Bounce rap/ Cash Money: Classic or dud?

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Critics don't pay much attention to Cash Money Records and the other New Orleans cliques, but they sell a gazillion records, get mad radio play and are ultimately pretty inescapable (at least down here in the Dirty Dirty)...

So my question is: Are artists like Juvenile, Kane and Abel, Mystikal, Lil Wayne, et al, and songs like "Back That Azz Up" and "Shake It Like A Dog" as "important" as critical-fave nonsense like Outkast or Mos Def?

I'm a big fan of Cash Money and all that, Mannie Fresh's beats have always seemed really new and interesting to me (the triple-time Casio thang), and Lil Wayne can flow like a fiend--so I'd have to say that bounce is far more relevant to modern hip-hop than Native Tongues revivalism or outer-space funk.

Anyone?

adam, Thursday, 19 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Certainly Mystikal and Juvenile deserve mad props. But they both escaped what seems to be the factory of the No Limit label to reach a wider audience. Mannie Fresh does one thing and does it well. I don't mourn the existance of this circle, but I DO recognize that it is in some ways less about the musical product (which is largely similar) than the influence that this has exerted elsewhere. The current St. Louis sound, for example. Further, they sort of exemplify the hip-hop landscape, and thus provide a sort of yardstick to measure all else against.

Sterling Clover, Thursday, 19 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

classic if free, i.e. on the radio, rocking a houseparty, riding in a friends car. dud if you pay cash money to buy an cash money album and take it home and listen to it.

ethan, Thursday, 19 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I don't know if this is Mannie's direct influence or if it's parallel development, but Swizz Beatz will often use Mannie-like long developing (and sometimes quite beautiful) background riffs, as do a couple of Georgia LPs I've heard recently: Field Mob's 613: ASHY TO CLASSY and Backbone's CONCRETE LAW.

Frank Kogan, Thursday, 19 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I think probably parallel development - both producers started doing really fab work in '99. Cash Money are selectively brilliant but their albums are a real slog to listen to - the posturing begins to get tedious and the music's consistency begins to work against it. They should make a best-of compilation... or better yet a "furthest out" compilation, to capture their most wacky musical moments. Lil' Wayne's "Remember Me" for example, is on par with anything Timbaland's done beat-wise, the most succulently crisp drum programming outside of drum & bass.

I'd add unreserved recommendations for Nelly, Ludacris and Mystikal (but only his last album).

Tim, Thursday, 19 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

does anyone know where i can get a description of exactly how cash money is making their music? i'm writing a review of a hip hop album and i'd like to get my facts straight...maybe just a small description somewhere....thanks.

Todd Burns, Friday, 20 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

wasn't there an episode of 'cribs' with some cash money fool on it? 'this is where i make my beatz. (gestures to keyboard-mixer setup) i got hot beats coming out from this basement'. really, i'm not making a joke or anything, i saw this on mtv and i think it was a nigga from the cash money clique / who don't give a lick / about stunts or tricks. to quote directly.

ethan, Friday, 20 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

is cash money the same guy from cash money and marvelous? Because I bought their Where's the party at? album the other day and its fucking great!

james edwards, Friday, 20 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The Cash Money we're talking about is a New Orleans record label. Simon Reynolds's review of Lil Wayne's The Block Is Hot back in Nov. 1999 is a good overview of producer Mannie Fresh's sound. I'm going to try and give you a link for it, but this is my first attempt ever to type HTML, so forgive me if I fail: http://villa gevoice.com/issues/9947/reynolds.shtml

Frank Kogan, Sunday, 22 July 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

eleven months pass...
yes cash money are as critical as outkast or mos def they are equalley as tallented or better than for example outkast they have lyrics alot better like lil wayne light out or juvinile project english some of there songs you just wont like or you wont like them at first beacause they grow on you.

cash money should move there market to a wider audiance like the UK you never hear about them in the UK it is masuuve in the US even thought they still sell amillionm records that i think would make them even more better than mos def.

cash money have good songs by the hot boys e.g tuesday and thursday and i need a hot girl i think thought B.G leaving cash money with turk who right now is in prison will loose some fans and juvi i think leavin for a.t.f records his on componey will not do so good for cash money.

overall cash money is relevent to hip hop its new and it should last with new rappers like Mach 10 and TQ and new albums like lil wayne 500 degrees.

G john muir, Tuesday, 2 July 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

nine months pass...
Revive!

Now, someone tell me, should I buy their Platinum Hits best-of album? Or would that just be silly?

JS Williams (js williams), Wednesday, 16 April 2003 19:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Yes it would be silly. get juvenile's '400 Degreez' instead

schnellschnell, Wednesday, 16 April 2003 19:12 (twenty-three years ago)

one month passes...
Revive again! So we can talk about Lil Wayne's ongoing "Squad Up!" series of freestyle compilations. They're awesome--I have no idea what number he's up to but volume 4 (I think) from last summer has a killer flow over the "Oh Boy" beat. The recent ones aren't so astounding but I am just biding my time until Weezy is recognized as World's Greatest MC.

Of course he's the only Cash Money Millionaire who has sounded good without Manny Fresh behind him--Juvie's unreleased 600 Degreez had one or two good songs and BG's Living Legend basically sucks. Birdman is a comical vanity project (tho the track with Clipse is quite good).

adam (adam), Friday, 16 May 2003 16:11 (twenty-three years ago)

http://www.angelfire.com/ill/rkelly/lilwayne.jpg

there's a new hot boys cd, too. you should download 'my section.' it's got a spooky mannie fresh under-part and deep drums and it bounces and it's pretty good.

there's nothing that sounds consistently like cash money stuff at all. all of the big songs that are supposed to play in clubs or in cars or wherever sound more like no limit stuff now. no limit plus alligators and guns and explosions. like, the same singy rap thing and the melodic thing and all that.

all of the new bounce stuff that i've heard seems to be built around a massive hook. like, the hook goes through the whole thing and people just rap over it every now and then.

in the new xxl lil jon has a thing about how he does his songs. he writes the hook first. like, 'put yo hood up' has no rapping, really. it's a lot of shouting and stuff that's all part of a massive hook.

and the stuff like choppa, where it's mainly singing rhyming stuff. it almost sounds like dancehall, the clicky beat and the singy rapping. 'choppa style' sounds exactly like a dancehall song.

or the bonecrusher 'never scared' one. or the other one, 'crunk in da club.' it's all the singing and the massive hook and the bouncing, clicky beat.

d k (d k), Friday, 16 May 2003 16:59 (twenty-three years ago)

is there a thread for three six mafia? can we talk about them, too?

vahid (vahid), Friday, 16 May 2003 20:48 (twenty-three years ago)

Surely that pic in Bradley from S Club?

Nick H, Friday, 16 May 2003 22:36 (twenty-three years ago)

four years pass...

**ize runnin outta patience z;^(

Arms, Friday, 29 February 2008 20:19 (eighteen years ago)

s/d: "block" auction entendre

Arms, Friday, 29 February 2008 20:22 (eighteen years ago)

Backbone's CONCRETE LAW.

-- Frank Kogan, Wednesday, July 18, 2001 7:00 PM (6 years ago) Bookmark Link

yes

deej, Friday, 29 February 2008 20:25 (eighteen years ago)

eight months pass...

Cheeky Blakk - Twerk Something

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 03:58 (seventeen years ago)

Kilo - The Ward Song

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 03:58 (seventeen years ago)

^^^ who dat call the police?!

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 03:59 (seventeen years ago)

!!!!

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 04:00 (seventeen years ago)

^^^ triggaman on that 1200!

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 04:01 (seventeen years ago)

the 1986 track that started it all, Drag Rap (Triggerman) [and sync'ing that DMX to the 808, pre-midi]

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 04:04 (seventeen years ago)

I feel like I know the sample at the beginning of the trailer from the bounce film (not "Triggaman", the electric piano chords and stuff) from some recent r&b, but I can't pinpoint it.

I took my geoduck to Puyallup (The Reverend), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 06:19 (seventeen years ago)

Rev, I hope you do. Those chord changes are where I'm at today!

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 07:20 (seventeen years ago)

This is where I got on board with Bounce (after Ninja Crew/Gregory D & Mannie Fresh in the late 80s, and Bustdown in 1991).

1992: Jimi!

I didn't know about DJ Irv's 1990 original until years later.

DJ Jimi - Where They At

This man got them all:
http://www.youtube.com/user/weatheallman

i am truley sorry for your lots (PappaWheelie V), Wednesday, 26 November 2008 07:32 (seventeen years ago)

eleven months pass...

i think cheeky blakk died?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjSW3PNqkNc

hey trader joe's! i've got the new steely dan. (Jordan), Monday, 16 November 2009 20:06 (sixteen years ago)

btw that sample I was wondering about is "I Couldn't Love You More" by Sade

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3jUC38qpsg

estebutt bannez (The Reverend), Monday, 16 November 2009 20:27 (sixteen years ago)

thirteen years pass...

Haha, I love seeing Juvee & Mannie Fresh in cozy Tiny Desk mode

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kes2P4IC2bQ

Random Restaurateur (Jordan), Friday, 30 June 2023 17:04 (two years ago)

whoa!

sad Mings of dynasty (Neanderthal), Friday, 30 June 2023 17:04 (two years ago)

cross posted in the juve thread. such a fun and celebratory performance

nobody respects the chair (Spottie), Friday, 30 June 2023 17:06 (two years ago)

this is making my afternoon

sad Mings of dynasty (Neanderthal), Friday, 30 June 2023 17:10 (two years ago)

"Ha" sounds triumphant in this setting

sad Mings of dynasty (Neanderthal), Friday, 30 June 2023 17:11 (two years ago)

Kinda wish they gave Trombone Shorty a moment to blow, but glad they didn't give Jon Batiste a melodica solo.

Random Restaurateur (Jordan), Friday, 30 June 2023 17:11 (two years ago)

oh fuuuuuuuuuuck, "Slow Motion"

sad Mings of dynasty (Neanderthal), Friday, 30 June 2023 17:12 (two years ago)


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