Born In The U.S.A. vs. Scarecrow

Come on.

Come on.

Come on.

Comparison from this 1987 Mellencamp NY Times profile:

The current rock scene has been largely dominated by the working-class fervor of Bruce Springsteen, whose showmanship and compositional splendor have been offset by an ambiguous thematic voice and an equally enigmatic personality. A Springsteen hit such as ''Born in the U.S.A.'' greets the ears like the sound of Caesar entering Rome, yet its lyrics are actually the lament of a Vietnam veteran who sees himself as a beaten dog. Springsteen is a melodramatist whose personality is deliberately disguised by his theatrics. He carefully restricts contact with the public and is rarely seen offstage. Mellencamp, on the other hand, is an open book, with no larger-than-life bravura -even though the deeply personal side to his music has been little known. Springsteen's flamboyant sound is all flesh, but Mellencamp's more accessible rock is all bone.

http://i.imgur.com/vXWOQQx.jpg

Haha

I love Scarecrow and how it became a mini Thriller after his last album undersold, but it's not close.

Not a fair fight -- BITUSA defined a moment, Scarecrow was but an enjoyable particle in its massive wake -- but I'll take Kenny Aaronoff's loose, trashy garage feel over Max Weinberg's stiffness any day.

(That said, Weinberg finally let his Moon flag fly on the title track.)

https://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/muppet/images/d/d0/AddLP.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20110718210522

yeah Weinberg vs Aronoff means a clear Coog win

Aronoff is a great drummer, but he - unlike, say, Stan Lynch - plays like a session guy pretending to be loose. Hits super hard, doesn't swing at all, unlike Weinberg. But of course Mellonhead doesn't need that, and Springsteen does. Aronoff/Melloncamp grooves, though, which Springsteen lacks.

plays like a session guy pretending to be loose.

I agree that Aaronoff plays this way with other artists -- almost comically so -- but I always thought he sounded completely organic and in-forced with Mellencamp.

One of the defining moments of Coog's oeuvre is Aaronoff's re-entry in "Check It Out." It's like what Phil Rudd said about Kenney Jones on the Small Faces' "Tin Soldier": it's not that he comes in loud, he comes back in big. I have yet to hear Weinberg achieve that.

*un-forced

He definitely is a perfect fit for Mellencamp (just as Lynch was for Petty). I just meant I've read numerous interviews with Aronoff that he worked his ass off for the gig, constantly worrying about being fired early on, even going so far as to keep taking lessons *after* the Coug got successful. Someone like Stan Lynch was all, fuck it, it's my way or no way. Aronoff hustled.

Anyway, pretty sure I mentioned Mellencamp is this thread back when:

Let's List Bands That Got Worse with the Departure of a Drummer

what would make a drummer's sound "forced" anyway?

Overplaying, too many flourishes, fills, etc.

(Weinberg nor Aranoff are guilty of this sin, btw)

xpost Well, since we're talking Springsteen/Weinberg, think about how much worse Springsteen sounded with Jeff Porcaro (one of the most talented drummers of all time) playing. Too precise, too fussy, no swing, trying too hard yet still falling short. Like, I remember reading an interview with Aronoff (I used to play drums) where he stressed this one trick he got from Charlie Watts, where (nerd talk) he lifted his hand off the hi hat every time he hit the snare. I hear it all the time now (same with later Stones) and it just seems so ... conscious, in the case of Aronoff. Not bad, just very conscious.

It's not so much that their sound is forced, but that their approach to orchestration and space is. In the case of Aaronoff, he sounds completely at-ease with Mellencamp's band. But when he plays with, say, Smashing Pumpkins, you get the sense that he is literally saying to himself -- or reading on motivational cue cards -- "SWING. BE LOOSE. RELAX."

xxp

Another good example, even though I liked his playing, Dave Abbruzzese really sticks out in Pearl Jam. He doesn't play any flashier than Matt Cameron, but Cameron is very natural sounding and Dave sticks out. Even when he's not being flashy, just his sound, the type of cymbals he uses, and so on. Imo.

There was an interview I read with Pete Thomas in Modern Drummer years ago, where he talked about his post Attractions years doing session work, which included a lot of work with Mitchell Froom. After a bit of that he got a gig recording with old buddies Squeeze, and he started taping maracas to his sticks, replacing his snare with tambourines, all sorts of Mitchell Froom tricks, and Squeeze was all, what the fuck happened to you?

AB: When it came time for you to do other albums....
PT: Oh, I've gotten into terrible trouble like that. I've wasted a lot of people's time, (laughs) When I did Squeeze's Some Fantastic Place album I was like, "Why don't we try this: I'll get this old steel drum and some claves and this African bongo and then we'll make up a loop and put it through a fuzz box and then we'll all play to that...." We'd be listening back and they'd be looking at me like, "What are you doing to our song?"
AB: Were you able to get any of these ideas through in the end?
PT: No. But it is fun to go through the conventional thing as well. I did come unstuck, though. I was all full of it—"Oh, I know how to do this funny stuff—and they were all just like, "Well we don't want it."

Ha, that's funny. Froom never met a percussion instrument he couldn't clumsily shoehorn onto a track.

Good Mellencamp production / Arnoff drums on James McMurtry's debut Too Long in the Wasteland.

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when sweaty rootsy music could shine a light on America's cracks

as our nation's arid cracks now clench in darkness

That was written tongue in cheek, but also kinda not.

America, unclench -- Lord Soto's here.

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