You think? I think it's pretty well organized and accessible!
― Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 6 October 2020 19:59 (three years ago) link
idk Politics Of Time and Ballot Result and all the weird singles and EPs do kind of confuse the straightforward Punch Line - Start Fires - Double Nickels - 3-Way-Tie narrative
― sleeve, Tuesday, 6 October 2020 20:01 (three years ago) link
It's accessible, but all the EPs and comps and singles felt really baffling when I first dove in.
― soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 6 October 2020 20:03 (three years ago) link
lol xp
― sleeve, Tuesday, 6 October 2020 20:06 (three years ago) link
most of the warners era b-sides are not all that (although i do have a soft spot for 'all work and no play'), but i always thought this song was amazing, sounds like it could have been off 'torch of the mystics' or something:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1OJo0oEf9gHusker Du - Fattie
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 00:32 (three years ago) link
incredible, never even heard of that, thanks!
― sleeve, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 00:34 (three years ago) link
neverending drone and those waves of sound, so good!
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 00:38 (three years ago) link
Love that!
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 10:13 (three years ago) link
all the EPs and comps and singles felt really baffling when I first dove in
That's why the Post-Mersh series was such a gift; all the various EPs, plus one of their albums, on one CD.
https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71qa5jZckAL.jpg
― but also fuck you (unperson), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 10:59 (three years ago) link
So baffling pre-internet circa early 90s walking into a record shop and being like "I want to get into Minutemen, what's the best intro?", though (which is why my first was the not-very-satisfying 3-Way-Tie)
― comorbidities in the BK lounge (stevie), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 12:37 (three years ago) link
Yeah, I had the albums but I usually kept the Post-Mersh collections in the car. Are they out of print?
― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 12:50 (three years ago) link
I think I posted this in the Savage Young Du thread but I ended up running into Terry Katzman at a bar before he passed and he said there's no way the SST reissues happen
They tried to get the masters from Ginn with the same lawyers who handles Meat Puppets and Dino, but apparently there was some particularly onerous details in their contact even worse than the others
He said obviously at a certain point money can make anything go away but didn't get the sense Mould (the only one with serious dough) wanted to spend that much when he's got his solo career
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 13:05 (three years ago) link
The way Grant put it to others (and, once, to me) was that Mould used that as leverage. That is, he was all for working that stuff out but he wanted a much bigger share of the rights in return, which Grant was not willing to give up. In the end it's all just a matter of will. I remember interviewing Dean Wareham once, years ago, and asking about the (then) out of print Galaxie 500 albums being stuck in legal limbo or whatever, and his response was essentially, um, no, I've got the masters, it was just a matter of getting around to re-releasing them.
― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 13:10 (three years ago) link
The Post-Mersh comps were my introduction to the Minutemen, though there is also a 1998 comp called Introducing the Minutemen; I don’t own it so so idea if it keeps as much context as the others.
― wronger than 100 geir posts (MacDara), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 13:24 (three years ago) link
Where's the Savage Young Du thread?
― comorbidities in the BK lounge (stevie), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 13:31 (three years ago) link
At this point I’m more at peace with the way the SST stuff sounds - I do think they are the worst sounding of the big bands at the label - but there’s a charm there I guess coupled with the whole limitations as aesthetic thing
I don’t see why something couldn’t be done for the Warners stuff; they sound awful for what were their big major label statements and sonically, I’m often left wondering - why even make the leap to WB? There were plenty of albums on independent labels in that 86/87 period that sound better than those two
― Master of Treacle, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 14:15 (three years ago) link
the perfect Minutemen intro is actually the cassette-only release My First Bells, forgot about that one!
https://www.discogs.com/Minutemen-My-First-Bells-1980-83/release/1043613
ums that's a bummer abt that Katzman story, but vmic for Ginn unfortunately
― sleeve, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 14:17 (three years ago) link
NickB, great post. I'd never heard that b-side.
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 15:36 (three years ago) link
glad you like it! i love it when they do that more textural stuff
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 16:43 (three years ago) link
I sincerely appreciated your replies a few months ago when I was fishing around for info on the proto-"Isn't Anything" vibes on the bridge of "No Reservations".
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 16:45 (three years ago) link
ah, that's nice of you to say so! :)
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 16:51 (three years ago) link
going back to terry katzman, does anyone have any thoughts or feelings about the rest of the reflex records catalogue?
Hüsker Dü - Statues (7") Reflex A, 1981 Various - Barefoot And Pregnant (Cass, Comp) Reflex B, 1982 Various - Kitten Kompilation (Cass, Comp) Reflex C, 1982 Hüsker Dü - Everything Falls Apart (12") REFLEX D, 1983 Rifle Sport - Voice Of Reason (LP, Album) Reflex E, 1983 Man Sized Action- Claustrophobia (LP) Reflex F, 1983 Final Conflict - Final Conflict (7") REFLEX G, 1983Hüsker Dü - Metal Circus (EP) REFLEX G, 1983 Otto's Chemical Lounge - Otto's Chemical Lounge (7", EP) REFLEX H, 1983Ground Zero - Ground Zero (LP, Album) Reflex I, 1984Articles Of Faith - Give Thanks (Album) REFLEX J, 1984Man Sized Action - Five Story Garage (LP) Reflex K, 1984Minutemen - "Tour-Spiel" EP (7", EP) REFLEX L, 1985Ground Zero - Pink (Album) REFLEX M, 1985
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 16:52 (three years ago) link
Give Thanks (and all earlier AOF) totally fucking rules, haven't heard any of the others
― sleeve, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 16:53 (three years ago) link
not really intimately familiar with any of those bands. i did buy a live rifle sport records many years ago, but couldn't really get into it. i know of man sized action because one of the guys in them went on to a band called dragnet who i really like. also future slint producer brian paulson was in them
xp gonna check that one
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 16:55 (three years ago) link
avoid any post-1985 AOF and you'll be fine :)
seriously, their early stuff (that was remixed and remastered for the Core release, also partly available on vinyl reissues w/original mixes) is some of my alltime favorite Midwestern USHC which is saying a lot
― sleeve, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 16:57 (three years ago) link
Speaking of Katzman I was once talking to him about Husker and I repeated the old saw abt "well the records don't sound great" and he looked me dead in the eye and said "those records sound EXACTLY how they wanted them to sound"
The second Man Sized Action record is way better than the first
― chr1sb3singer, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 17:11 (three years ago) link
haha yes I remember you saying that earlier in one of these threads re: Husker sound
― sleeve, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 17:17 (three years ago) link
Various - Barefoot And Pregnant (Cass, Comp) Reflex B, 1982
the copy I heard of this was pretty bad sound quality, think this is mostly demos/live stuff of hardcore bands (unless the copy was just bad) - like one of the Loud Fast Rules songs on it though
Final Conflict - Final Conflict (7") REFLEX G, 1983
I like this, I've got a reissue of this single. iirc Bob Mould produced it? decent hardcore punk. there was another band called Final Conflict from California (who I also like) but this isn't them, this band was from Minnesota.
Minutemen - "Tour-Spiel" EP (7", EP) REFLEX L, 1985
this is a bit throw-away, it's all live covers, it's on that Post Mersh Vol 3 CD
also agree with sleeve about that Article of Faith record (I haven't actually heard any post-1985 AoF)
― CP Radio Gorgeous (Colonel Poo), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 17:23 (three years ago) link
AOF's In This Life LP (1986) is basically post-Rites Of Spring proto-emo, fwiw
not bad, just a different beast entirely
― sleeve, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 17:25 (three years ago) link
Man sized action is great!
― Boring, Maryland, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 17:28 (three years ago) link
ah I've actually got that but I thought it was 1985 (it's on a CD called Complete 1983-85)
I like it tbh. but yeah the earlier stuff is better
xp
― CP Radio Gorgeous (Colonel Poo), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 17:29 (three years ago) link
I repeated the old saw abt "well the records don't sound great" and he looked me dead in the eye and said "those records sound EXACTLY how they wanted them to sound"
I think that's totally right, btw. The aesthetic of HD is, as Ken Stringfellow described it, "paper drums and shredded paper voice". I remember arguing with an old editor re: DH vs Sugar, and she said she hated Sugar because of the conventional rhythm section, and that Grant's percussion served as an antidote to ploddy rock machismo. The WEA albums especially sound, I'd reckon, exactly how they're supposed to sound - though again I'd argue the SST CDs would sound better if they were more akin to how the SST vinyl sounds.
― comorbidities in the BK lounge (stevie), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 18:48 (three years ago) link
See also: And Justice for All, which got remastered last year or so and everyone was all "finally some low end!" and the band basically said, um, it sounds that way because we wanted it to sound like that.
― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 18:52 (three years ago) link
Yeah tbh I love AJFA's hissy attack. IT DOESN'T NEED BASS.
― comorbidities in the BK lounge (stevie), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 18:53 (three years ago) link
They ended up touring fairly extensively behind Diver Down: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hide_Your_Sheep_Tour
According to that setlist info, they even previewed some 1984 album tracks during those shows.
― "...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 19:28 (three years ago) link
lol
― sleeve, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 19:29 (three years ago) link
Oh wow. Oops.
― "...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 19:34 (three years ago) link
Husker Du: HIDE YOUR SHEEP
― "...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 19:36 (three years ago) link
This is 2541, you need 5150 a few blocks up the road
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 19:39 (three years ago) link
LOLZ
While I'm here tho, I had always partially chalked up the shittiness of the WB Husker's CDs to how poor CD mastering still could be in the late '80s. My vinyl Warehouse has a slightly thicker sound than the CD.
― "...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 19:41 (three years ago) link
haw, nick
― pplains, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 20:36 (three years ago) link
Now I’m fantasizing about what a current day reunion of Van Halen with Bob Mould taking on guitar duties would sound like.
― rattle, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 20:48 (three years ago) link
It would be ... stunning.
― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 7 October 2020 20:54 (three years ago) link
He'd make them cover "Love Is All Around".
― "...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 21:14 (three years ago) link
Especially if Greg's in on bass too with his trademark "Klipp" sound.
xpost
― your response will be deleted unread (Matt #2), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 21:15 (three years ago) link
similar to Barefoot and Pregnant is the Minneapolis hardcore comp Kitten, features the Rifle Sport (Todd Trainer from Shellac was the drummer)https://www.discogs.com/Various-Kitten-A-Compilation/release/3039425
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 21:33 (three years ago) link
Haha, proud crass fools = loud fast rules
Also I had no idea until just now that Tom Hazelmeyer was in Otto's Chemical Lounge who i still haven't ever listened to
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 21:40 (three years ago) link
What are the good records for rifle sport ums?
― kites aren't fun (NickB), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 21:43 (three years ago) link
Huskers opened this show
http://www.thirdav.com/zinestuff/sv19.html
...with that "Fattie" track playing as they came out and plugged in. I was buying everything by them at that point, loved that EP. I can see my friend Mike in that pic.
― Julius Caesar Memento Hoodie (bendy), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 21:52 (three years ago) link
Todd also played (drums/guitar/vox) as a member of Breaking Circus in parallel with his tenure in Rifle Sport.
― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Wednesday, 7 October 2020 22:00 (three years ago) link