Grimes/Claire Boucher thread

That Avengers scene where Hawkeye and Black Widow are fighting to throw themselves off a cliff, except it's Elon Musk and Grimes and the cliff is Nazism

— Michael Stewart (@m_r_stewart) April 14, 2023

Why is she a white supremacist now? The fuck?

Trite response but seriously. It is very odd that both kanye and grimes became hitler apologists

I still love this song, without reservation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yji6m9R75jQ

I try to just forget that she continued on after ‘15 or so

(And, no, I hadn’t seen what this thread revive was about)

sigh

She is a very gifted musician but clearly a person of poor character.

realiti (demo) so much better than anything else post visions

Still don’t see what’s so great about that song

“Oblivion” was my jam… I’ve never really gotten the “Realiti” love either.

(to each their own, of course)

Flesh without blood, from art angels, is her best song imo. I love the ethereal gothic early sound but I also like the hyperpop that succeeded it. I dislike how her personality and beliefs seem to have changed since art angels though.

even as a huge fan of miss anthropocene imo she was always like this sorry

I guess I didn’t follow her enough to know she’d be the type to retweet neo-nazis

Never thought her music suffered any drop in quality even as she herself perhaps did. Miss anthropocene wasn't quite as good as art angels or visions but not too far off, it bears repeat listening for me.

The Reddit post seems to have been removed. I glanced at her account, it looks like mainly AI shit. Not that I would necessarily recognize crypto-N4zi stuff if I saw it but… are we sure this is legit accusation?

(I believe it if you say yes, I didn’t delve into who she’s following or anything)

I don't like the idea that she irl hangs mostly with the worst kind of online shitposters but maybe it's true idk. Her trajectory hasn't been inspiring from a distance.

she’s just like a complete woo-woo ass person who would align herself with whatever since whenever, idk what else to tell you

Art-pop Joe Rogan

Brad nailed it.

Earlier on it was easier to ignore the extra-curricular stuff though, for reasons too voluminous to recount

difference is she used to be embarrassing in a somewhat endearing way (the houseboat story, constantly saying ridiculous stuff in interviews etc.) and at least positioned herself as fairly progressive (despite the techno-libertarian thread that was always there - she was always the sort of idiot who'd be super into cryptocurrency). her trajectory isn't that surprising given the techno-libertarian stuff but it's still quite a shift to be hanging out with crypto-fascist rationalists, thiel-funded neo-nazis etc. now.

she seems to have largely lost interest in music though (lol at her releasing only two songs on columbia), i doubt she'll get around to actually finishing another album anytime soon

In December 2022, Grimes attended a holiday fundraising party for the San Francisco political think tank and magazine Palladium, which was founded by the Neo Nazi activist Jonah Bennett. Palladium receives much of its capital investment from Peter Thiel, whose Hereticon “free speech” conservative conference (a haven for hate speech) Grimes had also previously done a private DJ set for, in January 2022. Grimes publicly tweeted about her participation in both Hereticon and the Palladium party, so it has been confirmed from the horse’s mouth. Also, there were many pictures of her at the Palladium party shared by the editors of Palladium and then retweeted by Grimes. These pictures show Grimes together with her own friends who also attended, and some show the magazine’s current editors (not Bennett, but close associates of him, most notably Wolf Tivy) who she frequently interacted with on twitter in the weeks after the party (they were also mutuals). Jonah Bennett himself also appears to have attended the party, despite not being pictured together with Grimes, as he retweeted one of the other Palladium editors’ tweet celebrating the importance of Grimes attending the party and showing how far Palladium has come to gain such a prominent artist’s support.
One of Grimes’s tweets was also celebrating these guys as being part of what she tone deafly called a “schizzo (sic) posting” club, suggesting she was also a “schizzo poster” herself on her alt twitter accounts. On her main account, despite all the cringe, she rarely tweets anything directly inflammatory or redpilled, except that time she tweeted a “joke” about lebensraum on Holocaust Remembrance Day, but sometimes (accidentally?) she has used her public account to like others’ tweets of a hateful nature. One of the accounts whose tweets she liked most frequently is called The Hellenist, which she also follows. Hellenist is a straight up racist and fascist account, which tweets about the penis size of different races and how Ancient Rome met its downfall because it made the mistake of “following the Jews” in Hellenist’s eyes (ancient Greece, apparently, did not—whatever that even means). The identity of the account is unknown (if I had to take a guess, one of her irl close acquaintances, or possibly even Elon Musk or Jonah Bennett) but some of her out in the open friends, including the squad of besties she’s had over the past couple of years—Aella, Lan Dao and Liv Boeree—also tweet redpilled content and content promoting big business and conservative forms of religion, opposing Black rights and struggles, opposing LGBTQ rights and even opposing feminism and endorsing patriarchy, a total inversion of what used to be Grimes’ signature public issue.
Grimes has also been exploring eugenics. The celebrity eugenics couple from Connecticut, the Collinses, had an extensive interview with Business Insider last year. The piece painted an incredibly disturbing picture of what the Collinses are all about, but it stuck to facts and didn’t editorialize, earning the praise of the Collinses themselves, who called the article very accurate. This is relevant to Grimes because she receives a mention in the article—the Collinses tell the journalist that Grimes reached out to their group seeking to get involved in the cause of eugenics. Grimes nor the Collinses did not ever deny that this occurred. It also fits with some of her own public statements supporting “the Mission.” The Mission is a cult created by Elon Musk with a mission of breeding a superior race of humans on Mars. Grimes, although no longer involved romantically with Musk, recently said promoting the Mission is now her main purpose in life, describing music as a mere “side quest.”

This is a comment on the popheads subreddit. No receipts but some of these claims are easily googleable and true

https://www.reddit.com/r/popheads/comments/12yyuey/grimes_splits_with_columbia_records/

The nepo babies she’s friends with nowadays and who she interacts with both live and in twitter do seem to post some very questionable content in twitter.

If it walks like a duck…

She has proved time and time again that she’s super shallow and volatile when it comes to her views and unfortunately she loves expressing it. Good musician/producer but the more spotlight she gets the less likeable she becomes and that’s been true for over a decade. Hanging out with the shittiest, uncoolest elite doesn’t help her case.

Not mentioned on that post is that she continues to follow, hang out with and enable sexual abuser Nusi Quero, she never issued a response or apology about that whole ordeal… just a super insincere post about having to “reflex on the scandal” and promising an update which never came.

I feel ashamed of being a fan of her music nowadays. Her output pre-2015 was brilliant and it was easy to look beyond her often obnoxious, “quirky” personality because in the end it was a bit cringeworthy but mostly harmless.

No wonder Elon is so desperate to get her back

Her trajectory from largely non-political techno utopianism to harshly right wing, explicity anti-egalitarian techno authoritarianism — with “singularity” overtones — might be worth understanding. To me the way she was “woo woo” pre-2015 did not lead me to believe she would embrace anti-egalitarian, eugenicist, whatever ideas. But this is not a unique slope.

And it seems sort of different than the pipeline that is like hippy/“back to nature” to anti-vax reactionary thought. I’m familiar with that pipeline, this one feels more ominous, more authoritarian.

Also like musk is part of it. He wants to breed a race of supermen on mars.

The Mission is a cult created by Elon Musk with a mission of breeding a superior race of humans on Mars. Grimes, although no longer involved romantically with Musk, recently said promoting the Mission is now her main purpose in life, describing music as a mere “side quest.”

is there more info on this? googling is a bit difficult because "mission" and "mars" leads to stuff about spacex and "superior race" is not a a google i want to pursue

https://www.bylinesupplement.com/p/the-far-right-eugenics-mindset-behind

This goes into it

They seem to speak euphemistically about their aims

https://bylinetimes.com/2022/11/07/musks-twitter-buy-makes-no-sense-unless-its-part-of-something-bigger/

This is intriguing. I don’t know how seriously to take an outlet called “byline times” but I have long suspected that musk had some ulterior motive in acquiring twitter.

oof. thanks treeship

Paywalled - there’s ways around that - but here’s the Collins:

https://www.businessinsider.com/pronatalism-elon-musk-simone-malcolm-collins-underpopulation-breeding-tech-2022-11

Screen of the relevant Grimes part

https://preview.redd.it/wjbxqpoc6l0a1.png

Can’t quite find an explicit article about “the mission”, but yeah, Musk has tweeted “great replacement” theory tropes and was recently on Tucker Carlson talking about
“Birth rates” and “sustainable population” which looks a lot like a racist dog whistle to me.
https://medium.com/the-noösphere/why-wealthy-tech-elites-believe-its-their-mission-to-repopulate-earth-eb15b17ab2b6

I can't pretend I foresaw Grimes' personal political trajectory, but "largely non-political techno utopianism" was never largely non-political (how could it be?), and esp wrt the US computing/internet/etc industry the line between "techno-utopianism" and "techno-authoritarianism" was always very blurry.

Speaking of 2015: https://harpers.org/archive/2015/01/come-with-us-if-you-want-to-live/

It's been a long time since I read it, but this is probably worth revisiting too: https://www.metamute.org/editorial/articles/californian-ideology

And wrt to eugenics specifically, Malcolm Harris' new book looks p interesting: https://www.vox.com/podcasts/23604908/malcolm-harris-palo-alto-capitalism-interview

Azealia Banks was right about her.

Azealia Banks is good at pointing out racism, not so good at music

If she has truly gone fascist, whenever she releases new music--which could be soon? There was a cryptic FB post within the last hour--music journos should go at her hard and precisely about all this. Back it up with some facts and corner her on it. Don't just casually dismiss her due to Elon musk associations, don't express mild unease about the imagery and the AI obsession. that's too vague and too plausibly deniable. Gotta make it stick with the cold hard truth of the matter. As someone who has never not liked her music...well I'd have no trouble moving on from her in this case. Fever Ray is out there, better politics and great music and a better more inspiring romantic life.

not sure we can just dismiss this by saying she is “woo woo” … there’s obviously an elitist + fash adjacent strain in art and it’s been there for a minute, i mean look at warhols cultivated, effete nihilism

from pc music soundtracking alt right media, to oneohtrix teasing right-accelerationism, there’s a current in the arts that despises the boring and often cringe slog of care and community in favor of high end hedonism and hyper individualism. and this is of course not just the arts but the whole constellation of “dissident leftists” like Glenn greenwald making straightforwardly right wing arguments from supposedly leftist premises

insofar as “woo” is coded as anti-establishment it makes sense; there’s more than a bit of self satisfied decadence in liberalism which provides an opening for those types to go from “big pharma is evil” to “we should delete civilization and have an elect restart on Mars”

i am not trying to dismiss this and kind of hate that i posted anything at all. i just… you know, a lot of the coked-out scenesters in 2010s nyc turned out to be nazis and i don’t spend much time thinking about their moral arcs bc i don’t think they believed in much to begin with. same with grimey

xp I honestly don’t think Glenn Greenwald is part of this. This seems like a very specific radical political project rooted in elite disdain for the masses.

It’s not just “right wing” or whatever.

whenever she releases new music--which could be soon? There was a cryptic FB post within the last hour

i mean i'll cop to thinking about this too much and making possibly overly broad connections, and in no way am i trying to moralize about anyone here 'not taking things seriously enough' or w/e, if i came off like that, sorry

but the reality is tons of people who used to seem squarely progressive or left-leaning or at least just anodyne apolitical are now varying degrees of reactionary, from edgy contrarianism to all-out fash. i think that is notable, and also obviously overdetermined, in the sense one's reactionary turn must be a blend of individual susceptibility and historical phenomena.

but i think that woo-fash resonance is interesting, because it points to which historical phenomena might be playing into this trend. like, the anti-vax perspective is a blend of not unsympathetic latent distrust of big pharma, + propagandistic manipulation, and it's the former--the decadence of corporate society--that is interesting because that is formerly the left's turf in terms of critique, but is being picked up by the right. i'd say this is in part due to the little Thielian culture industry, but also because liberals really did sell us out post 2008!

as for how grimes fits into this, idk there's a sort of weird dialectic where the idea of becoming post-human and merging with the machines or w/e just becomes another way of underlining your own human specialness, and her project, even more so than most pop stars, is very invested in the idea of this sort of untouchable individuality

anyways i'll shut up now

I just want to say that none of this is particularly unique or noteworthy or even special. Grimes isn’t the first “oh this person is a reactionary racist fuckwit, not the sympathetic nice person I assumed them to be” in music and, sadly, she won’t be the last.