King Crimson: Classic Or Dud

will buy

more interested in this news further down tbh:

The band will be playing more classic repertoire, some of it for the first time in the UK, from In The Court Of The Crimson King, In The Wake Of Poseidon, Islands, Larks’ Tongues In Aspic, Starless And Bible Black and Red

super stoked for these shows now

I got into Yes like a year ago for the first time ever, and now I am getting pulled big time into KC. I hope I can find another record of theirs I like as much as Red....holy SHIT!

Go immediately backwards from Red - Starless and Bible Black, Larks' Tongues in Aspic - and I also recommend the Great Deceiver, USA, and The Nightwatch live albums.

I came to them through In The Wake Of Poseidon, which is an unlikely intro considering many consider it to be a re-write of In The Court Of The Crimson King. I was only about 18 at the time and I'd never really heard of prog rock before, but to me it sounded like everything I liked about the Beatles but amplified. It's still a fave.

I'm deliberately holding off on Belew-era because I find him annoying as s-hit, although a lot of people seem to prefer "New Wave" King Crimson

Go immediately backwards from Red - Starless and Bible Black, Larks' Tongues in Aspic - and I also recommend the Great Deceiver, USA, and The Nightwatch live albums.

― the top man in the language department (誤訳侮辱), Friday, August 7, 2015 9:16 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I meant to say thank you, top man!

The Belew/new wave stuff is great but a totally different beast. I haven't really explored enough of it. Foudn some of the 90s stuff very changeable. I think I heard a bit of Thrak once and was surprised at how AOR some of it sounded.

I got into Yes like a year ago for the first time ever, and now I am getting pulled big time into KC. I hope I can find another record of theirs I like as much as Red....holy SHIT!

― Iago Galdston, Friday, August 7, 2015 1:15 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Red certainly sets the bar. But all of the above recommendations are otm. I'm one of those who thinks KC's best albums (Red, LTIA, ITCOTCK, and Discipline) are peaks of human achievement, though.

Don't fear the Belew era - those three records are GREAT. Try the instrumentals first if Belew scares you ff (I'm assuming you mean his singing). Also, a good gateway into this stuff is the live 2xCD Absent Lovers, which cherry picks the best stuff and features some outstanding performances. Ditto the Neal and Jack and Me DVD.

I began to understand Belew more when I read that when he first started playing guitar, he didn't know what effects pedals were, so he just assumed every sound he heard a guitar player make was somehow done with the player's hands, and so he tried to do that. Listening through that lens turned me from an appreciator to a big fan.

That said, I will concede the vocals on "Elephant Talk" never fail to grate, even after 100 listens.

Oh, and my love for Yes hinges on the fact that the only albums I know well are Close To The Edge, Fragile, and Chris Squire's solo album. If that was Yes' entire discography, they'd be one of my all time favorite bands. Most everything else I've heard has either been just ok (Drama, 90215, Relayer) or unlistenable (Topographic Oceans, Tormato, etc etc etc).

Do you like VDGG? If you feel a prog kick coming on, I'd listen to those records before any Yes (or Genesis, or Tull, or...). Incredible, mind-shattering music.

Iago, I consider Larks' Tongues to be neck and neck with Red as kc's best. Forced against the wall I might choose larks. Maybe.

I began to understand Belew more when I read that when he first started playing guitar, he didn't know what effects pedals were, so he just assumed every sound he heard a guitar player make was somehow done with the player's hands, and so he tried to do that.

There's a great story of him trying out for Bowie's band, and him trying to replicate all the guitars in "Heroes" by himself. Bowie and Eno were apparently cracking up in the control room.

Belew-fearful, start with this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTVfKEltWns

Or maybe:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWyJfdob0a4&list=PLSxRK4Dk6d971J9IFjFB7kHM0FhnqjXP6

Or even this version, which is nuts to watch:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZ758xfIK4I

I read some interview with Belew where he said he used to try out alternate tunings in just single strings just to keep things interesting. Like tuning his B string to a C or something.

Or maybe it's EADG#BE?

Iago, I consider Larks' Tongues to be neck and neck with Red as kc's best. Forced against the wall I might choose larks. Maybe.

― Corn on the macabre (Jon not Jon), Friday, August 7, 2015 4:29 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^^^ this, right down to the "maybe" part. Like the Velvet Underground's first four LPs, whichever of these two I am listening to at the time is my favorite.

Have considered a Larks' Tongues tattoo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRch-u3QcxY

Somehow I missed out on the Complete Lark's Recordings Box

Oh, and my love for Yes hinges on the fact that the only albums I know well are Close To The Edge, Fragile, and Chris Squire's solo album. If that was Yes' entire discography, they'd be one of my all time favorite bands. Most everything else I've heard has either been just ok (Drama, 90215, Relayer) or unlistenable (Topographic Oceans, Tormato, etc etc etc).

Do you like VDGG? If you feel a prog kick coming on, I'd listen to those records before any Yes (or Genesis, or Tull, or...). Incredible, mind-shattering music.

― Wimmels, Friday, August 7, 2015 11:52 AM (Yesterday) Bookmark

Thanks, Wimmels and everyone else, for the responses. Wimmels, you don't like The Yes Album? I'm getting into Larks now...KC is going to be a major obsession with me, I can tell already.

Although I must say the first line of Great Deceiver is not so funny!

Hate that line

palmer-james hasn't aged well, whereas Sinfeld's hippy phantasies seem removed from time altogether

King Crimson offer a particularly good argument for ignoring lyrics.

it takes discipline

Wimmels, you don't like The Yes Album?

iirc I liked it fine. But, hits aside, I just never got very familiar with it, and nothing about it made me want to. A lot of it just seemed like a warmup for the awesomeness to come later that year. Truth be told, though, I should go back to it. I might like it more now. iirc it was the first album with Steve Howe, right?

It's funny, I'm always bracing myself for the "other", reputely lesser Yes albums being kinda crap but I always end up being really impressed by them (still lots of 80s-90s albums to get).

I wouldn't say "lots"...

Not really looking forward to the Thrak set ... some good moments to be sure, but I feel like there was altogether too much digital FX mucking about during that era. Thought on their latest American tour that they dialed it back considerably, which may have been aided by Collins' presence.

"It's funny, I'm always bracing myself for the "other", reputely lesser Yes albums being kinda crap but I always end up being really impressed by them (still lots of 80s-90s albums to get)."

well you will be disappointed by those. I don't think any albums they did after 90125 were across the board good until Fly From Here. There are some individual tracks here and there and entire albums that should be deleted from the universe.

Sorry I overlooked answering your question about VDGG, Wimmels. I have never heard a note of them!

VDGG are amazing but early solo Peter Hammmill is just as important if not more.

7 Yes albums is kind of a lot to me.

looks like Crim will be selling a ghastly looking picture disc 12" EP for this slate of shows. No word content.

It's too bad Fripp has stopped updating his online diary -- I'd love to see his reasons for being willing to go back to older material after many many years of refusal.

My guess:

His advanced years have provided some measure of wisdom and perspective absent from his youth and middle age. In addition, while he has rarely indulged the instinct to please the fans with older music in concert, I think the exercise of not simply remastering these records but remixing them with Steven Wilson has likely given him a vantage hitherto unexplored. Lastly, I think he playing with Mel Collins played a big part in it.

It = revisiting older material.

There's some good stuff on the DGM youtube channel as to why -- basically, he's no longer paying bad guys when he plays those songs, and they are songs that they can play as if for the first time every time.

My guess:

Promoters offer more money if you agree to play back catalogue.

Their UK tour started last night -- anybody see them in Cardiff?

Anyone else catch the European shows? I saw them in Paris and was like wow.

Caught the last show of the tour in Utrecht. First time KC for me. I only know and own Red and am familiar with the debut so am not very knowledgeable but found the show very impressive. Thought the music was a bit too dense at some points but there were also moments where having three drummers really was of additional 'value'. "Starless" was amaaazing, though I expected nothing less. First gig I attended in a long while where I was part of the younger half of the audience ;)

'Red' is 41 years old today, Oct. 6

Happy Halloween! This is an awesome mask idea.

http://pix.avaxnews.com/avaxnews/42/2c/00022c42_medium.jpeg

Thinking about taking up tenor sax just because of Crimson. So inspiring.

Back to Europe next September, 12 dates.
http://www.dgmlive.com/news.htm?entry=5372

"Cadence and Cascade" is one of my favorite songs ever.

Curious lack of reports from the 2015 dates - anybody see them this year or have any thoughts on the new material?

Just wondering if not picking up the KCCC 46 Live at the Marquee 10th August 1971 was a mistake or not. It was one of the cds that were in HMV before it closed down for good yesterday.

Or to expand on that what volumes of that KCCC series are thought of as essential. I'm far more interested in the early 70s stuff than the 80s reunion.

71 is the islands/"earthbound" band, so you should base it on how much you like that group. most '70s people (myself included) for the 8/72 through 7/74 lineup with cross, bruford, wetton (and muir on '72 dates); the zurich, central park, and zoom club concerts are all very good, with the best quality being zurich (the source for "the mincer" on starless and bible black, with an audience patch). but ultimately the great deceiver box set is still the best statement on the era...

yeah I love that incarnation of the group but 4 discs of live material spanning less than two years is about the limit

all the KCCC content, reworking of past material, and Fripp diary entries are just distracting them from working on a new album, imo

i used to feel this way but then realized king crimson hadn't done anything i really like since around 1981, so i'm ok with them just going on tour and playing "starless" and "schizoid man" until fripp dies.