Most minimal record ever

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I'll start the bidding with 4 Violins by Tony Conrad (played VERY LOUD).

― Neil Simpson, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:17 (twenty-two years ago)

minimal or minimalist?

― hstencil, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:18 (twenty-two years ago)

You're going to have to define what you mean by each I'm afraid.

― neil simpson, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:22 (twenty-two years ago)

4:27 seconds by john cage - just silence

― Robin Goad (rgoad), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:24 (twenty-two years ago)

a record could be minimal without being minimalist. I think of the latter as a reference to a specific group (La Monte Young, Tony, Charlemagne Palestine, Steve Reich et al) which is more unified by historical context than actual sound. As in, there's tons of minimal techno stuff, but I don't think of it as minimalist in the way that I think of Tony Conrad's stuff.

― hstencil, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:27 (twenty-two years ago)

how about this?

― Aaron W (Aaron W), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:30 (twenty-two years ago)

John Zorn - Red Bird

― A Nairn (moretap), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:31 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh and *cough cough* it's "4'33," not "4'27."

― Aaron W (Aaron W), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:31 (twenty-two years ago)

why don't you consider minimal techno in the same way as Tony Conrad's stuff? One of the reasons I think Aphex Twin's drukqs such an amazing record is that it is a blatant attempt to link techno composition to minimalist composition (via the prepared piano) and its predecesors (Schoenberg, Satie etc.)

Those six seconds make all the difference.

― neil simpson, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Because minimal techno didn't arise out of the western classical tradition. I'm not saying one's better than the other (I like both, btw), just that they have different historical contexts and connotations.

― hstencil, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:39 (twenty-two years ago)

I've just heard some music made by dot matrix printers that was pretty minimal.

― Lynskey (Lynskey), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:40 (twenty-two years ago)

Pretty much anything by Bernhard Guenter.

― Douglas (Douglas), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:45 (twenty-two years ago)

But were the printers minimal in the western classical tradition?

Again, why I think drukqs is important is that it attempts to link the two traditions (techno + western classical) and demonstrates that they are not fundamentally different as both are concerned with duration, texture and the entirety of audio experience (particularly the more 'abstract' end of techno occupied by aphex, autechre etc etc etc).

― neil simpson, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:49 (twenty-two years ago)

There's a Lull album or two that's barely there.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 15:59 (twenty-two years ago)

Spacemen 3 - _Dreamweapon_. Ohhh yeahhhhhh.

― Matt Maxwell (Matt M.), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 16:02 (twenty-two years ago)

minimalist = much repetition
minimal = very quiet

Am I right?

― original bgm, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 16:04 (twenty-two years ago)

4 Violins contradics both of those definitions being both minimal and minimalist while being loud, even when played quietly, and unrepetetive as it has no rhythm, melody etc. and is essentially just texture. 'grey noise' (ok 'gray noise' for all you fundamentalist republican warmongers) as opposed to 'white noise' is the phrse which I have just invented for it.

― neil simpson, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 16:10 (twenty-two years ago)

(It's 4'27" with PAL speedup.)

― Amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 16:12 (twenty-two years ago)

I think minimalist music is just music composed with the fewest elements possible. I don't know think repetition is required, even though some of the most famous min. composers use it lots.

A lot of new improv takes advantage of silence in music. I attended a show with Keith Rowe and Toshi Nakamura this weekend, where they played an excercise with a larger ensemble: 15 minutes, and each person is only allowed to make one statement, and then must be silent for the remainder of the piece.

― dleone (dleone), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 16:13 (twenty-two years ago)

Okay, so I'll shut up then, and just list some favorites:

Robert Ashley, Automatic Writing (Lovely Music/Vital Records, VR 1002) LP
David Behrman, Leapday Night (Lovely Music, VR 1042) LP
David Behrman, Wave Train (Alga Marghen, plana-B 5NMN.020) 2LP
John Cale/Tony Conrad/Angus MacLise/La Monte Young/Marian Zazeela, Inside the Dream Syndicate Volume I: Day of Niagara (1965) (Table of the Elements, TOE-CD-74) CD
John Cale, Sun Blindness Music (Table of the Elements, TOE-CD-75) CD
R. Chartier, Direct. Incidental. Consequential. (Intransitive, 005) CD
Tony Conrad with Faust, Outside the Dream Syndicate (Caroline, C 1501) LP
Tony Conrad with Faust, “The Pyre of Angus Was in Kathmandu”/”The Death of the Composer Was In 1962” (Table of the Elements, 3 Lithium) 7"
Tony Conrad/Gastr del Sol, “The Japanese Room at La Pagode”/”May” (Table of the Elements, 29 Copper) 2x7"
Tony Conrad, Four Violins (Table of the Elements, 17) LP
Tony Conrad, Slapping Pythagoras (Table of the Elements, 23 Vanadium) CD
Tony Conrad, Early Minimalism Volume One (Table of the Elements, Arsenic 33), 4CD
Philip Corner, Pictures of Pictures from Pictures of Pictures (Edition Block, EB 106) LP
Philip Corner, Metal Meditations (Alga Marghen, ALGA 008) LP
Philip Corner, Word-Voices (Alga Marghen, ALGA 010) LP
Arnold Dreyblatt & The Orchestra of Excited Strings, Nodal Excitation (India Navigation, IN 3024) LP
Arnold Dreyblatt & the Orchestra of Excited Strings, Propellers in Love (hat ART, 6011) CD
Arnold Dreyblatt, Animal Magnetism (Tzadik, TZ 7004) CD
John Duncan, Tap Internal (Touch, Touch Tone 11) CD
Brian Eno, Discreet Music (Obscure, obscure no. 3) LP
Brian Eno, Ambient 1: Music for Airports (Editions EG, EGS 201) LP
Harold Budd/Brian Eno, Ambient 2: The Plateaux of Mirror (Editions EG, EGS 202) LP
Brian Eno, Ambient 4: On Land (Editions EG, EGED 20) LP
Morton Feldman, New Directions in Music 2 (Columbia Masterworks, ML5403) LP
Morton Feldman, Rothko Chapel/For Frank O'Hara (Columbia/Odyssey, Y 34138) LP
Harley Gaber, The Winds Rise in the North (Titanic, Ti 16-17) 2LP
Gas, Konigsforst (Mille Plateaux, MPLP65) 2LP
Gas, Pop (Mille Plateaux, MPLP83) 2LP
Philip Glass, Music in Similar Motion/Music in Fifths (Chatham Square, 1003) LP
Philip Glass, Solo Music (Shandar, 83 515) LP
CM von Hausswolff, Operations of Spirit Communication (Die Stadt, DS31) LP
Ryoji Ikeda, "+/-" (Touch, TO:30) CD
Thomas Koner, Permafrost (Barooni, BAR 009) CD
Takehisa Kosugi, Catch-Wave LP
Alan Licht, Sink the Aging Process (Siltbreeze, SB31) LP
Donald Miller/Michael J. Schumacher, Flood (Warpodisc, WD04) CD
Phill Niblock, Niblock for Celli (India Navigation, IN 3027) LP
Phill Niblock, Touch Works, for Hurdy Gurdy and Voice (Touch, TO:49) CD
Phill Niblock, G2, 44+1x2 (Moikai, M12CD) CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Strumming Music (Shandar) LP
Charlemagne Palestine, Schlingen Blangen (New World Records, 80578-2) CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Four Manifestations on Six Elements (Barooni, BAR 014) CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Karenina (Durturo, no number) 2CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Jamaica Heinekens In Brooklyn (Barooni, BAR 021) CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Schlongo!!!daLUVdrone (Cortical Foundation, organ of Corti 23) CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Alloy (Alga Marghen, plana-P 13NMN.035) CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Continuous Sound Forms (Alga Marghen, plana-P 14NMN.036) CD
Charlemagne Palestine, Music for Big Ears (Staalplaat, std 156) CD
Folke Rabe, What?? (Dexter's Cigar, dex12) CD
Steve Reich, Live/Electric Music (Columbia Masterworks, MS 7265) LP
Steve Reich, Four Organs/Phase Patterns (Shandar, SR 10.005) LP
Terry Riley, A Rainbow in Curved Air (Columbia Masterworks, MS 7315) LP
Terry Riley, In C (Columbia Masterworks) LP
Stilluppsteypa, Reduce By Reducing (Fire Inc./Some, f-15/some11) CD
Richard Youngs, Advent (No Fans, NFR 01) LP

Love AFX too.

― hstencil, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 16:15 (twenty-two years ago)

'4:33' isn't minimal at all. It's not actually silent as such. I thought the whole idea was to get the audience listening to the sounds around them, which then make up the 'music' of the piece. So in theory, '4:33' can contain all sorts of noises. And if you did a performance of it at this time of year it'd be full of people coughing.

― James Ball (James Ball), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 17:30 (twenty-two years ago)

It would be very minimal of the performance took place inside an anechoic chamber.

― Mark (MarkR), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 17:32 (twenty-two years ago)

any Pole album

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 17:40 (twenty-two years ago)

in its context,the most minimal track ever seems to be the last track on decks,fx and 909 by richie hawtin...
its probably not all that minimal,but the mix somehows goes from banging techno to this minimal dub sounding carry on,for some reason...
haven't heard it in a while,and i remember the track being quite good,but it always seems like such an odd way to end a techno mix...

― robin (robin), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 17:46 (twenty-two years ago)

The Days Run Away by Peter Garland on Tzadik is one of the more minimal(ist) records I have - it's very simple (perhaps deceptively so), mostly repetitive, piano pieces using a v. small, deliberate number of notes.

― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 17:50 (twenty-two years ago)

Did those kick-drum-only tracks the KLF predicted ever come out?

― Lukas (lukas), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 18:28 (twenty-two years ago)

douglas nailed it...its the coldness of "digital silence"

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 18:33 (twenty-two years ago)

i used to own the vinyl release of la mont young's ...turtle music... (can't remember the name now) which had one long side of a deep synth drone. moving around the room made the harmonics change. very soothing for a post-teen in suburbia.

― phil turnbull (philT), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 19:42 (twenty-two years ago)

You talking 'bout the black album? What did you do, sell it?

― hstencil, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 19:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Great list hstencil!

Mark, Cage actual tried that (listening to "silence" in an anechoic chamber -- I doubt a formal "performance" of 4'33" was involved); he reported experiencing his own heartbeat, breathing, and so on as being strikingly loud... (no fart jokes, please!)

― Paul in Santa Cruz (Paul in Santa Cruz), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 21:53 (twenty-two years ago)

It says Bernhard GUNTER (w/ an umlaut over the u) on my copy of 'Home, Unspeakable' by John Duncan and BG, which is mostly SILENCE as far as I can tell - but those few blips/interruptions make all the difference. The mastertapes for Gunter's first alb, 'Un Peu De Neige Salie' were sent back by the pressing plant because they thought they were faulty! It's one of my v. fave recs.

― Andrew L (Andrew L), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 22:09 (twenty-two years ago)

Wasn't there something about hearing your own nervous system too or was that an interview with someone else?

Again pretty amazing list by hstencil! Advice on where/what to start would be appreciated!

― el wanko, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 22:13 (twenty-two years ago)

David Behrman is soooo much more evocative then Stephen Malkhmus.

― gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 22:36 (twenty-two years ago)

Or Dave Berman, for that matter.

I'd say the best place to start is Outside the Dream Syndicate. That record rulez (and a remastered version is out now on CD).

― hstencil, Wednesday, 19 February 2003 22:38 (twenty-two years ago)

I would have said, from the title of this thread, that minimal would be as in minimal 'quantiy' sound. In that sense the gunter type stuff (which I haven't heard, one of those gaps i have to fill) would basically own this.

The most minimal I have is Feldman: I partcurlarly enjot the 4 CD set of his piano music (performed by John Tilbury), also 'For john cage'. search late AMM: the inexaustable document/nameless uncarved block

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 23:11 (twenty-two years ago)

also search scelsi: string quartets on montaigne.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 23:13 (twenty-two years ago)

yes, that tilbury "all piano" set is nice

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 19 February 2003 23:14 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah, I think it was the nervous system but I couldn't remember so I tried to be vague and distract everyone with a subliminal fart joke.

― Paul in Santa Cruz (Paul in Santa Cruz), Thursday, 20 February 2003 02:54 (twenty-two years ago)

You talking 'bout the black album? What did you do, sell it?

i gave it away in 1985. i don't think it was black, purpley-red, maybe with indian graphics and a pic of them all omming together somewhere - 2nd side was a long slow raga

― phil turnbull (philT), Thursday, 20 February 2003 03:00 (twenty-two years ago)

the new Errorsmith LP is excruciatingly minimal, but far from "minimalist"

its just a big ol' dance record made out of a kick and a snare and a filter knob. at first its a little dry, but it becomes so rich...

― tinobeat (tinobeat), Thursday, 20 February 2003 06:10 (twenty-two years ago)

Labradford - fixed::Contents

― Leee (Leee), Thursday, 20 February 2003 07:52 (twenty-two years ago)

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