Smokey Robinson or Sam Cooke?

Either "now there's a man!" or "poor scorpion"...

Smokey is great, but I'd take 'Harlem Square Club' and the Soul Stirrers stuff over any Miracles records.

Smokey is obv the better, or at least more important, songwriter, and I like his fragile voice--but Sam was such a magnetic, such a sexy performer and singer that I'd sooner take his records to a desert island than Smokey's. ...And the best Sam Cooke record I own is Night Beat. That'll raise the hairs on your head.

"I don't like you
But I love you"

is such a great opening.

It's really a tough comparision though. Smokey for the songs, Sam for the voice. I guess that since Sam's songs are pretty darn great, and his voice so superb, he gets the nod.

Smokey for me, BTW.

Also, do you know if Ali's opening scene was actually some guy lip-synching to Live at the Harlem Club? I sort of remember this in the credits, but I'm not positive. "A Change Is Gonna Come" was one of his greatest achievements...unlike Smokey (whose creativity seemed to flag over time), Cooke seemed to just get better and better as he matured. Its not clear that he had yet hit his prime when he died.

One reason I suspect Motown produced fewer obvious vocal stars than Southern soul (aside from a greater use of vocal harmony, at least in the '60s) is because of the more mobile melodies of H-D-H, Smokey, etc.--less space in which singers could assert their vocal personality.

Nonetheless, Smokey, Marvin Gaye and Levi Stubbs can hold their own against the best of the South, I think. I mean, I prefer Al Green, Otis and James Carr, say, but there's not so much in it.

does anyone else remember the part where the guy on the bus sticks a newspaper--with a cover photograph of emmett till's body after being removed from the river--in the young cassius clay's face? what a moment.....

A Change is Gonna Come is powerful as all hell. man i love this song.

TS: Night Beat vs Live at Harlem Sq. Club.

(in other words, help me to decide which one of these I should buy next week)

This must be "Night Beat" (which is amazing - one of the best r&b albums ever)

Smokey exists very much in the Motownian context for me. If Smokey were erased from history there'd still be Marvin and Stevie, but Sam stands alone.

This is why Motown was superior to Southern Soul. Emotion is overrated. Melody is underrated.

touche

I'll go along with everyone who says Sam for singing, Smokey for songs, that seems about right. Except that Smokey had a wondrous "yearning" voice himself, and Cooke's own songs were just fine, solid enough to become standards. I'm not the most loyal or well-informed fan of pre-Sly soul music, so my opinion's worth even less than usual; but there's simply no overlooking those two giants. Both of 'em loomed large in a "Best of 1963" CDR I burned for nostalgic parents recently.

Sam.

pretty sure "Lost and Lookin'" is the pinnacle of human achievement

man Cooke's discography is odd, all that genre-straddling

Night Beat is one of my all-time favorite albums, Live at the Harlem Square Club is one of the best live albums ever, and he's obviously got boatloads of great individual songs in addition to those - including with the Soul Stirrers - but sorting through everything to separate the wheat from the chaff is a little daunting.

the gloopy strings, why

Live at the Harlem Square Club is one of the best live albums ever
Seconded. I mean, THIS:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=et5mPu2_Itk

Saw Smokey sing wonderfully last night at the PBS taping of a Library of Congress event honoring him with the Gershwin prize. None of the acts who sang his material as well, impressed me as much. Ledisi was pretty good, and so were Blacc, Bailey Rae, and Spalding, but Smokey was best

Robinson did a smooth soulful take of his "Being With You," plus a cover of the Gershwin's "Love Is Here to Stay," and then he was joined by the rest for "My Girl."

So I saw the PBS taping last night in DC of Smokey Robinson getting the Library of Congress Gershwin Prize, and the company curating the list of performers paying tribute to Smokey by doing his songs included country singer Kip Moore and 13 year-old country wunderkind Tegan Marie. They were ok-- competent but neither thrilling or terrible. Alas, the bill did not include any of Smokey's fellow Motown artists or other old-school soul acts. The bill also included: Aloe Blacc, Gallant, CeeLo Green, JoJo, Ledisi, Corinne Bailey Rae, Esperanza Spalding, The Tenors and BeBe Winans. The honoree also performed some of his favorite tunes.
Berry Gordy did an intro for Smokey before his acceptance speech.

― curmudgeon, Thursday, November 17, 2016 3:21 PM (two minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The show will air in February

http://www.freep.com/story/entertainment/music/2016/11/17/smokey-robinson-gershwin-prize/94002418/

Smokey, for songs like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItPx0lUxHKo

Sam all the way. I don't even own any Smokey records.

You're in for a treat, because Smokey Robinson is one of the alltime greats.

i love smokey but at this point i'd probably say sam

oh hell i dont know

smokey is so fucking great.

I should probably be banned from ILM for not really knowing Sam Cooke. Except for "twisting the night away", which rules.

sam cooke doesn't take to long to get to know, he had a very short career

Would instinctively go Sam, but having 'discovered' mid 70s Smokey recently (and been on a Quiet Storm binge) it's a lot closer than it might have been.

Smokey easily. It's not against Cooke since Smokey would win against (almost) anybody.
"tracks of my tears", "my girl", "Ooo baby"... you can't really beat that !

Funny, I compiled a best-of list a couple days ago.

Both are so great. Smokey was so classy and humble the other night accepting the Gershwin award. I also loved watching him giving props to some of the other singers doing his material, and the charismatic yet so smooth way he took control of the stage while singing. He's 76 now but still hits some high notes.

Loved what he said about James Jamerson on the audio for Standing in the Shadows of Motown.

oh, I watched that (great documentary. except the songs live covers...) but don't remember : what did he say ?

I forgot that too, but also watched it, and later saw Funk Brothers band live.

At the Gershwin award thing, Smokey mostly just talked about growing up in a house full of music with he and his sisters listening to "gut-bucket blues," swing jazz, and his mother's gospel music (she played piano and sang I think he said). Berry Gordy's intro of him was a tad formulaic.

It's not in the movie, it's from the audio accompanying the book.

I love both of these but Smokey is greater. Feel like Sam Cooke has several touchstones that really connect with people at a this-is-deeper-than-pop-music/"seriousness" level - how else to talk about that except by exhuming the word "rockism" from its well-deserved crypt - but people write about Cooke with that sort of "now this, this is music that MEANT something" way. no doubt: "Change is Gonna Come" is an incredible, enduring, anthem. But prime Smokey, man alive...that is so many all-time American songbook jams -- "Tears of a Clown" alone is just such a feat, as is the underpraised "More Love" - and then, after the giganto hits ebb, he stays engaged and makes a ton of interesting music, most of which only dusty-nosed record fiends make time for. As a songwriter, anyway, I think he's just such a poet, so deft and understated. His Quiet Storm album is all-time. Just such huge respect for a guy who's stayed engaged with the craft his whole life even though people think of him mainly as the "Shop Around" guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9zPRVKQvIM

yeah "More Love" and "Quiet Storm" are great.
that reminds me of that long radio interview he did. many great things and the man still seems so fresh and cool
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WdZ3rQCiwk

and it's kinda cute how he tries to sell his hair product !

Ken Boothe v. Alton Ellis

Love Sam but Smokey is on another level.

Ken Boothe v. Alton Ellis

I'd compare Leroy Sibbles to Smokey; don't know about the JA Cooke.

Add Marvin Gaye and think about the trio they would have made,