What I Hear is Thinking Too: Deleuze and Guattari Go Pop

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Hi,

Has anyone seen this article: What I Hear is Thinking Too: Deleuze and Guattari Go Pop

http://www.humnet.ucla.edu/echo/volume3-issue1/smithmurphy/index.html

I like the article very much but I wonder why. Can somebody help me? What is the point they are trying to prove.

Thanks
Jan (hoping Smith and Murphy are on this list)

― Jan Geerinck, Monday, 4 November 2002 19:26 (twenty-three years ago)

use-other-quotes-please CLASSIC from the final section:
Plato recognized this instability in the Republic when he warned that "the introduction of novel fashions in music is a thing
to beware of as endangering the whole fabric of society whose most important conventions are unsettled by any revolution in
that quarter" (Plato 115).

unfortunately concluding yr big-claims essay with this is like tattooing "btw i am a clown" on yr forehead

― mark s (mark s), Monday, 4 November 2002 22:54 (twenty-three years ago)

I found the paper rather uninteresting because it didn't demonstrate any particularly novel contributions of d&g to understanding music, to understanding society, and didn't even demonstrate the utility of applying d&g's ideas to the production of music. Further to discusses the refrain without ever touching the concept of the "loop".

Rather it seems to be one of those many papers which are like "theorist [a] can be applied to subject [b]" and then goes and quotes some passages and throws some arbitrary connections about. I much rather papers which say "examining subject [a]" and then draw on theorists abcd, etc.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Monday, 4 November 2002 22:57 (twenty-three years ago)

yeah mark s, d & g are clowns.

― g (graysonlane), Monday, 4 November 2002 23:04 (twenty-three years ago)

oh wait, are you saying Murohy & smith are clowns?

― g (graysonlane), Monday, 4 November 2002 23:05 (twenty-three years ago)

No, d+g are not clowns, because they would never say anything so silly as that old mode of the music changes/walls of the city shake stuff. You have to go to Jacques Attali for that ;)

― Ben Williams, Monday, 4 November 2002 23:07 (twenty-three years ago)

i was merely protesting the lack of imagination in reaching for THAT quote to make THAT point

― mark s (mark s), Monday, 4 November 2002 23:31 (twenty-three years ago)

hey sterl, that sounds kinda like simon r's rave toolkit approach that you were in favor of once and didn't like my opposition to.

― Josh (Josh), Tuesday, 5 November 2002 03:52 (twenty-three years ago)

No the rave toolkit is "theorist [x] said this. it captures the dynamic in subject [b]." and it simultaneously implicates and uses the theorists (that is, it makes no claim to their general validity, and in fact tends to cheapen it by turning them into a source for hallway-style zingers while at the same time preserving their interesting concepts in the abstract). I like it precisely because it situates music in a larger social framework which it credits the theorists in capturing an aspect of, rather than ripping the theorists from their broader social concerns.

I mean a paper which took a deluzian concept (not rhizome though, i'm so fucking sick of that) and did something interesting with it or made a novel connection would be worthwhile.

Back to my original post, what I like about the rave toolkit is the sense that the music came first and the theorists second.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Tuesday, 5 November 2002 05:16 (twenty-three years ago)

when people start blathering on and on about deleuze and guattari i just mutter "yeah, yeah, dj fucking spooky" and walk away.

― your null fame (yournullfame), Tuesday, 5 November 2002 08:02 (twenty-three years ago)

when people start blathering on and on about deleuze and guattari i just mutter "yeah, yeah, dj fucking spooky" and walk away.

nah: D&G is poetry: where else can you find a quote as beautiful as: flying anuses, speeding vaginas, there is no castration ...

Yours
Jan Geerinck

― Jan Geerinck, Tuesday, 5 November 2002 18:02 (twenty-three years ago)

thank you

― DG (D_To_The_G), Tuesday, 5 November 2002 18:20 (twenty-three years ago)

alan sokal to thread....

― mike (ro)bott, Wednesday, 6 November 2002 04:27 (twenty-three years ago)

ahem you DO realize that Sokal has *nothing* to say about impenetable theory except when it misuses science and math? i.e. he doesn't try to comment on "no castration" but only when lacan sez "castration fear = root(-1)"

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Wednesday, 6 November 2002 04:29 (twenty-three years ago)

Thanks to ILM I now know who Sokal is and what he did.

Thanks
Jan

One more word on the article. The good thing about it is that it connected me to the music of Richard Pinhas http://www.jahsonic.com/RichardPinhas.html

Jan

― Jan Geerinck, Wednesday, 6 November 2002 22:27 (twenty-three years ago)

of course i know that sterling. the last thing i like to do is just blindly invoke names.

they don't seem particularly obscurantist to me, maybe since i hazarded 'mille plateau' in the original (which bricmont and sokal could've easily.)

― mike (ro)bott, Wednesday, 6 November 2002 23:08 (twenty-three years ago)

i read the article but only vaguely understood it...large parts of it were fairly inpenetrable,making me feel fairly stupid...i mean do people just read through that with the same level of immediate understanding they would say a newspaper article?
i dont mean to sound anti intellectual,but i was able to gather no more than a vague idea of the ideas being presented...or rather i think i know what the ideas were,but if they are as simple as i took them to be,why were they phrased so obscurely?
i do like the sound of that residents album though,almost like a precursor to the klf chill out or something...

― robin (robin), Thursday, 7 November 2002 04:09 (twenty-three years ago)

fifteen years pass...

The more I find out about D&G, the more I suspect that they're just writing about potatoes

― Dan I., Thursday, 22 March 2018 18:37 (seven years ago)

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