Is is just me or does the Fall's "The Classical" sound exactly like a Pavement song?

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Ive heard the comparison between Steve-o Mack and Mr. Smith before, but the Classical is the closest sounding. The voices are almost identitical, the song structure, everything about it.

Im not alone, am I?

― David Allen, Saturday, 4 January 2003 00:28 (twenty-two years ago)

you're probably right, but the most bald-faced rip-off Malkie is responsible for is without question "Conduit for Sale" - the song is a note-for-note rendition of "New Face in Hell", even the vocal delivery is the same, just the words are different.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Saturday, 4 January 2003 00:32 (twenty-two years ago)

if youve heard the comparisons before then you know that you are not alone. you answered your own question!

― chaki (chaki), Saturday, 4 January 2003 00:32 (twenty-two years ago)

"mark smith used to work for me
back in manchester back in 1983
stole all his ideas from me"
--Steve M.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Saturday, 4 January 2003 01:11 (twenty-two years ago)

What other people said, but Pavement also covered The Classical for a Peel session in 1997 and have covered it live a few other times, and I think a disappointing version (even more so than the Peel version, which is, eh, ok) ended up as a b-side to one of the Terror Twilight singles, so I thought I'd just check you weren't thinking of an actual cover.

― Rebecca (reb), Saturday, 4 January 2003 02:48 (twenty-two years ago)

So I checked, because they were that simmilar, and yeah I have a Fall version.

Even though I'm still a fan of Pavement, I must say that their "sound" isn't as original as I once thought.

Then, not all Fall songs are formed like the Classical. Barmy, for example.

― David Allen, Saturday, 4 January 2003 03:34 (twenty-two years ago)

I think the reason Pavement never explicitly admitted they were ripping the Fall is that 1) it was SO obvious (half of Slanted and nearly everything pre-); and 2) it wasn't as much rip-off as conscious homage.

― Aaron A., Saturday, 4 January 2003 03:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Alright then, so as rabid Pavement fan, what Fall albums should I pick up?

― arjun, Saturday, 4 January 2003 17:19 (twenty-two years ago)

"Jackals, False Grails: The Lonesome Era" off of S+E is a bit knicked off of "The Classical", and as previously mentioned, "Conduit" is a interpolation of "A New Face In Hell". "Sue Me Jack" is also a Fall rip, but I can't remember which Fall song off hand.

If you want to start with The Fall, I'd recommend getting Hip Priests And Kamerads, This Nations Saving Grace, and The Strange And Frightening World Of The Fall.

― Flux, Saturday, 4 January 2003 22:53 (twenty-two years ago)

The version of the classical on Pavement's "Major Leagues" single IS the Peel version. You can tell from the "old family favorite" introduction. Just wanted to clear that up.

― Boggly Obbly, Sunday, 5 January 2003 00:45 (twenty-two years ago)

Oops! It must have sounded better the first time round. *sheepish* Either that or hearing Major Leagues put me in a bad mood. Or maybe whatever combination of vodka and FM radio compression made a bunch of the tracks in Peel's festive 50 sound a lot better in a droney treacly mid-90s Stereolab sort of way than they do on cd or mp3 kicked in again. I'd accept an award for biggest fool on ILM except I don't think it ever left my hands in the first place...

― Rebecca (reb), Sunday, 5 January 2003 01:31 (twenty-two years ago)

Alright then, so as rabid Pavement fan, what Fall albums should I pick up?

best Fall album for starters

― Stewart Osborne (Stewart Osborne), Sunday, 5 January 2003 02:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Isn't this reason #362 why Mark E Smith reminds us all "notebooks out, plagarists."

― Lord Custos Omega (Lord Custos Omega), Sunday, 5 January 2003 03:19 (twenty-two years ago)

It should be noted that Pavement's version of "The Classical" is very much rewritten, most of Smith's lyrics are omitted, SM adds his own lyrics and vocal melodies, and the "I've never felt better in my life" outro from the original is made to be a chorus in the Pavement version.

All of Pavement's Fall interpolations include a significant chunk of SM-penned content, so it's maybe a little unfair to consider them out and out ripoffs, unless you're the type of person who believes all sampling and interpolations are ripoffs.

― flux, Sunday, 5 January 2003 17:34 (twenty-two years ago)

Hasn't Mark E Smith of the Fall been going on for the past few years about how Pavement et al having been ripping the Fall off? Mind you, he's also been accusing various rap artists of ripping his style off in the past, so I don't know if he's joking or not...

― Old Fart!!! (oldfart_sd), Sunday, 5 January 2003 19:18 (twenty-two years ago)

hey david, pavement are commonly noted as having ripped off many flying nun bands too. i believe they even admit to it. i wuv them for it.

― di smith (lucylurex), Monday, 6 January 2003 07:02 (twenty-two years ago)

one year passes...

("Right fuckin' rip-offs....They've sold about 100,000 fuckin' LPs, these bastards")
http://www.visi.com/fall/gigography/93sep21.html

― egon krenz (slaytrack), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 22:34 (twenty-one years ago)

"Is is just me or does the Fall's "The Classical" sound exactly like a Pavement song?" Yeah. The Fall must have travelled forwards in time to copy Pavement.

'Hit the Plane Down' sounds like a Fall song too.

This reminds me of an exchange someone had with Malkmus just before a sold out Pavement gig while SM was tuning up:

"Y'know, the Fall played here a few months ago and couldn't get half capacity"
(Malkmus, with smug grin creeping across his face): "Yeah"
"It's a pity, 'cause they're a far better band."

― Sasha (sgh), Tuesday, 2 March 2004 23:45 (twenty-one years ago)

And SM replied with "They WERE a better band," or something to that effect.

― rw, Wednesday, 3 March 2004 01:38 (twenty-one years ago)

"Two States-ah"

― Donna Brown (Donna Brown), Wednesday, 3 March 2004 02:45 (twenty-one years ago)

"Hex Enduction Hour" (w/"The Classical) is my favourite, largely because that edition of The Fall featured (not one, but) two great drummers, which is two more than Pavement ever had.

― Myonga Von Bontee, Wednesday, 3 March 2004 09:02 (twenty-one years ago)

fifteen years pass...

band that sounds like Pavement:

Toronto's Kiwi Jr.

― a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Friday, 31 January 2020 20:38 (five years ago)

as a pavement fan, i'd MUCH rather check out a band that "sounds like nickelback"

― I wanna publish memes and rage against machimes (rip van wanko), Saturday, 1 February 2020 00:57 (five years ago)

I like Dr. Morbious posts so much more when they involve non-negative informations about bands I like and do not involve hateful imbedded retweets of "Dennis Perrin" and "Dick Nixon"

will check out Kiwi Jr

rvw, corny orange county anglo-fiddlers Nickel Creek's cover of Spit on a Stranger might just be up your alley, they're awful enough to be compared to Nickelback even if they don't sound like em

hey btw this seems like an excellent opportunity to repeat Neil Hamburger's 2004 classic: "what do you get when you shove a penny up the ass of the five members of Smash Mouth? Nickelback!"

― del griffith, Saturday, 1 February 2020 01:46 (five years ago)

embedded

― del griffith, Saturday, 1 February 2020 01:47 (five years ago)

this guy does sound a lot of Malkmus, like maybe if you replaced Robyn Hitchcock with him, it's good, thank you Doctor Morbioius

― del griffith, Saturday, 1 February 2020 04:02 (five years ago)

Doctor Morbiouous has the prescription I need for the disease of lacking indie guitar pop melodies into my bloodstraems, whether they be from the northern San Jaoquin Valley or Engladn, woooo

― del griffith, Saturday, 1 February 2020 04:05 (five years ago)

three weeks pass...

I really like this Kiwi Jr album especially the songs "salary man" and "swimming pool"

A good dollop of Pavement in their sound for sure along with a dash of Orange Juice for good measure

― Saxophone Of Futility (Michael B), Wednesday, 26 February 2020 11:18 (five years ago)

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