taking sides: Take That's "Babe" vs East 17's "Stay Another Day"

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the alienation of Christmas in the Major era: DISCUSS

I love both, but I'm moving towards "Babe" after Marcello cited it. its failure to actually be Xmas number 1 is the 356,592nd reason to hate Noel Edmonds, obv

robin carmody (robin carmody), Tuesday, 17 December 2002 14:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Slight Xmas #1 detour: personally I can't get "Lonely This Christmas" out of my head at the moment, and I now hate Les Gray for camping up his vocal on the record, being ironic, doing the ventriloquist routine on TOTP, because the words have now taken on a new, horrible resonance for me. This is my fault, not Mud's. I do not want to believe that the song/record was a pisstake.

"Do you remember last Christmas, when we were here? We never thought there'd be an end..."

Marcello Carlin, Tuesday, 17 December 2002 14:14 (twenty-two years ago)

"last christmas".

michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 17 December 2002 14:18 (twenty-two years ago)

if that's not contemporary enough for the poipoises of this thread then i'm siding with "stay another day".

michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 17 December 2002 14:19 (twenty-two years ago)

Don't know 'Babe', but I have a dangerous soft spot for 'Stay Another Day'; heard it again on R2 the other day.

the pinefox, Tuesday, 17 December 2002 15:10 (twenty-two years ago)

"Babe" I think is to "Back For Good" what "Last Christmas" (and "Everything She Wants", for that matter) were to "Careless Whisper"; ie it deserved the praise that the "instant classic" got.

The outro of "Babe" bleeds desolation and dystopia; the middle eight is wonderfully redolent of Imagination's "Body Talk". It captures the feeling of late '93 / early '94, a time when I could see, literally, NO FUTURE. For some reason, I always link it to Martin Jacques' essay on the disillusionment in society and the antiquated nature of our party political structure (Sunday Times 16th Jan 1994); though wildly different, both encapsulated a feeling of "where next?", absolute knowledge that the old certainties were over, but no idea of what was to replace them.

And then came "Angels" (and, forgotten though it is, "Love Won't Wait", the first NuLab number one) and we realised what had become The New Orthodoxy. Williams' solo career epitomises for me all that is frustrating about the Blairite cultural middle ground; did Brian Johnston die for *that* in January '94?

"Pale Movie" should have been number one. So should "Like A Motorway" and "Happy Land" and "Kingdom" ...

robin carmody (robin carmody), Tuesday, 17 December 2002 17:44 (twenty-two years ago)

I heard 'Stay Another Day' on the radio very recently and was amazed at how good it sounded considering I hated it at the time. Then it was featured on TOTP2 tonight and seeing them lumbering/waddling about (trying to look 'hard') spoiled the effect. The bald one was particularly comical, as always.

David (David), Tuesday, 17 December 2002 23:28 (twenty-two years ago)

stay another day! great reocrd

gareth (gareth), Tuesday, 17 December 2002 23:32 (twenty-two years ago)

Stay Another Day, all the way, even with the daft macho posturing. Take That just looked and sounded drippy and desperate, whereas East 17 looked like they meant it under the bravado. Yipyip.

Charlie (Charlie), Wednesday, 18 December 2002 06:29 (twenty-two years ago)

'stay another day' is the fucking anti-song of all time. pseudo-melody and shitty voices. uuuuuuuuuurgh! and the look unbelievably silly, too!

Jay K (Jay K), Wednesday, 18 December 2002 10:15 (twenty-two years ago)

Stay Another Day, definitely. Babe was always the lamest, drippiest TT song for me.

Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 18 December 2002 10:19 (twenty-two years ago)

Robin C: I tend to agree with your insight about the 'middle ground'. (I'd be interested in hearing more of your take on it.) Though I suppose one person's middle ground is another's left field.

the pinefox, Wednesday, 18 December 2002 15:27 (twenty-two years ago)

i just realised that it says "in the Major era", i somehow misread it as "modern era".

michael wells (michael w.), Wednesday, 18 December 2002 15:31 (twenty-two years ago)

I prefer "Babe". But did anyone notice that it sounds very similar to King Crimson's "Epitaph"?

man, Thursday, 19 December 2002 03:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Thanks, Reynard. I suppose R. Williams is the epitome of a lot of what I dislike about British culture in the Blair era, ie it is so concerned *not* to take a dogmatic position, that it drains out whatever meaning it could possibly have. It covers the bases of daytime Radio 1 *and* Test Match Special, and drains out the resonance from both.

But then Williams is a particular curse for me. Nobody else in the last five years embodies so much unpleasantness. Not even Coldplay, because they don't pretend to be Great Pop Stars.

robin carmody (robin carmody), Friday, 20 December 2002 04:58 (twenty-two years ago)

Indeed, Williams vs Coldplay is no contest.

the pinefox, Friday, 20 December 2002 11:06 (twenty-two years ago)


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