Emo: Classic or Dud (cf. Fake Glasses: Classic or Dud)

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A valuable period of working thru adolescense, or lamentable wankery? You decide for me, because I am fond of the Get Up Kids and am confused by said fondness.

― JM, Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

complete and total DUD.

― chaki, Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

What IS emo ? Are Sebadoh, Superchunk emo? If so, emo is a synonym for crap, isn't it?

― Dr. C, Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

i've said this before but

if "emo" = desperate screams over violent noisy jilted post-hardcore, then an essential piece of 90s rock culture.

the rest can hang.

― sundar subramanian, Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I hate listening to most of it, with the occasional exception. I used to think that all emo kids were just ridiculous scenesters who should be shot post-haste, but I have a friend who is really, genuinely into it and couldn't care less about looking cool. Still, just like jangly college rock twenty years ago, emo is the soundtrack to the angst and malaise of millions of young people who hate their dad and wish they could have a significant other to hold their hands and listen to their story about the asshole at Starbucks who made them leave after loitering for 8 hours.

― Dave M., Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

There was a time when emo mattered... Rites of Spring, the first Jawbreaker album, Fugazi and Soulside... Gibson SGs through Marshall half-stacks.... it was soulful and sincere. I remembering travelling around the great US in those years (88-93?) and it was the soundtrack to the times.. now I find it totally fucking boring. Who wants sincerity? I want to rock.

― Andy, Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Still, just like jangly college rock twenty years ago, emo is the soundtrack to the angst and malaise of millions of young people who hate their dad and wish they could have a significant other to hold their hands and listen to their story about the asshole at Starbucks who made them leave after loitering for 8 hours.

this emo stuff sounds brilliant.

― sundar subramanian, Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

"Emo" = "nu-metal" on a budget. The attitudes of, to pick an emo band totally at random, Death Cab for Cutie aren't that much different than those of Limp Bizkit. Both genres consist of entirely too much brainless whining with a corresponding lack of musical chops.

Ergo, dud.

― Tadeusz Suchodolski, Wednesday, 13 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

What's always confused me: Do Sleater-Kinney count as emo? They have, erm, that cutting', angular guitar style it seems to me, but they also have big tunes that hit you over the head wanting to be heard and are a nice pop band to boot. (Though I'm sure many disagree with me here!) In fact, I'm not at all sure what a definition of an emo band is. Are Built To Spill emo? I saw them once and they bored me rigid, in which case, Emo=Dud. (In fact, Pavement, they may be indie rock,but are they emo? In fact, is emo just american college indie rock under another name?)

Bill

― Bill, Thursday, 14 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

BTS: no. Pavement: no. SK: uh, actually that's an interesting question, because of some of the similarities between their music and emo. But SK's music doesn't have its roots in hardcore or (I could easily be disagreed with here - but it sures sounds different from the hardcore I've heard, and emo to boot) the punk-pop type of stuff that is increasingly also part of 'emo'. Also they're chicks so you are required by law to call them 'riot grrl' or 'girl punk', as everyone knows emo can only be made by whiny indie boys.

So now what I want is some cites for actual (in terms of the music, i.e. in the more traditional sense) emo made by women, if such a thing is not against the laws of indie rock.

― Josh, Thursday, 14 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Female fronted emo band. Femo maybe.

― Jeff, Thursday, 14 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I was just about to get all smart-alecky and invent the "femo" genre when I find that Jeff has beaten me to it. Darn. I'm going to pig out on oestrogen, buy some tortoise-shell rimmed glasses and falsetto scream into a mic.

― Mitch Lastnamewithheld, Thursday, 14 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

emo primer.

no, of course, sleater-kinney, built to spill, pavement, sebadoh, and superchunk aren't emo.

― sundar subramanian, Friday, 15 June 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

three weeks pass...

actually, just buy the locust and feel its steel through your last bespectacled fanzine-writing get-up-kids-listening meal.

― sundar subramanian, Monday, 9 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Done properly emo is perfect for lonley nights. I havent had any for 7 years but i remember it fondly from when i did.

― anthony, Tuesday, 10 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I havent had any for 7 years but i remember it fondly from when i did.

Ooh err, missus! Have you tried sticking on Paul McCartney's 'No More Lonely Nights'? Is that emo?

Emo really is the funniest thing. Never has a genre provoked more confusion. In France they have petrol stations called 'Emo', which muddies the waters further. So it's been around for years then? Why didn't I hear the word till last year? Remind me why Pearl Jam aren't Emo, again. Is it a fake glasses thing? Come on, admit it. You're making it up as you go along.

― Nick, Tuesday, 10 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Pleased to see this thread reborn...

Emo came from DC in the 80's (which is why Pearl Jam don't count: after the fact, on the wrong coast and associated with Nirvana, Soundgarden and all o' them).

That fourfa.com site that Sundar posted has an overview of emo-history, and it becomes very, VERY disturbing after a bit in terms of its thoughtful thoroughness. I still can't tell if it was done straight or not. I mean, read the "How To Name Your Band" and "Emo Fashion" sections... I mean come ON. Curse my postmodern irony.

― JM, Tuesday, 10 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

pearl jam aren't emo 'cos they sound like whitesnake, love. look, here's a deal: i'll listen to an entire disc of the ronettes (or of spector girl groups if the ronettes don't have that much stuff) if you search out and listen to native nod's "tangled". other searches: fugazi - margin walker

hoover/lincoln "two- headed coin" split 7"

shotmaker/max colby split 12"

okara - months like years

camera obscura - to change the shape of an envelope

the locust

(kris, help me out here)

― sundar subramanian, Tuesday, 10 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

and i thought it was pretty clear they were joking about those parts, jimmy. i think he explicitly states so somewhere on the site.

― sundar subramanian, Tuesday, 10 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Oh good. That means I just can't read.

― JM, Tuesday, 10 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

The Locust are NOT emo. Christ, I hate the fucking term, but The Locust are as emo as Arab on Radar or The Flying Luttenbachers. I like The Locust tons, but they ARE NOT EMO. They are "power violence" (which is a stupid genre classification, though I loathe ALL genre classifications).

I always joke that the typical emo band features a pre-pubescent boy yelping about breaking up with his girlfriend at the drive-in the day before he moves out of Wisconsin. (Well, I modify the joke, and it's not so funny as it is slightly humorous, but, you get the drift.) But, then, I'm the type of guy that can listen to an nth-generation Shellac knock-off do their sub-Slint thing until the cows offer pre- wrapped cheese from their udders.

― David Raposa, Wednesday, 11 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

two months pass...

My gosh, it's amazing that almost _nobody_ knows what emo is. Sleater-Kinney, Fugazi? Puh-leeze. For my money, Sunny Day Real Estate is the ultimate emo band.

― Jack Redelfs, Sunday, 23 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

It's unfortunate that the term emo was stolen by a bunch of wussies. They took what was an incredibly powerful, emotional genre and removed any energy & testocerone that it had, turning it into a bunch of middle-class white boys whining about girls. The Promise Ring killed emo.

Classic emo records: Heroin s/t LP (or anything on Gravity (pre-Clikitat Ikatowi) Mohinder 7" Universal Order of Armegeddon 12" Ordination of Aaron "Eli" 7" Frail 7" (on Kidney Room)

― d_jurnove@hotmail.com, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

three months pass...

emo=waifle, love lost, orchid, saetia, etc. it is emotionally honest music, usually heartwrenching. it is NOT jimmy eat world, get up kids, saves the day-- thats pop punk. pop punk is completely different, they just stole the "emo look"

― c.amory, Sunday, 6 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

i'm surprised that the entire time this thread has been running no one has mentioned the hated or moss icon (i'm looking in yr direction dave)...kids these days...(::shakes head and goes back to refiling his gravity singles::)

― jess, Sunday, 6 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Emo is what is, for no explicitly stated reason, played on the loudspeaker at a record store near me from morning to night. The kidz - as they are wont to be called - wander into the store, big brute things with unnaturally barbed hairdos that sway slightly in the breeze, enticed by the sound of a cat dying within, only to find out that it is in fact the latest EMO rekkord imported directly from the States. Then they pause, artfully, waiting for a momentary respite in the, yes, very emotive, very touching, very moving EMO musik to request politely: "do you have any REAL PUNK?" A bored man resting his elbows lazily on an open copy of "No Depression" behind the counter waves nonchalantly towards the deepest, darkest, dankest edge of the shop, wherein such alcoves as "TERRORCORE", "SLUDGEFEST" and even "PUNK" give rise to the noxious odours of compressed teenage sweat that run the store's small thermal power turbines. Meanwhile the EMO is kept on a neat little display rack at the front desk, although whether it is for the startling and perhaps inappropriate sociability of display possibilities or because the emo kidz prefer the comfort of being near the man behind the counter is uncertain at this early juncture. I note covers depicting frail trees, or pieces of cloth clumsiliy stitched together, or a lock of hair entwining a stone cherry. "What do these images mean?" I wonder, "and what could their makers have wanted to convey to their listeners, or indeed me, the non-emo-listener, who has never knowingly bought an emo record in my life?" I resolve to put aside these pressing issues, for having braved the deadly fume-spitting alcoves to find a DISCOUNT rack, I now approach the counter with a copy of Jay-Z's Hard Knock Life album in my hand. As I hand it to counter-guy he looks at me incredulously and a bit suspiciously, half-surprised to find someone wanting to buy a hip hop album in his store and half- surprised that his store would even have said hip hop album. I hold money in my hand though, so he does not confront me on this issue. On the little "now playing" platform next to his arm I notice a PROMISE RING single, which has replaced whatever EMO-SCREAMS I had heard prior with some for-now instrumental nervy guitar ramblings. As I leave, I resolve to return to this store and study its goings-on, its inhabitants and customs, and to find out whether my culture could find some sort of common ground with this strange alien breed. But then, a strange fear gripped me which I found difficult to shrug off... for WHAT EVIL might face Tim once he ventures further into the MYSTERIOUS DEN OF EMO?????

(Here Ends Part One. Stay tuned for PART TWO: LOST IN THE LAND WITHOUT BASS GUITARS)

― Tim, Sunday, 6 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Man! All we need now are Al's illustrations. ;-)

― Ned Raggett, Sunday, 6 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Moss Icon's big secret: they were all dumb except for Monica.

The Hated's big secret: We all loved King Crimson.

― Colin Meeder, Thursday, 17 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Colin, you still haven't answered my totally ridiculous question on the Heroin thread.

― David Raposa, Thursday, 17 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Now I jave. Twice, even.

― Colin Meeder, Thursday, 17 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Anyone in the market for a copy of Moss Icon's It Disappears?

― sundar subramanian, Thursday, 17 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I like Brian Emo. He's got glasses without any actual glass in them.

― Sean Carruthers, Thursday, 17 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

emo is music it's the music people listen to when they are sad and need something

placing a label on a genre or a band is something people do so they can identify it quickly and easily, and labels lead to misunderstanding and confusion

people can make fun of it and hate it for being weak and depressing or people can love it because it gives hope and it's powerful

it doesn't matter that much it's music and music is all good

― chase s., Thursday, 24 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

dddduuuuuudddddd

― bob snoom, Friday, 25 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

four months pass...

I've read through all the answers first in an effort not to wank this up and make myself look foolish, but plenty of the people here are succumbing to the most common mistake about emo. It's not just anything with guitars and a mildly annoyed frontman, in fact if anything it could be described as more of a scene than a genre. A purist will say a new band can't even BE emo, because emo has been and gone. But that's probably because a purist will be hopelessly retrospective... But they're right about it being a scene, mostly around DC, and then spreading to the midwest after a little while, and after a bigger while even over to the northeast. In response to the people (not here) who say Emo's not punk, well it depends which of the myriad style and subgenres you listen to, and what part of the scene the band came from. You can be 90% sure that what these kids are referring to is post emo indie rock, and in that sense they're right, most of it is more.. power pop. I love it all the same, but you couldn't call it punk rock. But all the stuff that came pretty much straight out of hardcore, well.. only a moron could say it didn't have any punk credibility. Rites of Spring, Dag Nasty, are hard and loud and fast, with their roots firmly in the hardcore scene of the early 80s. So what if they started singing about girls instead of politics? Hardcore is forward looking, Emo is mostly retrospective. Of course there will be contradictions and crossovers between the scenes, as there always is with music. But in answer to anyone who says Emo is dud, I suggest they open their mind about it, and realise that a) emo isn't just anything with any emotion, and b) there are many more forms of emo than they realise. Real emo is some of the most honest heartfelt music you will ever hear. You can call me a wimp and a geek now.

― Rob Moeser, Thursday, 30 May 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

wimp. geek.

― electric sound of jim, Thursday, 30 May 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

emo started in the mid-80s with bands like rites of spring,and evolved out of the early 80s dc hardcore like minor threat. these bands went onto to influence many early 90s extremly intense emotive hardcore / emo-core bands like heroin,mohinder,indian summer, still life,moss icon and such. but it suddenly became a slower more indie rock sound with bands like boys life and sunny day real estate. in more recent years it became extremely crappy commericial mtv 2 buss shit pop punk mtv 2 rock like dashboard confessional,saves the day,jimmy eat world,and thursday. they ruined it for everyone.

― alex, Wednesday, 5 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

one month passes...

how can anyone forget Julia and Navio Forge...both made some of the most emotionally intense music I have heard...try: Navio Forge: haloed eyes (you may think it is cheezy as hell, if you aren't receptive to hearing another human being in pain---my roomate laughs like mad whenever i play it)...umm, yeah..whatever

― bg, Saturday, 6 July 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago)

Problem #1: What is the "definitive definition" of emo? The term is used so loosely, and thrown around so much, that it's really hard to pin down all the "true emo" bands - if there is such a thing. What one may consider emo, another may not. Take Modest Mouse for example, or Radiohead, or Neutral Milk Hotel. Sure, there are some that may be "obviously emo," such as Sunny Day Real Estate, but what's makes this band "emo", and another band "not-emo"?

Problem #2: Rating a genre as prolific as emo based on a handful of it's (qualifying) artists is as pointless as rating an individual artist as prolific as David Tibet based on a handful of his songs. Most of us who listen to music haven't heard the "majority" of "emo" albums, so none of us are really qualified to make an accurate assessment of the genre itself. In other words, most of us here are not emo-experts. And any self-proclaimed emo-expert better be willing to back up his or her arguments soundly.

Conclusion: It's fine that we generalize the whole based on a handful of examples. It's human. But it's also human to err. That "totally emo" album you listened to and loved/hated may or may not be the definitive, or even close to the definitive, emo album. Which leads us back to problem #1. Blah!

― Philip Gomez, Sunday, 7 July 2002 00:00 (twenty-two years ago)

eight months pass...

Part 2, Tim, part 2!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 17 March 2003 07:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Dud w/o question.
As far as the glasses go cheer up and get some colored contacts

― girl scout heroin (iamamonkey), Monday, 17 March 2003 07:35 (twenty-two years ago)

I saw the ataris in a record shop (and they sucked )are they emo?
cause they sure felt emo

― girl scout heroin (iamamonkey), Monday, 17 March 2003 08:31 (twenty-two years ago)

emo is a synonym for crap, isn't it?
dr.c. has never been more otm. not that i know what emo is. but i like the enhancements of emo mentioned here. brian emo and femo sound great to my ears. i also like emoo like in electric mooing.

― alex in mainhattan (alex63), Monday, 17 March 2003 10:11 (twenty-two years ago)

tim were you talking about missing link?

― minna (minna), Monday, 17 March 2003 12:55 (twenty-two years ago)

one year passes...

there is still some great emo stuff knocking around. the likes of yaphet kotto, the pine, die emperor die, life at these speeds --- these bands have all made records that measure up to the best of the mid 90's.

― el_bastardo, Friday, 20 August 2004 09:03 (twenty years ago)

im no expert on emo - not by a long shot. but to me, just the name Emo turns me off. i dunno. if i liked emo music, i'd probably be apologetic for the name.

― AaronK (AaronK), Friday, 20 August 2004 11:17 (twenty years ago)

four months pass...

so that sebadoh / Pavement slacker thing isn't EMO?

― Savin All My Love 4 u (Savin 4ll my (heart) 4u), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 03:24 (twenty years ago)

Correct.

― Jimmy Mod always makes friends with women before bedding them down (ModJ), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 04:00 (twenty years ago)

look im otm in 2001!

― chaki in charge (chaki), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 04:03 (twenty years ago)

my friend got prescription-less glasses in 1999 b/c he was in an emo band!!!!!! then we made fun of him and he stiopped wearing them; i think hes still in em o bands

― jake b. (cerybut), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 07:13 (twenty years ago)

The glasses are sexy, I don't care how lame the scene is.

― sleep (sleep), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 07:51 (twenty years ago)

on girls anyway.

― sleep (sleep), Wednesday, 5 January 2005 07:52 (twenty years ago)

To confuse the great ARE SEBADOH EMO debate, Lou Barlow has called his new solo album, EMOH. Comedy gold!

― stew, Wednesday, 5 January 2005 10:50 (twenty years ago)

one year passes...

i just used the phrase "emo icon" in a review.

however the ed rightly has doubts:

"i wonder if we need to spell this out for our readers [...] - would neo-goth in brackets do it?"

can anyone do better?

― a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 12:25 (eighteen years ago)

bump

― a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 13:48 (eighteen years ago)

BUMP

― a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 14:51 (eighteen years ago)

Can someone explain how emo went from Death Cab/Bright Eyes/The Get Up Kids to My Chemical Romance/Fall Out Boy/Panic! At the (death of a) Disco (dancer)*?

Because when I was a teen I got called emo for liking Bright Eyes, but now my sister is all "they're so EMO" about her new high school, while ironically(?) wearing a MCR shirt.

I'm so confused. Are all artists who admit to ever having cried emo? Are the Smiths emo now?

*Credit to an unknown ILMEr whose post I saw a few weeks ago which made me spit out coffee

― his sister pam (hissisterpam), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 15:00 (eighteen years ago)

Can someone explain how emo went from Death Cab/Bright Eyes/The Get Up Kids to My Chemical Romance/Fall Out Boy/Panic! At the (death of a) Disco (dancer)*?

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/c/cd/250px-Rivers-cuomo.jpg

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 15:01 (eighteen years ago)

Hahahahaha. But my (small, but affectionate) love of Weezer was before I heard any of those other bands! I feel that there is some Conor Oberst/Pete Wentz hybrid out there who I missed in my Classic Rock phase..

Damn, I just googled to put an age on this Conorete hybrid, and it turns out Pete Wentz is actually a year OLDER than Conor? What the hell?

Thank you all the same, Dom. I just want to understand my siblings!

― his sister pam (hissisterpam), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 15:08 (eighteen years ago)

Conor's pretty young, dude. He formed Bright Eyes in the womb.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 15:57 (eighteen years ago)

Rites of Spring is as classic as it gets.

― MRZBW (MRZBW), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 17:15 (eighteen years ago)

THREAD IS OUT OF TOUCH

― This is My Way.... (blastocyst), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 19:43 (eighteen years ago)

Someone should form a band called the Electric Moping Orchestra.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 20:09 (eighteen years ago)

Conor's pretty young, dude. He formed Bright Eyes in the womb

This one made me spill my 7-up all over my keyboard.

― Marty Innerlogic (marty innerlogic), Wednesday, 13 September 2006 20:37 (eighteen years ago)

STILL WNAT ANSWER BITCHES

― a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Thursday, 14 September 2006 07:22 (eighteen years ago)

If the Daily Mail's running articles on Emo, you ought to be able to print it without explanation. Can't spoonfeed people.

― Why does my IQ changes? (noodle vague), Thursday, 14 September 2006 07:25 (eighteen years ago)

i know right :(

― a rapper singing about hos and bitches and money (Enrique), Thursday, 14 September 2006 07:27 (eighteen years ago)

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