Harmolodics -- GO!!

Message Bookmarked

Bookmark Removed

What is it - in layman's terms?

i've read that it means "the rhythms, harmonies, and tempos are all equal in relationship and independent melodies at the same time"

but what the hell does that mean?

― JasonD (JasonD), Thursday, 6 February 2003 18:43 (twenty-two years ago)

You get to play whatever you want, as long as it all sounds like the same thing over and over again.

― Rockist Scientist, Thursday, 6 February 2003 18:52 (twenty-two years ago)

here's how Don Cherry explained this (this is taken from Marcello's review of Pil's metal Box):

''And indeed, if you listen to Ornette Coleman's 1977 Dancing In Your Head album - one of the half-dozen or so most important records of the last 40 years - in tandem with Ulmer's own Tales Of Captain Black (Artists House, 1979) - you can hear clearly how this process works with "harmonic" instruments (i.e. the guitars). Harmolodics is a difficult concept to explain at the best of the time, but Don Cherry once summed it up neatly when he explained to me that essentially you improvise on the melody rather than the chordal structure, and that you solo pretty well all of the time but keep out of everyone else's way.''

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Thursday, 6 February 2003 18:55 (twenty-two years ago)

that's funny and informative, but sucks as a technical description

― JasonD (JasonD), Thursday, 6 February 2003 18:56 (twenty-two years ago)

well true but this concept sunk in a bit more when I read that. There's also a James Blood Ulmer interview in an old wire issue where he explained this actually (I thought it was quite good but i can't rememeber so I'll look it up).

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Thursday, 6 February 2003 18:59 (twenty-two years ago)

Harmolodics is just tonal extension with a beat. It's a meaningless term. Sounds good, though. Unless you go for pure rhythm, all music has some psychological reason for being, some extension or reduction of its harmonic base, and good music does all that for a reason, to produce an effect. If you start layering chords on top of each other and can do it in an intelligent way, you have harmolodics. I agree with Julio above, Ornette's "Dancing" and the first few albums by Ulmer are some of the most important records of the past 40 years; I would put "Trout Mask" and "Lick My Decals Off" by Beefheart in there, and maybe Brown's "Sex Machine"-era work too...

― Edd Hurt (delta ed), Thursday, 6 February 2003 19:00 (twenty-two years ago)

It was definitely the part about "solo pretty well all of the time" that Neil Hagerty took note of.

― Paula G., Thursday, 6 February 2003 19:02 (twenty-two years ago)

that was a quote. The statement is taken from Marcello Carlin's Blog (he posts here but hasn't been lately). I haven't heard 'Dancing in yr head'but i have heard other Ornette.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Thursday, 6 February 2003 19:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Harmolodic rock - Grateful Dead, Raincoats "Odyshape" is modal harmolodics, Gorguts "Obscura", many Rush guitar solos ("Freewill" comes to mind), "Dancing In Your Head" obviously. Maybe some Joy Division but I don't know enough about them.

One clue is what the bass is doing -- is it accenting the rhythm, providing harmony, or is it playing around with the melody? Usually harmolodic bass is doing all three. So are the other instruments, but that's probably less obvious. Otherwise you sort of know it when you hear it.

― Kris (aqueduct), Thursday, 6 February 2003 20:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Definition complicated by Ornette's latter-day habit of describing anything he likes, musical or otherwise, as "very harmolodic."

― Douglas (Douglas), Friday, 7 February 2003 16:42 (twenty-two years ago)

Wouldn't the first part of the above Cherry quote apply to pretty much all rock solos?

― Nick A. (Nick A.), Friday, 7 February 2003 16:43 (twenty-two years ago)

three years pass...

I think this is a really great post on/explanation of harmolodics, by Ethan Iverson: http://thebadplus.typepad.com/dothemath/2006/10/prelude.html

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 17 October 2006 20:00 (eighteen years ago)

Wouldn't the first part of the above Cherry quote apply to pretty much all rock solos?

-- Nick A.

No -- pretty much all rock solos improvise on chords.

― Mark (MarkR), Tuesday, 17 October 2006 20:03 (eighteen years ago)

You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.