of the show.

That's amazing!

I found a better looking version of the Stockholm show I embedded above:

http://youtu.be/yqfx2cTeCFk

One of these days, William, we will find a way to meet halfway between our respective abodes and just chat over coffee or beer or something. Well worth the hours of driving to get you to wax eloquent about Zappa. Dan, your welcome to join too, wherever you may be coming from.

Sounds like fun! Maybe in NYC for an Ed Palermo show, and we can heckle him for not getting it just right.

Sure! NYC sounds better than the probable middle points of Little Rock or Shreveport.

I'm in St. Paul, MN. Triangulate that...

I believe I've convinced myself to see Zappa Plays Zappa next time they come through.

So, when are we all going to Kansas City?

http://www.jambands.com/news/2013/04/30/zappa-plays-zappa-to-celebrate-roxy-elsewhere-with-tour/

I might roadtrip to one of these dates.

I can't believe they're skipping the whole South. They were just here but not playing Roxy material. Grr.

Easily my most played Zappa album. Roadtrip to Eau Claire, WI might be in the offing.

It's tempting to go back to Eau Claire, why because the Norske Nook and 837 kinds of pie.

^^^ truthbomb

I didn't know that A Token Of His Extreme finally got an official dvd release. Primo '74 Zappa that I've watched in crappy form many times so I need to pick this up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hN1h2w7gqvY#

oh hai, anybody for the complete Mount St. Mary's concert from 1963?

http://dangerousminds.net/comments/opus_5_young_frank_zappas_early_avant_garde

http://youtu.be/rwoTPS8gbJM

getting obsessed with Roxy and Elsewhere, it's such a perfect combo of what make Zappa such an enormous turn-off and why some of us still keep coming back - the band is just locked into this singular groove, Z's playing finds all these different pockets of goodness and just sounds so great, and then...he fuckin'...keeps right on blowing the minds of the sheeple on the mic with the assistance of his entire ensemble. like, they all think the same utterly tiresome schtick isn't just a fine way to bide time between killer playing, but the best way. and at the same time, sometimes, I feel like, well, who gives a shit - "Village of the Sun" is such a total gem, who cares if the people making it are the worst kinda people to be around - but then they keep right on insisting that you're not just gonna listen to their music, you have to take their personalities, warts and all, mainly warts, in the bargain.

but Jesus Christ "Village of the Sun" is killing me.

I beg you to get Roxy the Movie if you haven't already.

That "Village/Echidna's/Don't You Ever..." segment is one of my most played sides of vinyl ever; I've listened to that thing hundreds of times.

And I got to see The Grandmothers do a spot-on recreation at a festival once.

That "Village/Echidna's/Don't You Ever..." segment is one of my most played sides of vinyl ever; I've listened to that thing hundreds of times.

it's just fuckin' unbelievable. still surprising after all these years. but to get to it, you have to really bite your lip through that "Penguin in Bondage" intro...which, at several points, feels actually funny instead of forced-laugh funny: the moments when the band are talking to each other, bouncing off each other...Zappa is the artist about whom I should probably write a long piece that I really don't wanna write

Anger was one of his four food groups, along with coffee, cigarettes and staff paper — the tragedy of the 1973-74 band, the best band he ever had, was that he seemed to break it up because it didn't feed his anger. Everybody was too fuckin' happy! "Village" and "Cheepnis" were clear cracks in his misanthropy, signs of him taking actual pleasure in the world that wasn't at anyone else's expense.

Yeah the other great stretch is "Cheepnis/Orange County/More Trouble." I never play the "Penguin" side, or "Bebop Tango." That's a 2LP set that could have been a single disc imo.

c'mon guys, Pygmy Twylyte is great. Probably the Zappa track that gets stuck in my head most frequently.

i really like the summer '73 arrangement of "village of the sun" with an intro/outro dropped from later versions, and lead vox by george duke. it's here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kx74o-AjmdA

here's a nice version of dummy up featuring soul singer erma coffee guesting on vocals from the "un-concert":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khUu2LGjEg8

"Village" and "Cheepnis" were clear cracks in his misanthropy, signs of him taking actual pleasure in the world that wasn't at anyone else's expense.

I don't know about this. As a diehard fan of Roxy and this era of Zappa in general, I always heard "Village of the Sun" as a potshot; the kind of sentiment every rural person suspects is in the thoughts of every snobby so-called "coastal elite." The song is about Palmdale / Lancaster, a place from which Zappa escaped, and I always heard this as him ridiculing the "turkey farmers" who are "all still there"--"I don't know how the people stand it, but I guess they do," etc

Listening to the Roxy box now and omg this solo on the first version of Penguin is so fucking hot..... how did he not put this out before? Insane.

The Roxy box is pretty much the only Zappa I'm gonna listen to from here on out.

i nearly bought a copy of "Just Another Band From L.A." last weekend. i love that version of "Billy the Mountain"

This is so great -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvtvVf8_ITE

i guess i can't go on and on about zappa in the beefheart thread so i'm here to talk about how much i, like everyone who's ever encountered them, love the roxy '73 performances, what a fucking band. zappa's an insufferable nerd but at least very few of the songs are about sex (this is what kills over-nite sensation for me even though it is ecstatically played) and did i mention the band???? i was so surprised by the appearance of my man george duke. glad i persevered after nearly being defeated by uncle meat

however i also think this is close to the end of my zappa journey; i'm gonna check bongo fury and then the läther stuff and then i don't really think there's a lot left for me after that. which is fine bc the first incarnation of the mothers -> zappa's jazz/big band records -> the george duke mothers spans a ton of music. i even downloaded the roxy box

ranking is totally antithetical to the zappa project but this is where i land so far:

one size fits all
roxy & elsewhere
the grand wazoo
hot rats
weasels ripped my flesh
burnt weeny sandwich
we're only in it for the money
waka/jawaka
apostrophe (')
cruising with ruben and the jets
freak out!
lumpy gravy (orchestra only version)
uncle meat
over-nite sensation
lumpy gravy (musique concrete version)

i like uncle meat more than i've implied in this post and previous ones but also i mainly just like "king kong" "sleeping in a jar" and "dog breath"

oh i forgot absolutely free. good record but i think i'd put it after over-nite sensation, another one sunk by its lyrics

Brad, have you heard You Can't Do That On Stage Anymore vol. 2? It's a full concert (actually pieced together from more than one show) by that almighty 73-74 band, Helsinki late '74. Really, really good.

the 73-74 band was a motherfucker. curious about whether you've heard the live grand wazoo release. it's a really interesting one. also, on the hot rats tip, there's one live gig the hot rats group with sugarcane harris did, march 7, 1970 at the olympic theatre. it's a really nice set. it opens with the ten-minute version of "sharleena" featuring sugarcane harris as heard on the "lost episodes" release; one of his finer moments.

there's also a really nice tape of zappa and shuggie otis jamming on acoustic guitars together on the johnny otis show in '70. that's a good one as well.

and oh, if you like the hot rats band, you should definitely check out the pure food and drug act. sugarcane with the fantastic harvey mandel on lead guitar. the record of theirs i keep coming back to is a live recording from pasadena '71, super stretched out jamming, but for more concise stuff there's a live set of theirs released in '72 as "choice cuts" - i should probably give it another listen!

wow these recommendations are exactly why i post here, thanks y'all

YCDTOSA vol. 2 is great, but the whole "Echidna's Arf" medley is too damn fast compared to Roxy & Elsewhere, which is pretty much my favorite chunk of Zappa.

Definitely gonna check out that Wazoo live release.

and oh, if you like the hot rats band, you should definitely check out the pure food and drug act. sugarcane with the fantastic harvey mandel on lead guitar. the record of theirs i keep coming back to is a live recording from pasadena '71, super stretched out jamming, but for more concise stuff there's a live set of theirs released in '72 as "choice cuts" - i should probably give it another listen!

― Kate (rushomancy), Thursday, August 20, 2020 9:48 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

ooh awesome i picked up a copy of cristo redentor by mandel this year, what a great record.

also came up in the van halen book i just read as the guy eddie picked up two-handed tapping from. (him and george lynch from dokken go see mandel in the mid 70s and it turns both their heads around)

yeah, thanks for the live wazoo tip, Kate. i haven't listened to Läther in a very long time, but recall thinking Greggery Peccary was the best thing on that release

it's particularly nice for those of you who might not be too fond of zappa's comedy vocals, being an instrumental. (as an early version, there's one part on the release that isn't performed on this version - that piece already existed, though, and appears as "Some Ballet Music" on the beat the boots release "The Ark".)

Listening to Wazoo now and yeah, it's pretty great. (As an aside, I wrote about the Hot Rats box back in February.)

One thing I like about YCDTOSAv2 is the relatively low "comedy" quotient -- just skip "Room Service" and the rest is gold.

Harvey Mandel is teh shit, I recommend all his 60s, 70s albums..

Live Zappa wise,I like shut up and play your guitar

This live “Dupree’s Paradise” from 1973 is sick:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qr6mTloYJJs

yeah Mandel was an early tapper, he does a lot of really cool things with sustain and stuff

Any Zappa alum in the current Dweezil band?

The advertising didn’t say.

Listening to first disc of ‘Shut Up and Play yer Guitar’ last week, it occurred to me if Autechre was a prog rawk band it would probably sound something like this. There is not a straight beat on that whole record.

I was also watching one of those videos on the tube going over Zappa’s chord progressions and the time signature madness in some of those tunes, is pretty wild.