MJ Lenderman

Deserves a thread.

Talented Neil Young/Wilco/Pavement influnced songs. He also had a great Slowcore album from 2019

His new song (from new album) is 💪

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rFVVzavii0

also in Wednesday! you forgot that part.

my kid turned me on to MJ and then months later i told my kid that i had heard Wednesday and really liked them and my kid said yeah that's the band that MJL is in...and i had no idea. but i like both things. solo and day job. and i usually don't care about stuff like this anymore. but i like them. they sound good to me.

Yeah, i heard and liked Wednsday, but i think his solo stuff is better

i think a lot of people think that. from what i gather.

That new single rules. Feels good to have a new indie rock guitar hero.

No snark intended and I'm asking in good faith but what exactly distinguishes this from thousands of other competent 90s-sounding indie rock artists in thrall to Crazy Horse and Dinosaur Jr? If you told me this was a reissue of an old Slobberbone or Buffalo Tom album, I'd believe it

I went into this assuming it’d sound like a mashup of ML Buch and Westerman. I was wrong

xp you can go listen to Boat Songs - the best album of 2022, imo - and see if you think it stands out to you. if it doesn't, that's fine. it does for lots of people.

mjlenderman.bandcamp.com/album/boat-songs

it's not really about distinguishing from others - that's a fool's errand. it's about whether *you* like it or not, y'know?

Nothing groundbreaking, yes, but he does it good and with authenticity.

Besides, how many current acts have a unique and ineresting style in rock and in general?

We might as well not listen to new stuff at all with that point of view

Xpost

his live album is what really convinced me he can credibly channel the spirit of neil and j, etc. lyrics are also charming, funny, and plaintive, and often tell the stories of long-retired athletes.

Go rent a Ferrari
And sing the blues
Believe that Clapton was the second coming

This is all high praise and I will give Boat Songs a shot

I have friends who like this guy too, so I'm probably just missing something

His ST slowcore album is also great imo

Agreed ^ and that's not normally my thing.

most of the stuff he recorded and released before Boat Songs, to me, has heavy Jason Molina vibes. i don't love Molina's music as much as most people do, but Jake's way of doing it works for me, for whatever reason.

Neil / Dino Jr / Pavement *is* my things, however, and i knew Boat Songs was likely my AOTY the first time I heard it.

he also plays an integral role in what i think is one of the best songs of this year so far: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YL3iHhERWJw

glad there's a thread now. i'm a fan!

i'm a fan too and i do not listen to a ton of indie stuff. i'm very picky in my old age. though i do find myself liking more current stuff now than in the past 5 or 10 years. there is good stuff out there. and not just in Australia.

speaking of dinosaur, lou came in the store yesterday and he's very excited about his upcoming folk implosion tour so you should go see him and get your 90s on. it IS almost the 30th anniversary of Kids after all.

she's leaving you is a pretty great bummer jam

haven't listened a ton but have liked what I've heard
went to see Waxahatchee recently and he was on guitar, really good player as a sideman, Jeff Tweedy's son was on drums, he can really play too

new vid/single

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTEpo9orjlg

Kinda dissapointing compared to the previous single

it's a solid single, not a career highlight like the last one

Yeah. Upgrading to "solid"

Bumping this thread because I'm starting to get amped for Manning Fireworks coming out on Sept 6th--I even just pre-ordered a CD copy at my local record store (a store which is de facto a vinyl-only one, but stll lets customers special-order CDs).

Maybe the step-up in mastering is helping me make this conclusion, but the three advance singles off this new/upcoming one and the live album have been my go-to headphones listens in getting acquainted with this guy--S/T, Ghost Of Your Guitar Solo and Boat Songs all have great songs IMO, but the newest output is real ear candy to these ears (esp impressive to me w/r/t to the beefed-up sound on Live and Loose compared to the studio versions)...

I liked his last album pretty well and really like “She’s Leaving You,” definitely interested in hearing the full release. As to what differentiates him, at least the songs I’ve heard and like, it’s nothing formalist, he is obviously working well plowed ground. But he’s a good songwriter, basically. Both lyrically and melodically it seems to me that finds interesting turns of tune and phrase.

That HE finds …

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeGujHpGUIs

i dig it.

I knew nothing about this guy and then see a New Yorker article about him; and a Washington Post article on Waxahatchee where she mentions how Lenderman helped her with her latest album and songwriting

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2024/09/09/mj-lenderman-manning-fireworks-music-review

so now you know stuff about him

And finally listened to him and well, he's ok

New single is very good.
New album is very good too.

really like this album, non-single highlights for me are the title track and "you don't know the shape i'm in," but i can't help but feeling like the 10 minute song is only 10 minutes long because he wanted to have a song that long on the album. the drone that reverberates after the 4-minute mark isn't very interesting.

100% agree, voodoo chili--was hoping that "Howl At The Moon" was 10 mins long b/c he went full Powerfinger or Cortez on it (not that I mind things veering into the drone zone per se, but still, was likewise relatively disappointed in that respect given the context)

(Also agree re: "You Don't Know The Shape I'm In" being a nice non-single highlight--the drum machine intro reminds of me of Kurt Vile ca. Wakin' On A Pretty Daze in a great way, and the clarinet part in the back half of it is even a bit unexpectedly Andy Shauf-y [who I'm prob primed to now compare him to since they're now Anti- labelmates])

shit damn fuck I'm just tuning in to this guy and it is 1000% My Shit "She's Leaving You" SOTY

also dude's success is inversely proportional to how much I've Wasted My Life and that makes me like him *more*, somehow....? ? ?

Album is good, but man people overhyped it all over the internet,as if its the best album ever

the last one was the best album ever. this one is merely the one those people are catching up to.

just now, as an old, learning of this young man, I for one like it a lot

the guitar solo in “she’s leaving you”

new album's fine but i agree it's rude of him to tease the idea of a 10 minute neil young-esque epic and just do a drone outro instead

“I want to be financially stable, and I want to be able to make music—but I’m not really interested in getting bigger,” the 25-year-old singer and guitarist says, tucked in a booth of the Manhattan restaurant Lafayette one evening this summer, nursing a Kronenbourg and wondering where he’ll watch the N.B.A. finals later that night.

Liking that "wrist watch " song more now

Three listens later, I'm meh on the voice. I used to be a sucker for scuzzy Neil Youngisms.

can’t be an original observation, but I hear a ton of malkmus too

Lenderman is one of those “on paper” artists for me. He is squarely in my favorite genre of music (not quite “indie twang” but more like “alt jangle”) but there is just *something* missing for me, and I’m not quite sure what it is. The most I can think is that I can really here an artist who is very influenced by stuff I loved (and still love) from 25 years ago, but he clearly wasn’t actually old enough to be influenced by it then. That’s not meant as a harsh criticism, I just detect an inherent distance between what he’s putting out and what I’m receiving.

I’VE GOT A HOUSEBOAT DOCKED AT THE HIMBODOME

getting obsessed with this guy. the live album is everything

live album is where the neil comparisons actually make sense imo. has that ramshackle feel and is genuinely, thrillingly *loud*

i hate that i love this album so much because it makes me feel like such a basic middle-aged man who grew up on indie rock. i hate when i fall for stuff that feels directly targeted at me. but i do love it.

i'd say the lyrics are like david berman through an americana filter but people would try to argue with me about it and who cares.

people are so afraid of humor in lyrics

the songs aren't wordy, but he still does a pretty good job of writing lines that you remember

its funny about preferences because i love pavement and the silver jews guy does the pavement thing but i really don't like his voice at all so i can't listen to him. same with smog. they have the same voice kinda.

if the woman who sings on beat happening songs sang all their songs i would own every beat happening album but it is not the case and i own no beat happening albums.

and yet i love the pastels! brains are weird.

Low frog voice.

I don't mind silly or dumb, or non-sequiturs, or anything like that if the hooks and songs are there, but I just didn't hear them in this case. And as a middle-aged guy raised on indie, I too thought I would enjoy it. But hey, it's not like the last 50 years of music made with guitars doesn't exist, there is no reason to like everything. Heck, I still don't feel like I've spent enough time (or even had enough time to spend) with last year's Wednesday album.

you don't think "she's leaving you" is catchy? its okay if you don't but its totally catchy to me.

It might be the one! There was some day where I was randomly served one of his songs, and I thought, hey, this is good! And that's what finally made me listen to the album. But the rest of the album was so uneven I had to check the playlist to make sure it wasn't giving me random other stuff instead, or the wrong album, because it didn't track with the praise I'd heard.

i will say it again: Boat Songs is better, and hookier.

this is a classic case of the greater music critic ecosystem finding the previous cool/underground album too late to review it when it came out, then overreacting to the next record - which in this case is good! don't get me wrong, i like this one. but Boat Songs is better (imo).

if you kinda like this or you thought you'd like it or you wish you understood the hype, i would suggest going and listening to Boat Songs.

Boat Songs is really cool! Very good in a more raucous and ramshackle way. Definitely get more of the Crazy Horse vibe on that one, especially on "Tastes Just Like it Costs"

I like about half this album (with lyrics that give me insights into a different type of existence) and I don't like Pavement and I think it just reminds me of the Drive-By Truckers whose lyrics are better. But, yeah, "She's Leaving You" is wicked catchy.

Nothing productive to add here but I’d believe you if you told me this was new Ben Kweller or some dull Saddle Creek or Secretly Canadian band from ‘03.

xxpost, i don't mean that as a shot at the greater music critic ecosystem or the critics themselves, btw. many people caught onto Boat Songs not long after it was released, it's just that so many people work for places that won't run a review 3 months after release date. people got to do year-end stories and blurbs for Top Whatever lists, but for many folks, this is really the first chance they've gotten to praise Jake and his music, so it's coming in hot.

Boat Songs is both more Pavement-y and more Crazy Horse ... this one is more Waxahatchee. *shrug*

its very New Yorker Magazine but i like it anyway. or like him anyway. i like Wednesday too.

the new yorker recently ran an interview with him!

I don’t know what accounts for the dislike other than people have their own tastes

the idea that his lyrics are non-sequiturs doesn't scan for me, it just feels like a surface level or incurious reading of the songs. not that i intend to assign everyone listening homework but after a few plays of this i found the lyrical POV to be very legible. honestly some of you guys are talking about a break up album like it's sanskrit. to me, for example, "kahlua shooter / DUI scooter / with a rolling start down a hill / this morning's trying to kill me" qualifies as idiosyncratic lyricism for sure -- but y'all really can't glean the meaning of that verse w/in the context of the song? a song that is quite clearly about being out on the road alone and your life spiraling over a break up. you could read it literally if you want, it makes plenty sense -- getting too drunk, taking a reckless joyride down a hill, waking up to reality w/ a crushing hangover -- or you could, more likely, read it as a sketch of a general emotional state. but it's only a non-sequitur when you type it out and divorce it completely from its source material.

to me the emotions being articulated across the album -- the way a break up can bring about mournfulness, self-pity, resignation, self-deprecation, loneliness, depression -- are very present. like, it doesn't take a huge amount of critical thinking skills to derive meaning from the lyrics "i've got a houseboat docked at the Himbo Dome" in the context of a song about a guy w/ "a funny face" whose ex thinks he's a loser who has "wasted [his] life away." i'm not gonna sit here and say that everyone has to love the lyric "deleted scene of Lightning McQueen / blacked out at full speed" but i will argue that its meaning w/in the context of "rudolph" + the album overall is apparent. taste is taste it's all good i get why the lyrics would rub people the wrong way, that's part of what makes him great. but if there is a problem w/ intelligibility here it's coming from the side of the listener and not the writer, imo

i guess to me there is an interplay between the "non-sequiturs" and the very direct and simple lyrics that makes for a really effective and special combo. i mean we can go back and forth about what "i've got a houseboat docked at the himbo dome" means, but the emotional weight of that song is conveyed quite traditionally in the way the verses turn from "and a wristwatch that tells me you're all alone" to "and a wristwatch that tells me i'm on my own." just in that little turn of phrasing, to me, he conveys a lot about the internal tug of war one experience's when going thru a break up -- the way that deriving pleasure from the wasteland that is your ex's life can rub uncomfortably against the fact that yours probably is too. i hear someone struggling w/ wanting to feel happy and defiant and proud of himself but ultimately losing that battle to loneliness. all the stuff about himbo domes and compasses and cellphones doesn't blunt any of that to me

"It gets dark/We all got work to do" is a fantastic lyric.

My favorite indie/jangle albums this year are by Waxahatchee and Hurray for the Riffraff.

Nothing productive to add here but I’d believe you if you told me this was new Ben Kweller or some dull Saddle Creek or Secretly Canadian band from ‘03.
― avoid boring people, Thursday, September 26, 2024 2:26 PM (three hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

Six of one. I'm guessing based on this evidence that I'm roughly 3.5 years older than you

No snark intended and I'm asking in good faith but what exactly distinguishes this from thousands of other competent 90s-sounding indie rock artists in thrall to Crazy Horse and Dinosaur Jr? If you told me this was a reissue of an old Slobberbone or Buffalo Tom album, I'd believe it
― Paul Ponzi, Tuesday, June 25, 2024 2:15 PM (three months ago) bookmarkflaglink

i let it pass the first time but the idea that mj lenderman sounds like ben kweller is completely idiotic

this whole line of argument about lenderman sounding like a lot of other indie rock reminds me of when people ask why anyone cares about snail mail and soccer mommy when you can just listen to liz phair, and the answer is the same -- the songs matter. the emotional experience of listening to music is not just a sorting game

I’m firmly in the “his lyrics are amazing” camp. I also think he’s a great songwriter and his voice fits the vibe perfectly. There’s a feeling in his voice that you can’t fake. Not everyone’s cup of tea, though, I get it.

Like I posted earlier, the voice was a hindrance; it's my own decreased tolerance for this kind of singing (his tone reminds me of Rufus Wainwright odd). I'm cooler about it now.

Reminds a little of the Grifters. I'm not hungry for this kind of sound in my life right now, but it seems like he's being authentic.

honestly dying to see this guy play live in [checks tickets]... february

"i guess to me there is an interplay between the "non-sequiturs" and the very direct and simple lyrics that makes for a really effective and special combo."

yeah, no, i dig this for sure!

"It gets dark/We all got work to do" is a fantastic lyric."

and this fucking hell yeah i love it! my second fave rock song of the year.

but honestly when i hear "DUI scooter" i can't help but think of the people in my town who ride around on Rascals and who will never drive a car again because of their boozy unsteadiness.

agree he's an outstanding lyricist from what i've heard, it's what broke through some of my skepticism. the second verse of she's leaving you and how it takes you to a completely different place from the rest of the song was what got me

You said
"Vegas is beautiful at night"
And it's not about the money
You just like the lights
Though you know what is implied
When your room is free
You're feeling lucky

I’m not here to sap anyone’s enthusiasm. I don’t even actively dislike Mr. Lenderman. He’s just not for me but I hope he’s enjoying his moment. To J0rdan -no, he sounds nothing like Ben Kweller. Just a snarky/dismissive name I grabbed. To Paul - I’m 45 (which probably ages me out of this conversation).

Does it? Most of the album's fans here are over 30.

when people ask why anyone cares about snail mail and soccer mommy when you can just listen to liz phair, and the answer is the same -- the songs matter

100% agree with this. it's precisely the songwriting that i don't like. the music/production sounds great and so do the vocals imo!

this whole line of argument

for my part, i'm not arguing anything. i don't really see the point of arguing about music, just sharing my opinion. really enjoyed your posts though and your enthusiasm here and around ilm

A lot of you don't have a houseboat docked at the Himbo Dome and it fucking shows.

i don't have one of those but i do have a wristwatch that's a compass and a cell phone

i wonder if the himbo dome is architecturally similar to the custerdome

I like the old one about his dad seeing Dan Marino at Harris Teeter in South Carolina.

Reminds me of the time I saw Marvin Harrison at Walgreens.

I saw Beitt Daniel in cargo shorts in a Chipotle line.

Britt

and his hair was perfect

Are you sure he wasn't drinking a pina colada at Trader Vic's?

A disillusionment to say the least.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTdD23Vk4XKrrejcbek1Fa2oIU-akZMaCQz7g&s

Hey that guy was in my apartment about 15 years ago!

My favorite indie/jangle albums this year are by Waxahatchee and Hurray for the Riffraff.

― sctttnnnt (pgwp), Thursday, September 26, 2024 4:32 PM (one week ago) bookmarkflaglink

+1

that song "knockin'" destroys me. so few words, so powerful. also doubles as music criticism, or somehow turbocharges an old tune you don't even think twice about anymore.

don't think twice it's alright.

that song "knockin'" destroys me. so few words, so powerful. also doubles as music criticism, or somehow turbocharges an old tune you don't even think twice about anymore.

― Thus Sang Freud, Friday, October 4, 2024 6:49 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

yes! I think this is my favorite song of his.

cyrus - my kid - wanted to play me his fave red house painters song and i hadn't heard it in a long time and the first thing i think when i hear it is "totally proto-lenderman!". cyrus agreed with me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp-Tg_t993U