IT'S BETTER THAN DRINKIN' ALONE: The Official ILM Track-by-Track BILLY JOEL Listening Thread

"piano mansplaining" = lol

(Sidenote: does he always and everywhere pronounce "piano" with two syllables?

Pyanno. Very pointedly not peeyanno. I guess that it is correct for Italian, and many classically trained people seem to say it that way.

I listened to this song earlier today and I'm already not really sure how it does

Yeah, this isn't making too much of an impression on me. The tune keeps almost sounding like something I know but I can't place what. The more operatic/musical-theater singing is probably the main distinction between this and a Cold Spring Harbor track... Ironically this might be one case where the more wistful "lonely guy singin baout things" delivery might have helped him - the bombast here feels a little outsized for this pedestrian ballad, makes it seem like a more forced reach.

Is that really a Long Island accent? He sounds like Anthony Newley on about 50% of this tune

Leading us toward the album's conclusion, Somewhere Along The Line is another hangover song, this time in the first person. I'm on a phone and not sure anything will embed right so I'll just link the clip.

The song was evidently a live staple - you can find lots of rockin' versions, like this one from 1978. I have to assume it was in the running for Songs in the Attic, where it would have fit in nicely.

(for posterity's sake)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEYZzFX_rR0

This is replacement level Billy Joel. Could see it sub in for later better tunes and still be a recognizable Billy song. Might even take folks a verse or so before they realized they'd never heard it before.

"If I Only Had the Words (To Tell You)": so plodding, melody is a little awkward. the bridge is nice though

"Somewhere Along the Line": I like the organ touches and bursts of vocals, makes an otherwise standard song a bit more interesting

organ touches

If I Only Had The Words - it's like he took a halfway decent melody & just dumped in a bunch of platitudes to make it a song. It's all just so amorphous & beige, the big build doesn't pay off bcz no-one cares!

Somewhere Along The Line - same kinda thing. Feels more like an advertising jingle (or a Manilow song lol). Is that first verse about pooping? It's about pooping, isn't it. :(

it's like he took a halfway decent melody & just dumped in a bunch of platitudes to make it a song

potential new thread title and/or board description.

Is that first verse about pooping? It's about pooping, isn't it

i'm pretty sure the whole song is about how everything leads to pooping. the more fun you have, the more you will poop. also, the more likely it is that you will turn into an oompah band before you get to the end of your song.

everybody poops somewhere along the line

and captain jack will make you poop tonight

Nice melody hooked to generic tune, lyric, and structure.

generic, but also relentlessly pessimistic. it's like he's trying to say "i know there's gonna be hell to pay, but at least i had me a good time" but instead it comes out like "i might have had an ok time, but what was the point?"

doin a poop, i'm the piano man

"if i only had the words (to tell you)" - this is basically only verse, augmented verse, and bridge, which gives it the temporally endless quality of torture

"somewhere along the line" - holy shit the opening riff of this sounds so similar to the counting crows song "if i could give all my love" which itself is a band ripoff. counting crows song is better, but this is still p good boilerplate imo

Closing out Piano Man is the song that got him the record deal - a little ditty about suburban anomie, immaturity, and depending who you ask, heroin, booze or masturbation. It is, of course, Captain Jack.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koft_Yschnc

For reference, here's the 4/15/72 WMMR performance that became a regional radio-request hit and won Joel his career; there's also some intro chatter if you're curious. A 1980 performance, again in Philadelphia - Joel had apparently mostly retired the song except when passing through the area - would appear on Songs in the Attic.

And that's another album done! I may be running around tomorrow around the right time for the next post, so maybe this is also a good time to pause and take a moment to listen back to Piano Man as a whole and see how it hangs together as either a pseudo-debut, or a sophomore solo effort. I'm totally enjoying this little journey and stoked at how much participation we've had on this thread so far. Thanks, y'all!

ahhhhhhhh yes

i fucking love Captain Jack!!!

i love the lyrics & phrasing & imagery
languid verse suddenly crescendoing into that huge chorus then back into quiet languid verses is so perfect to me

the way he does those "ahhhhhh but"'s really gets me

interestingly, Cap wasn't on my Mum's cassette copy of Greatest Hits vI&II. It wasn't til about 17 years ago when I finally got my own cd copy of GHVI&II that I first heard it.

i didnt even know any of the mythology or anything until later

i really like the story of everyone calling & asking for it and turning it into a hit, adds to the appeal imo

plus the cynicism & wry humor is definitely what i regard as Billy's wheelhouse & this is kinda his rosetta stone for *that* particular tone imo, much more so than Piano Man which is v lightweight comparitively

ha, had the same experience with the GHVI&II cassette, and coming to this as a later-in-life song. but man talk about things that would have gone over my head as a kid. i wonder if my parents would have even let the tape pass as a continuous soundtrack if this was in there!

yeah idk if mum would have approved of captain jack getting you high tonight

as a kid i woud have liked the picking yr nose line tho

The song entered the news again in 2000 when it was mistakenly used during Hillary Clinton's announcement that she would be campaigning for U.S. Senate. According to an NPR report on worst campaign songs, a staffer notes that the playing of "Captain Jack" was a mistake. It was played from the Billy Joel compilation CD Greatest Hits Volume 1, and the song intended to be played was "New York State of Mind", which was track five on the CD.[23] The Clinton staffer inadvertently played track two, which was "Captain Jack".[23] Her presumed opponent, Rudolph Giuliani, who ended up not running for the Senate, criticized the song's use because of its alleged glorification of drugs. Giuliani even read the lyrics to the song in a live press conference.[23] Joel replied in a statement, "There are a lot of important issues facing the voters in this Senate race. Is a politician's interpretation of a song I wrote nearly 30 years ago an issue to the voters of New York state? I do not think so."[24]

loool

Staffer was probably like "pffft i love i Hil but imo fuck New York State of Mind let's get this party fkn STARTED"

some folks like to get away, take a holiday from the neighborhood
hop a flight to miami beach or to hollywood
but you just sit and home and masturbate
you're in a new york state of mind

(pretty much works, imo)

Pointless anecdote: some time ago, a friend of mine, X, called a radio station to request the 10,000 Maniacs song "Trouble Me," which is side 1, track 4 of the album Blind Man's Zoo.

More to the point, she asked to send it out as a dedication (remember those?) to a friend of hers, Z, who was going through a rough time. According to my friend, the radio station instead played the 10,000 Maniacs song "Eat for Two," which is side 1, track 1 of the album Blind Man's Zoo.

This was in a small and insular enough town that apparently, for weeks thereafter, people came up to Z saying "So, I hear you're pregnant."

"Captain Jack" is a weird song to get his career started. I mean, yes, catchy tune, but he also pronounces the word "masturbate" as elegantly as I've ever heard it

Not a bad album overall, huge improvement over the debut

Listening to the studio Captain Jack for the first time in a while - maybe the first time ever? It's a good performance and a wonderfully lush early 70s recording. Sounds great in headphones, even if a lot of the added details (all that organ!) don't necessarily benefit the song. The Songs in the Attic version, lived in for a few years and a little bit drunker and looser, just feels right to me.

Musically it's reminding me for the first time of "Levon" and there are enough similarities there that I almost wonder if Joel conceived of this as in some part an American answer to that, or a grim sequel: the merchant's dreamy-eyed son, now grown to young manhood and an empty shell, sailing on heroin instead of balloons to Venus. Anyway, a comparison between the two would capture a lot of the differences between Joel's and Taupin's lyrical sensibilities... and especially the influence of Dylan's "you're so dumb" mode. Of course, the emptiness and ugliness of the coming-of-age narrative are very much of the period (see: Last Picture Show, Midnight Cowboy); "there ain't no place to go anyway," and the casual availability of drugs that don't offer anything worthwhile are particularly post-60s. Like what do you do after the end of Easy Rider, especially if you never had much shot of being Captain America in the first place?

The most interesting moments are the ones where Joel isn't actively sneering at his subject, or where there's at least some ambiguity or space to get a glimpse of actual real life people Joel knew and was maybe even friends with. I like "and you guess you won't be going back to school, anymore" for not completely spelling out the logic: is he now trapped at home taking over the family business? Realizing he hated school and was only there under parental pressure? Is he about to have some kind of epiphany, or just fall into a stupor under the pernicious influence of the Captain? For me at least this is all more compelling than the "hey, check out this loser here" stuff.

Hearing this song makes me think about what Lou Reed must've thought of this guy. This Hicksville motherfucker talking about staring "at the junkies and the closet queens." The fuck does he know about the life? Did he learn that one in the Executive Room?

Or did he respect him as a songwriter, knowing that hey, he might not be as rock and roll as the rest of us, but he's got chops. Can't hate a Long Island boy for getting by, someone's gotta lead that front.

Can't find any quotes from Lou about Bill, but I did find this photo of those two, with Paul Simon and Bruce Springsteen in between, backing up Dion at MSG.

http://i.imgur.com/yzlQe9b.jpg

After another listen, I think what's really key in the SitA version is the added emphasis on the little PUSH! - there's a glee in Joel's delivery that rides the line between joining the protagonist in his release, and standing behind him, shoving him off a cliff. The raucous treatment of the chorus also takes us along for the ride of the high... it's a different revelry, with a bleaker backdrop, than the one that produced the various other hangovers on this record, but Joel still sells it as the good time the character is seeking. The presence of the crowd, if you can set aside eyerolls at the cheers for "pot," "high," "masturbate" etc., also helps.

I dunno about Lou Reed but I suddenly wonder if Bono ever listened to Billy Joel. There's some overlap in the swing-for-the-bleachers singing and the desire to produce crowd-pleasing anthems.

heh that Clinton staffer story is very Veep

i def owned and religiously listened to the first billy joel greatest hits collection and yet i remember nothing about "captain jack," which is p great

Which version of the comp did you have? (It wasn't on the cassette and LP releases.)

yeah i got the cassette version (1st cassette i ever owned!) when it came out in '85 and CJ was definitely not present. don't think i heard it until years later on late night classic rock radio

it didn't have Italian Restaurant or She's Got a Way, either

oh i guess that's why! i had the cassette

"Captain Jack" isn't entirely successful, but he's trying, and the melody's attractive. I don't think he understands his characters so much as wants points for noting they exist. It made my Joel best-of last month.

don't think I've ever heard this song before. weird how the verse barely has a melody at all, just this monotone delivery (which is v Lou Reed lol)

Hearing this song makes me think about what Lou Reed must've thought of this guy. This Hicksville motherfucker talking about staring "at the junkies and the closet queens." The fuck does he know about the life? Did he learn that one in the Executive Room?

Or did he respect him as a songwriter, knowing that hey, he might not be as rock and roll as the rest of us, but he's got chops. Can't hate a Long Island boy for getting by, someone's gotta lead that front.

this is an interesting question! Lou was often publicly contrarian in his tastes, I can see the latter being more likely esp given the shared Long Island heritage. I feel like when Lou went after other musicians in public it tended to be people who had personally spurned him (or that Lou had ditched)

Yeah love Captain Jack, def an oddball tune

"somewhere down the line" is pretty ok...

Piano Man the album definitely has an old school vinyl sequencing, coming out hard with an uptempo number, big hit either 2nd or 3rd, ending side 1 with a good one....Opening side 2 with a "rocker" (in relative Billy Joel terms, burying some clunkers at the middle of side 2, then ending strong with another big tune

Sounds great in headphones, even if a lot of the added details (all that organ!)

never noticed that during the chorus, is cool!

also back to the point of session guys & songwriting, Captain Jack has a perfect example of something that session dudes have often been screwed out of, here that massive sounding "dun-dundundun-duuuun-duuuuun-dun" guitar riff that goes underneath the chorus...so great, and that's the type of little touches that often wrecking crew type players would just start playing and do during the session, but the way songwriting has always works it's like the chord changes and lyrics and vocal melodies are "songwriting"

OTM, I was paying attention to that chorus guitar part during my listening earlier and it is key imho.

I'd nominate Doctor Casino for Best Music Writing 2017 (if that was still a thing) on the basis of his contributions to this thread if I could. Notably, this:

The most interesting moments are the ones where Joel isn't actively sneering at his subject, or where there's at least some ambiguity or space to get a glimpse of actual real life people Joel knew and was maybe even friends with. I like "and you guess you won't be going back to school, anymore" for not completely spelling out the logic: is he now trapped at home taking over the family business? Realizing he hated school and was only there under parental pressure? Is he about to have some kind of epiphany, or just fall into a stupor under the pernicious influence of the Captain? For me at least this is all more compelling than the "hey, check out this loser here" stuff.

Yes, yes and yes! I hear no condescension here, but rather a lived-in empathy. True, the song is notable (particularly for those coming to it after knowing Billy's later work) for the ugliness of its subject matter--I hear it as a suburbanized take on a Lou Reed anthem or an R. Crumb sketch--but it deserves more credit for being vividly drawn and beautifully paced: I love the way that the guitar revs up each time the chorus hits. I used to think the carnival flourishes were a bit much, but even they've grown on me.

Oh, and I also first encountered this song via the CD pressing of GH, which my parents had owned on cassette when I was a kid and which had a frequent home in my dad's car during family trips. I got a CD for myself when I was about 15 and, not even paying attention to the different track listing when I first played it, I was a definitely shocked when "Piano Man" led into "Captain Jack," first by the surprise of *not* hearing "Say Goodbye to Hollywood" next, and then by the rather scuzzy tale that unfurled (this was probably a year or so before Green Day's breakthrough, so "Darling Nikki" aside, hearing the word "masturbate" in a song was still novel).

Anyway, I love this song. Screw "Piano Man;" "Captain Jack" is Billy's first classic.

Hearing this song makes me think about what Lou Reed must've thought of this guy. This Hicksville motherfucker talking about staring "at the junkies and the closet queens." The fuck does he know about the life? Did he learn that one in the Executive Room?

i'd hope lou would be smart enough to realize this song isn't about junkies and closet queens. it's a vivid portrait of suburban ennui, which this hicksville motherfucker knows about because he's a hicksville motherfucker. it's a theme he'll come back to repeatedly. and as a suburban motherfucker myself, this song resonated deeply when i was growing up, even if i didn't recognize the exact characters and even if i wouldn't have recognized heroin if someone had put it in a needle and stuck it in my arm.

(side note on billy and lou: not a clue what either of them knew about the other, but they had a shared, unabashed love of doo-wop. the photo of them with dion above is both of them in their element. i'd imagine lou might appreciate billy circa "an innocent man." or maybe he thought he's a suburban pop motherfucker with nothing to offer, i don't know.)

for a monotone-ish song, there's a lot of cool musical detail here. i love the major 7ths, with occasional substitutions that keep things dark and surprising. the piano runs in the middle of each verse are the beginnings of another billy template that he'd come back to again and again. the buildups to the chorus somehow manage to sound big and new every time.

maybe his first great vocal performance, too.

I'd nominate Doctor Casino for Best Music Writing 2017

seconded

thirded

awwww you all are too fabulous and far too kind but thank you :D