Also were they clever or radical? What did their ultra femininity/ultra masculinity mean? The first words on their first album are something pre-verbal and then: 'yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah- no no no no no no no no.' What of this? Did they promise something that wasn't acted upon, exchanged for the easier to contain cynicism of punk?
― Maryann, Saturday, 9 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
― anthony, Saturday, 9 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
― Stevie Nixed, Sunday, 10 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
― tarden, Sunday, 10 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
― Patrick, Sunday, 10 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
Cooper invented Glam *and* Goth (which is pretty good going), but his version of genderfuck was way timid (loud panto, basically), compared to the Dolls (who knew how to sew and cut cloth). "School's Out" is a way better *popsong* than the NYDs ever wrote: and both the Dolls LPs are so MUFFLED (but I know I turned Muddy Production-Presentation into a positive complication in re Pistols/Bollocks arrival and listener-inhabitation...).
The critics crack is just evasive: Tarden finding a way to avoid having to take responsibility for his own opinions.
― mark s, Sunday, 10 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
― duane zarakov, Sunday, 10 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
― duane, Sunday, 10 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
Johnny Thunders was the one who went on to make great music after the New York Dolls, in my opinion.
The image question; perhaps that's misguided - that wasn't what PREVENTED them from becoming popular, if anything, that was their selling point. You could argue that the NYD image was really scary because it didn't seem calculated enough - unlike Alice Cooper's - but then early Prince, same, still he went on to be acceptable.
― Maryann, Sunday, 10 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)
except i wish they were recorded a bit better. where was mutt lange back then?
― amateurist (amateurist), Friday, 13 June 2003 05:51 (twenty-two years ago)
and please god someone tell me why their first record always calls to mind "the pirates of penzance"!
― amateurist (amateurist), Friday, 13 June 2003 05:58 (twenty-two years ago)
johansen's entire performance on the first album is totally classic, especially his shangri-las rip on "looking for a kiss," but am i the only person who doesn't see what the big deal is about johnny thunders?
― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:06 (twenty-two years ago)
― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:06 (twenty-two years ago)
― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:07 (twenty-two years ago)
― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:07 (twenty-two years ago)
johnny thunders is like one of keith richard's musical tics made flesh.
― amateurist (amateurist), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:12 (twenty-two years ago)
mark s is wrong: Black Sabbath invented goth! Or maybe it was Black Widow. I've never heard them though, so I'll say it was the Sabs.
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:12 (twenty-two years ago)
― amateurist (amateurist), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:14 (twenty-two years ago)
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:14 (twenty-two years ago)
― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:15 (twenty-two years ago)
i really don't like his voice. johansen adds so much to the dolls i don't know why they bothered. it;s like that ccr album where the other people sing. what's the point?
― amateurist (amateurist), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:18 (twenty-two years ago)
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:19 (twenty-two years ago)
― amateurist (amateurist), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:29 (twenty-two years ago)
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 13 June 2003 06:37 (twenty-two years ago)
PS Alice Cooper mostly deserves credit/blame for turning rock concerts into a spectacle sport, although "Killer," "School's Out" and "Billion Dollar Babies" was as great a triple-crown run as the Replacements' "Let It Be," "Tim" and "Pleased To Meet Me."
― Chris Clark (Chris Clark), Friday, 13 June 2003 10:47 (twenty-two years ago)
btw, Alice Cooper and the Dolls are two of my favorite bands, I'm surprised I didn't notice this thread the first time around. And yeah Cooper had the better singles, but I could never ever choose between the two.
― Sean (Sean), Friday, 13 June 2003 14:24 (twenty-two years ago)
― duane, Friday, 13 June 2003 15:09 (twenty-two years ago)
― duane, Friday, 13 June 2003 15:10 (twenty-two years ago)
― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Friday, 13 June 2003 19:19 (twenty-two years ago)
(which guy in the clash?)
― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Saturday, 14 June 2003 05:24 (twenty-two years ago)
― jess (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 14 June 2003 05:37 (twenty-two years ago)
― scott seward, Saturday, 14 June 2003 05:45 (twenty-two years ago)
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Saturday, 14 June 2003 06:43 (twenty-two years ago)
― duane, Saturday, 14 June 2003 09:19 (twenty-two years ago)
(haha Pat Benatar = OK by me)
― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Sunday, 15 June 2003 04:56 (twenty-two years ago)
― Francis Watlington, Sunday, 15 June 2003 05:28 (twenty-two years ago)
― duane (doorag), Sunday, 15 June 2003 06:37 (twenty-two years ago)
― amateurist (amateurist), Sunday, 15 June 2003 06:41 (twenty-two years ago)
― duane (doorag), Sunday, 15 June 2003 06:45 (twenty-two years ago)
― jess (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 15 June 2003 06:46 (twenty-two years ago)
― David Allen, Sunday, 15 June 2003 06:47 (twenty-two years ago)
― duane (doorag), Sunday, 15 June 2003 06:51 (twenty-two years ago)
Thrilled that DavJoh finally made some money, although it figures it would come from extending "Stranded in the Jungle" into a full act.
>i don't think joe strummer played much gtr on their records tho
What?!? All that Telecaster dub-scratching/powerchord mania is him! Jones handled the Mott the Hoople lead lines and harmonic counterpoints. Both totally classic, as was Steve Jones, who merged Ramones chainsaw with Chuck Berry boogie (well, so did Eddie and the Hot Rods) to make the Pistols (dare I say it?) swing!
― Chris Clark (Chris Clark), Sunday, 15 June 2003 09:42 (twenty-two years ago)
― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Sunday, 15 June 2003 09:45 (twenty-two years ago)
It used to be the sign-off song of one of the old WNEW-FM jocks. Dennis Elsas, I think.
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 01:32 (one year ago)
Guess this is all going back to what was earlier said about The Dolls being a quintessential NYC band which goes way beyond some Lou Reed egg-cream stickball phony baloney nostalgia.
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 01:38 (one year ago)
Oh there’s a rhyme: Johansen’s Mansion, do u see?
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 02:27 (one year ago)
Did the Dolls play Ringolevio?
― timellison, Monday, 3 March 2025 02:46 (one year ago)
Heh
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 02:50 (one year ago)
Something about his song selection reminds me a wee bit of Jonesy’s Jukebox.
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 03:01 (one year ago)
can’t decide whether to keep listening to this or go sing a few of his songs at karaoke
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 04:02 (one year ago)
The latter
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 05:59 (one year ago)
which did you singi would do Trash, Jet Boy and ? cant decide on third
― werewolves of laudanum (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 3 March 2025 06:05 (one year ago)
Mystery Girls!
― sleeve, Monday, 3 March 2025 06:08 (one year ago)
given that yr first 2 are perfect
“Build Me Up Buttercup” and “Pills”
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 06:29 (one year ago)
May try for “Trash” soon
Also just found a video for “Looking for a Kiss.”
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 06:31 (one year ago)
A band from San Antonio called Sons of Hercules used to do an awesome version of “Who Are the Mystery Girls?”
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 06:33 (one year ago)
They still exist! Maybe they are still doing it
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 06:34 (one year ago)
He just said “Right here! In the Manse. With Johanse.”
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 06:47 (one year ago)
Sounds like Amalia Rodrigues right now
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 07:10 (one year ago)
Laura Nyro now
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 07:17 (one year ago)
Really enjoying listening to this but need to sleep. Maybe I will put that gigantic playlist on shuffle mode tomorrow
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 07:18 (one year ago)
We picked the kid up Sunday morning after a sleepover and were running errands, listening to the Dolls & my wife, who went through a deep Buster Poindexter phase in 80s asked to hear "Hot Hot Hot" and the moment it came on the ten y.o. was all "what is this? what is this?" and barely a minute later she was singing "hot!hot!hot!" and laughing which seems like as fitting a tribute as anything, RIP David
― chr1sb3singer, Monday, 3 March 2025 14:21 (one year ago)
It's funny, because in the UK, "Hot Hot Hot" is Arrow, and nobody else.
― Mark G, Monday, 3 March 2025 14:27 (one year ago)
Listing to the big Mansion of Fun playlist now.
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 15:23 (one year ago)
What with all the jump blues in there it’s making me think of Charlie Gillet’s Sound of the City
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 15:24 (one year ago)
Gillett
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Monday, 3 March 2025 15:25 (one year ago)
Xgau Remembers
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/david-johansen-new-york-dolls-robert-christgau-1235286728/
Neither the 1973 debut New York Dolls nor its 1974 follow-up Too Much Too Soon — produced by Shadow Morton, whose sole major credit was the legendary girl group the Shangri-Las — cracked the Top 100, great albums though both are now thought to be. The finale of the follow-up summed up what Johansen would be about till the day he died — titled simply “Human Being,” its tireless refrain went simply: “Well if I’m acting like a king, that’s because/I’m a human being.” And on a personal note, I’ll add that those two lines were the title I proposed for a criticism collection that in the end was called Grown Up All Wrong. A little long, Harvard thought, and that wasn’t all.
― Okay, heteros are cutting edge this year, too. (C. Grisso/McCain), Tuesday, 4 March 2025 17:47 (one year ago)
Saw that.
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 4 March 2025 18:19 (one year ago)
that was great. I have always enjoyed xgau the most when he writes about the Dolls. I like him in fan-boy mode <3
― werewolves of laudanum (VegemiteGrrl), Tuesday, 4 March 2025 19:07 (one year ago)
cant even imagine how thrilling it must have been seeing the 72 shows at the Mercer
― werewolves of laudanum (VegemiteGrrl), Tuesday, 4 March 2025 19:12 (one year ago)
i love this video of Mystery Girls from Maxs Kansas City ‘73 - they’re so on it! makes me want to timetravel to see this gig https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chd_JUkec8M
― werewolves of laudanum (VegemiteGrrl), Tuesday, 4 March 2025 19:39 (one year ago)
man yeah. just squarely ON it
― J Edgar Noothgrush (Joan Crawford Loves Chachi), Tuesday, 4 March 2025 20:32 (one year ago)
I like him in fan-boy mode <3
There's a documentary about NYC (pre-)punk where Christgau's one of the interviewees, and the level of involvement increases palpably once he gets to talk about the Dolls instead of the Velvet Underground.
― Halfway there but for you, Tuesday, 4 March 2025 20:47 (one year ago)
I was wondering what happened to that video, it went missing the last time I posted it myself, thanks.
― Blind Willie Minitel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 5 March 2025 01:26 (one year ago)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08MuQAC5zpw
― Who Are the Mystery URLs? (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 6 March 2025 19:35 (one year ago)
Not that I needed assurance, but my listening to the Dolls and DJ again in the last few days helped me realize anew what a first-rate lyricist he was.
― the talented mr pimply (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 6 March 2025 19:36 (one year ago)
I was wondering what ever happened to the New York Doll Hospital on Lexington Ave between 61st/62nd Sts which inspired the band’s name… bc I remember spying the old NY Doll Hospital sign when it was still in business and suddenly realizing that’s where the name came from, and feeling the thrill of historical connection.
It’s now an establishment called 787 Unique Head Spa. And not for nothing, Unique Head strikes me as a good band name as well.
― Josefa, Friday, 7 March 2025 01:25 (one year ago)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kH8TuI2uzvo
― Who Are the Mystery URLs? (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 7 March 2025 01:26 (one year ago)
I was wondering what ever happened to the New York Doll Hospital on Lexington Ave between 61st/62nd Sts which inspired the band’s name… bc I remember spying the old NY Doll Hospital sign when it was still in business and suddenly realizing that’s where the name came from, and feeling the thrill of historical connection.It’s now an establishment called 787 Unique Head Spa. And not for nothing, Unique Head strikes me as a good band name as well.
― Who Are the Mystery URLs? (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 7 March 2025 01:28 (one year ago)
I was in the laundromat one day when it occurred to me that 80 Lb. Speed Queen would be a great band name. (Speed Queen is a brand of industrial clothes dryer.)
― Instead of create and send out, it pull back and consume (unperson), Friday, 7 March 2025 01:38 (one year ago)
80 lb Speed Queen = Taylor Mead?
Sorry, I’ll see myself out
― Josefa, Friday, 7 March 2025 02:34 (one year ago)
Spin Article about Quintano's School for Young Professionals, where Johnny, Syl and Billy apparently went:https://books.google.com/books/about/SPIN.html?id=-6u53go_Q1oC
― The Man Who Sold the Unisphere (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 15 May 2026 15:21 (one week ago)
Page 92.
― The Man Who Sold the Unisphere (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 15 May 2026 15:22 (one week ago)
91 really.
90 to see the photos
― The Man Who Sold the Unisphere (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 15 May 2026 15:23 (one week ago)
just posted this previously uncirculated (and great) tape of the Dolls in late 72: https://doomandgloomfromthetomb.tumblr.com/post/816597663926697984/ny-dolls-mercerThere's also a nice vinyl edition making the rounds.
https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/m4QAAeSwCbZp92Ft/s-l1600.webp
― tylerw, Friday, 15 May 2026 16:02 (one week ago)
Nice, thanks!
― The Man Who Sold the Unisphere (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 15 May 2026 16:56 (one week ago)
I always love the weird high backing vocals on things like "Pills" and "Trash," both of which I assume are Johnny.
― The Man Who Sold the Unisphere (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 15 May 2026 17:03 (one week ago)
Heh, like how a bunch of tracks are just Tuning, so you can edit out if you want, although I don't want.
― The Man Who Sold the Unisphere (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 15 May 2026 19:32 (one week ago)
hey thanks for the heads up on that dolls boot. there's also this late-inning johansen single:
https://schnitzel.co.uk/2026/david-johansen/
― Thus Sang Freud, Saturday, 16 May 2026 22:26 (one week ago)
Can we be shown weirdos + L-U-V?
― The Man Who Sold the Unisphere (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 17 May 2026 02:03 (one week ago)