Starsailor: Real talent or another fake Indie band?

Starsailor = music for lame 5th formers: who do their GCSE projects listening to Steve Lamacq approved indie faux shite and believe the rubbish - the hype bullshit generated by the NME: best new band in Britain - as that fat git on Royle Family tv series would say - my arse.

Anyway, Starsailor = inconsequential rubbish.

they could almost be the new andy kim, if that is a good selling point.

'sides i have always found tim buckley's starsailor impentrable 'cept for 'song for the siren'...

So who are they? What do they do? What have we got? Four scruffy, sensitive young men with guitars and wistful angst and epic tunes. Which, clearly, is a massively innovative and original and inspiring thing to be. So much so that Big Star did it 30 years ago, The Smiths did it 18 years ago, and Coldplay did it last year. So what marks out Starsailor as being something beyond the pale? On the surface there is precious little difference from the two biggest guitar-based bands in the country at the moment, namely Travis and Coldplay.

Such little difference, indeed, that it has been suggested that Starsailor have been moulded by their record company, subtly pushed in certain directions by management and A+R so they fit even more neatly into the current zeitgeist for Verve-lite ballad-pop.

Indie music has always prided, indeed, marketed itself on its authenticity, its do-it-yourself ethos, its perceived honesty and credibility. When confronted with the brazenly manufactured and target-marketed Hear'Say, the indie community is aghast with disgust and contempt at this artistic heresy. But at least Hear'Say, Steps and S Club 7 are honest about their inauthenticity and lack of artistic control and input. If Starsailor are being manipulated by strong and determined management (and this is only speculation, you understand), then, in my eyes, that is more insidious and cynical than any number of Britneys and Hear'Says.

But putting aside concerns about Starsailor's background and artistic credibility, does anything mark out their music as extraordinary and deserving of the level of hyperbolic praise that has been dumped on them like so much suffocating compost? In a word, no. There is nothing more to their music than there is to the music of Travis or Coldplay, or Turin Brakes or Doves or Elbow or any number of sensitive, acoustic-based guitar bands plying their trade at the moment. They are as in thrall to the accepted cannon of white, transatlantic rock music as any other say-nothing pissy little indie band. Jeff and Tim Buckley have been mentioned, not least because Starsailor are named after a legendarily hard-to-find Tim Buckley LP, but James Walsh simply does not have the tonsils or the maverick imagination and creativity to compete with either of these two dead singers. The second single, 'Good Souls', sounds like The Verve circa 'Sonnet' and 'Lucky Man', and James' vocals come nearer to Richard Ashcroft than either of the Buckleys. But the exciting thing about The Verve was barely featured on 'Urban Hymns'; their early work was exciting because it was outrageous, psychedelic, passionate and ludicrous, and 'A Northern Soul' was so remarkable because it was musically stunning and emotionally blistering and harrowingly open. James Walsh singing "and I turned to you and I said / thank goodness for the good souls / who make life better" cannot compete with Richard Ashcroft opening his veins and spilling out "Jesus never saved me / he'll never save you too / and you know I know", while Nick McCabe makes blasphemously sinful noises squall from his guitar. What it can compete with is Chris Martin singing "I never meant to cause you trouble / I never meant to do you wrong."

If the press had said of Starsailor that they were a pleasant band with some pretty songs and harmless sentiments, then I wouldn't be so wound up about the whole farrago. But that is not what they said. They said that Starsailor were here to save us, that they were the ultimate redemption, bringing us battered, cathartic emotional intensity. Of the five songs I have heard so far, none of them have moved me at all, except to boredom.

Much has been made of the fact that James Walsh is only 20 years old, but Stevie Wonder and Michael Jackson were releasing records that are recognised by everybody but the churlish and bigoted as timeless classics well before they were even old enough to smoke. Beyonce Knowles of Destinys Child is the same age as James Walsh, and she has three albums behind her already, the last two featuring her co- writing and producing some of the most innovative and outrageous pop music ever seen. Their last LP sold well over ten million copies. Hanson were writing and releasing worldwide number one smash hit singles when the drummer was only eleven. In these terms, James Walsh is a comparative late-developer. "But he's not competing against artists like this!" I hear you cry, outraged at my temerity. No, he isn't. He's trying to follow in the footsteps of more mature, serious artists. Jeff Buckley was 27 when 'Grace' was released. Danny McNamara was 29 when Embrace released 'Drawn From Memory', Ian Brown was 27 when The Stone Roses' seminal eponymous debut was released. Primal Scream recorded their most innovative, extreme, and brilliant record when they were pushing 40. Kurt Cobain ended his own life with possibly his best material ahead of him, at the age of 27. At the other end of the scale, Chris Martin is singing about everything being yellow at the age of 22, and Mark Greaney is singing about snow at the age of 19. These are James Walsh's true contemporaries and equals, and their lack of maturity and life experience shows. This isn't music revealing inner depths of the human soul, this isn't existential pain and emotional catharsis, this is the sound of sad young men whinging because the girls wouldn't kiss them when they were 15, and painting it up as something profound rather than something pathetic.

Idlewild are more intelligent, passionate, erudite and exciting than Starsailor. Embrace are more emotionally affecting, more innovative, and have better tunes. Sigur Ros are more gentle, more expansive, more epic and more moving. Teenage Fanclub have a much deeper and more rounded understanding of guitar pop. Nick Cave And The Bad Seeds are more emotionally harrowing. Mogwai and Aphex Twin are more necessary, vital and invigorating. Orbital are more human and more creative. Alfie are more charming. When juxtaposed with Starsailor's trad, predictable shapes, it becomes embarrassingly apparent just how marvellous Primal Scream, At The Drive-In and Queens Of The Stone Age really are. And still the press insists on heaping praise on Starsailor, and the public lap it up like Pavlov's Dog on valium. Even the fucking Sun was name-dropping Starsailor a couple of months ago. If Murdoch approving something doesn't disgust you and warn you off, then nothing will. Why? Because, simply, this shit sells. It sells records, gig tickets, magazines, newspapers and television advertising. It's easy, accessible and predictable. It's safe. It's another brand, another product, easily consumable, pre-digested to take out any dangerous toxins and ideas, and also any of the goodness it might have once had. Starsailor are a facsimile of a facsimile of a facsimile. They are the hyperreal, the spectacle, the pallid Xerox of a Xerox of a sketch of a photograph of someone else's painting. The warmth, emotion, brilliance and originality of the things they aspire to emulate have become so watered down and anaemic in Starsailor's appropriation of them that they are no longer worth bothering with. Even the originals have become sullied.

Starsailor are no better or more worthy than S Club 7 or Limp Bizkit or any other crude, formulaic, target-market band you care to mention, in any genre. They are mediocre, and that is ten times worse than being dreadful.

Music is the most profound of the arts, the most unavoidable, and the most effective. When confronted with a painting, one can look away. When handed a book, one can refuse to read. It is easy enough to avoid theatres or cinemas if one chooses to. But when affronted by a sound one has no choice but to hear, even if one tries to avoid listening. You cannot turn off your ears, no matter how hard you try. There is a responsibility not to let people down and sell them short that goes hand-in-hand with being a musician, because music shouldn't be about just filling silence.

A success then!

I'm sorry, but now this winds ME up. The unnecessary and frantic public swearing - the vast claims, polarizations, and simplifications - the easy rhetoric ('they understand Motown'??) the now awfully familiar inversion whereby People Who Like Chart Pop have a go at Precious Indie Kids, whom it's OK to generalize about and sneer at. I imagine that Starsailor are bad - I don't have owt to say about them. S Club 7 I've heard and don't like. OK, that doesn't matter. But I just don't like the tone of all this.

If it winds you up particularly then perhaps priorities need to be reconsidered.

Swearing is big and it is clever.

Noone is dying here.

There were race riots in Stoke last night, and you're upset about S Club 7 and some factory floor language?

Rolling Stone is on sale in London in certain record stores/newsagents but hardly any reads it let alone buys it and no one ever comments on it i.e what music RS covers each issue or does not include. Rolling Stone has absolutely zero relevance/ cultural influence in the UK.

re: NME the reason why I keep mentioning it and many others do so as well, is becuase NME in 2001 is in state of complete and utter total mess/ shambles and it has no weekly print opposition to counter its bullshit propaganda and cultural positioning. By default NME has ended up as a the only weekly music magazine, bye bye Sounds in 1991, and the MM last December.

[Patrick maybe in Canada as it is such a vast country you don't have a tradition of a national weekly music press, but in the UK it is different]

I want a weekly/fortnightly music magazine WITHOUT any of the following: starsailor, the strokes, stereophonics, travis, fred durst, destiny’s child, linkin park, aiya nypa, terris, coldplay, eminem, papa roach, nysnc, youth surveys, dido, the offspring, feeder, hearsay news, gorrilaz, five, blink182, nelly furtado - the NME in 2001 is in a total mess, the worst combined aspects of Q, Kerrang, Smash Hits, The Source and The Heat rolled into a weeekly rubbish music title covering short term popular fads.

If we still had a weekly music magazine of the standard of Melody Maker in 1988, along with another weekly outlet providing different perspectives such as Sounds then I would not got give a stuff about the naff music NME covers.

Because there is no weekly opposition, that is where all the anger and frustration of the NME stems from. The NME's weekly monopoly position means the NME is commented on even more - especially when it so appaling and inept in 2001. It is not only a frustration of what the NME champions unworthy duds such as(The Strokes, Starsailor) it's what they (The NME) don't include in their rag that annoys me.

Just wait to AOL-Time Warner take over IPC the publishers of NME it will become even worse.

Now is the right time for some publisher to take on the NME launch a a weekly or i belive a fortnightly new music magazine offering cultural opposition to the NME. There is a gap for a new title to take on the NME and that is more frequent, diverse, responsive to change than the monthly generalist rock titles and incorprates the best music coverage elements of various specialist titles such as Wax, The Wire, Sleazenation, Jockey Slut, Terrorizer, Side Line.

But instead of a monthly wait you need that increased frequency of a weekly/ fortnigtly publication to create a buzz, to be commented on, to have cultural influence and power.

'But instead of a monthly wait what is needed is an increased frequency that enables a weekly/ fortnigtly publication to create a buzz, to be commented on, to have cultural influence and power.'

Re: Cultural Influence on promoting creative music: ala Melody Maker in 1988, or The Wire in 2001.

AOL Time Warner = cultural influence on "Mass Consumerism" regardless of artistic merit. AOL Time Warner is a capitalist money making machine that will promoting anthing - that makes money for their shareholders, and deliberately restricts information flow that differs from their worldview and commercial interests.

HOORAY, HOORAY, HOORAY, HOORAY!!!

Crazy DJ Martian and I AGREE after all!!!!

I've been self-righteous since I was about 8 and I doubt I'll ever stop.

Is Rolling Stone about music or something? Last time I saw it, it appeared to be about Gisele and drugs.

Yeah, that's it. I was sort of using Rolling Stone (which BTW, Tarden, is a way bigger seller - and has a way bigger influence on non-music-geek mainstream - than Spin, which has gone down considerably since alt-rock went pfft) as the (vague) US equivalent of the NME - saying that music geeks here expect NOTHING from RS, so why UK folks getting panties in a wad over what the NME says ? What DJ Martian seems to be saying is that music mags have historically played a much larger role in the UK, and are followed much more actively and assiduously by readers, so expectations are high, and that makes sense, though from what I've read on various threads on here the impression I have is that the NME's cultural capital sure ain't what it used to be.

Is Rolling Stone about music or something? Last time I saw it, it appeared to be about Gisele and drugs.

Gisele ?

I don't have a problem with sneering at indie kids, seeing as most (but not all) of the time it is they who are doing the sneering. At non-indie kids.

Though interestingly on FT/ILM the dynamic is almost entirely reversed : indie folks often humble to a fault, pop folks into big displays of attitude and making massive sweeping judgements about perceived anti-pop forces (though the latter is less true than it used to be - but watch out, Tom is back, and maybe he has changed his mind about pop being dead !)

NME hype is often overstated as an influence on reality: does anyone remember Ultrasound?

Starsailor supported my band 18 months ago. I sniggered at them from the audience. Though I imagine they're doing the sniggering now.

Oh, what a fool I was.

The NME is not a last bastion of the love of music, it's an ivory tower enclave, pretending to be something that it no longer is. I would like them to come out and be honest about their corporate sponsorship, I would like them to come out and admit the monetary source of their months long Starsailor-blowjobs and their Strokes-blowjobs. Then we will see clearly.

the wire - opium poppy issue was the first i bought, love penman when he goes druggy about fluidic otherness and pusillasummat, not as crushworthee as yr man 'IM is Kenny g of metal' on ILM but love it even though it does seem hamstrung and sometimes smug/nervous/ignorant by not mentioning the big picture an the Toon. but i buy it to read rather than get into the music as im not into most wire-music esp. improv - but i like the will to create/explore/interact that whispers/dribbles/bleeds through from the musicians and often the writers, unlike the nermerair. The ace techie info in simon R interview with thommiiee useful to matezband - interesting hybrid interview like the trem arm, rev. reverb talk in MBV stuff - astute, considering readership. like the wire's look too - its got that scando kewell that we is into - check BALTIC

btw. outed as yr racer on saturday :)

A; I read NME every week (what else is there?)

and...

B; The Strokes singles so far are both fucking excellent, and Hard To Explain may well end up as my single of the year, assuming Embrace don't release If You've Never Been In Love With Anything or Over as singles.

nme has of course been rubbish since they pulled MY (slag-off) review of Rattle & Hum and substituted Stuart Baille's (faint with enfeebled love) review.

Starsailor strike me as being far more objectionable than the Strokes, in the same way that Blur have always been more objectionable than Oasis, but I guess there are already several hundred threads devoted to that argument...

I don't think that I find either Starsailor or The Strokes that objectionable, I'm just mystified by the amount of acclaim and hatred that they garner. They're both teeth-rattlingly average bands. Is that a crime?

Embrace are probably my favourite band ever, and their next record is marvellous, and their last record was wonderful, although their first one was overproduced and too long and had a seriously flawed running order, and basically is a batch of good songs done badly, plus Come Back To What You Know, which is dreadful and almost as bad as Don't Look Back In Anger.

I hate anthemic rock.

And Embrace are my favourite band.

Isn't that weird?

"Heavy Ragarnok": Geordie, is this Garner or my alter ego?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c9/All_the_Plans.png

from Amazon:
The fourth album from Chorley pop-rockers Starsailor is closer in style to their early work than more recent efforts, focusing on melodies and simple arrangements rather than the rock-driven sound of their third album, On The Outside. Lyrically, the record includes references to married life and international politics, although there is no single overarching theme to the album. Frontman James Walsh has said All The Plans is a very soulful album, with 'classic' songs.

not sure if this is out yet but i got a leaked copy tonight. (April 7th maybe?)

Disc: 1

1. Tell Me It's Not Over
2. Boy In Waiting
3. Thames
4. All The Plans
5. Neon Sky
6. You Never Get What You Deserve
7. Hurts Too Much
8. Stars And Stripes
9. Change My Mind
10. Listen Up
11. Safe At Home

Disc: 2

1. Listen Up (Acoustic)
2. Tell Me It's Not Over (Acoustic)
3. All The Plans (Acoustic)
4. Merry Go Round (Acoustic)
5. Thames (Acoustic)
6. Change My Mind (Acoustic)
7. Stars And Stripes (Acoustic)

so you're the one.

RIP dom

i feel like he would have known what crappy english song to post the lyrics to.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v165/noodle_vague/frontpage.jpg

Oh my god, Starsailor. They were good live & acoustic in a small record shop, but overall I would like to forget them, thanks.