RFI: Darkwave

In my (albeit limited) experience goth dance music = industrial.

Ah, crosspost, but Adam just confirmed what I said above.

Anyway, Darkwave = bands on Projekt, Hyperium/Hypnobeat, Metropolis, Cleopatra, Cold Meat Industry, Prikosnovenie, World Serpent, old 4AD and the usual goth canon, and many other smaller labels out of Germany, Italy, France and England whose names I can't remember.

Somehow I knew I would be invoked. I've always found it a strange/ill-defined term but Sam R. of Projekt does use it a lot and it's become associated with his label by default. It's a bit strange since a good half of the label's efforts are experimental electronic music (notably via Steve Roach and Vidna Obmana) that while often at times working in meditative and potentially melancholic moods aren't really goth by any stretch of the imagination, but such is the power of branding and marketing. Adam, fortunate hazel and Siegbran all OTM but really I try to avoid using the term when I can (though I'm sure I have here and there).

/need sleep/

I have no idea about the Projekt thing. Sam likes to pretend Vidna Obmana, Black Tape For A Blue Girl, and Love Spirals Downward all release the same genre of music. Imagine meshing all three into one style ... shudder.

Uh, I'm not sure he's ever made that claim. Are you on a mailing list he posts on where he's said that?

I'm not mocking him, really, just poking fun. Projekt throws around some completely bizarre descriptions of their releases from time to time. I'm not a fulltime fan, but I'm enough of one to pay attention to the label.

I do too, but he also knows the value of pushing the Projekt name instead of a bunch of diverse artists all at once. He's built it to the point where people often have positive or negative reactions to something solely based on it being a Projekt release. I understand the value of a brand, but intellectually I find it pretty humorous because someone could write off Vidna Obmana, say, because they got suckered into attending Projektfest and hated it (true story!).

Welle:Erdball.

hideous and unlistenable

The only one of the bunch that had any lasting effect on me was Love Spirals Downwards. But they are the kind of band that if you hear one song on a mix tape, you go "Wow! Lovely! My new favourite band!" but if you hear a whole album, it's just too much. They're slightly droney but very floaty and pretty. But it's a bit like someone sampled a five-second loop of Victorialands by the Cocteaus and played it over and over and over and over and never varied the pace or the pitch or anything.

The Vanishing

John Kenedy on Xfm played a track from The Vanishing recently, sort of The Faint crossed with vintage goth rock. They have a new album:

THE VANISHING "Songs for Psychotic Children" (GSL

The chimera has revealed herself and there is going to be some fun in the
graveyard tonight. Born from splatter films and a tense mix of Joy
Division, Bauhaus, Siouxsie & The Banshees, and The Cure. The Vanishing
have risen from the charred flesh of The Lies and Subtonix wearing the
darker than dark hair and make-up as if they had just stepped out from a
scene in a German Expressionist movie. Jesse Eva (a.k.a. Jessie Trashed),
Brian Hock, and Sadie Shaw have draped their Death-Disco sound with a
sinister dose of synth and percussion, creating an edge of claustrophobia
that pervades from beginning to end, from foreboding to frightening. I am not
certain if it is meant to be a trick of submission through dominance, but it
is a sensation reminiscent of The Phantom Limbs or even Subtonix. Breathing
new life into the word GOTH with a darkened swathe of post-punk, firmly setting
The Vanishing in step with Glass Candy, Turn Pale, Kill Me Tomorrow, Radio Vago
and The Faint. I pray that the ladies here in NYC will eventually pick-up
on that whole 1920's Louise Brooks thing again but until then all my dreams
will be going toward the lovely Ms. Trashed. [AG]

review: from Other Music, NYC

The foxy mamas file past his tomb
Strewn with time's funny cigarrettes
Bereft of funky shromms
Alone in a darkened room
The Enema Squad counts down
Dr Funkenstein's dead
Undead undead undead (bwouw bwouw bwouw)

Church of Carbon - Bela Lugosi's Dead
http://www.diskob.com/c/church/db96.html

an electro/electroclash version of the Bauhaus classic, [the man behind this mix is the incredibly talented electronic producer Patrick Pulsinger]

Custos, that was indeed pretty damn funny.

My Life With The Thrill Kill Kult?

more like dorkwave amirite?

isn't Darkwave more of a European invention, a particular strain of postpunk synth and neoclassical music associated with labels like Hyperium, Tess and Lively Art, rather than a conceit purely of Rosenthal's own design? granted, Projekt has become synonymous with Darkwave. but before there were BTFABG CDs in every Borders, there were hideously overpriced Heavenly Voices comps and Love is Colder Than Death CDs in the Import racks.

And Andi, I think it's interesting you mention the "uncool" factor...I think a lot of goths (or people into this sort of music nowadays) aren't really aware that such a thing exists. I always feel a bit jealous of folks who are able to get into stuff on Projekt or other modern sorts of stuff like this because to me it has always seemed like such pale imitations of things in the past. I mean, honestly there are a lot of really just plain bad goth bands out there.

I mean not that there isn't something out there I haven't heard that I would like, but it gives the impression of being such a daunting task, like trying to find a needle in a haystack. Doesn't mean I don't respect folks who call themselves goths these days, or respect folks who are into modern day goth stuff, whatever.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=DHCOi9nXj4E

Every time I go to my local goth nite, they play these epic EBM/Darkwave tracks that always have jaw-dropping trance-y breakdowns.

But I don't know any names...can someone suggest a few tracks?

Bimble wtf! Have you never read about how much Liz loves Ella Fitgerald?!

God, I srsly can't type today what is with me.

Also hazel: Dif Juz OTMFM.

PS Bimb, sorry I havent replied to yr email, I'll get around to it shortly promise!

I mean, honestly there are a lot of really just plain bad goth bands out there.

Yeah but their silly names make up for it... Vampire State Building, Simply Dead, Nosfert.A.T.u., etc.

Vampire State Building

HAHAHA.

Well, Liz may love Ella, hell she may love Patsy Cline for all I know, but it doesn't mean I find it natural at all to refer to Cocteaus music as jazz or country, if you get my drift.

That's okay about the email.

The only reason why I have not commented on Dif Juz being mentioned here is because god knows I've already gone on and on and on about them on this board before. One of my all time top five fave bands, please don't get me started. You're lucky I'm not drunk right now, etc.

Latebloomer, the YouTube clip only further confuses and frankly irritates me as to the meaning of this word Darkwave. For christ's sake, people that is RAVE music. I have a friend who is into contemporary rave music who has explained to me that there is "happy hardcore" rave music which is very happy and that there is the darker stuff. But even she has not referred to this as darkwave, and I don't see what's so dark about the music on that clip except that it's slightly less happy than the happy stuff she has played me.

i'm just a reporter, ask the girls who made the video

what jazz band wouldn't be proud to have album titles like "extractions" or "soundpool" though? i'm just sayin'.

also on the same compilation featuring vampire state building: a band called PRIME SINISTER.

Is that one of those shitty Cleopatra things?

Oh I knew you hadn't made it, latebloomer. :)

Prime Sinister! hahahaha

As for goth trance.... hell yeah it exists. I mean, Apoptygma Bezerk are a great example. "Paranoia" is totally trance techno. And it is AWESOME.

Is that one of those shitty Cleopatra things?

nah, it's heavenly voices 4 on hyperium.

two-thirds of the way through heavenly voices 3 is when they ran out of happy.

Trayce, is Paranoia a new or old track from them? I couldn't find it on You Tube, but I listened to a few tracks I found there and I guess I don't have any problem with music like that except that the backing instrumentation is so generic.

It's hard to tell, though because people seem to say this is a band that has gone through a lot of changes in sound.

i want this shit to be spacey and dark and sad.

that Lycia album I posted upthread (A Day on the Stark Corner) is great 4-track reverbed-out shit with song titles like "The Morning Breaks So Cold And Gray"

=D YSI Crutis!

Hahaha I don't think we actually played those specific two right next to each other, but 4AD into crunchy shouty industrial beats doesn't really work does it!

Every time I go to my local goth nite, they play these epic EBM/Darkwave tracks that always have jaw-dropping trance-y breakdowns.

But I don't know any names...can someone suggest a few tracks?

Apoptygma Berzerk's Welcome to Earth is basically goth trance and it's one of the few futurepop (lol did I say that??) albums I enjoy. "Paranoia" is particularly EPIC. But that's from back in 1999 I think! Still holds up pretty well.

haha I didn't see Trayce's post about Apop! Whoops!

Thanks Curt1s and Trayce.

I just listened to Paranoia, it IS pretty epic, and has that trance-breakdown.

But as much as I like the synths it's not quite what I'm looking for. The beats have to be a little less skittery, and a bit more crunchy. The vocals a little more gloomy...etc. etc.

Any ideas?

many xposts to Ian:

In Gowan Ring rule, all releases are good and yes all are CD-only.

WSDP and Vinyl On Demand haven't released much that's slow/sad/spacy that I know of. Just early P16D4/RLW noise fuckery and that Esplendor Geometrico box which is pretty good.

..and the Absolute Body Control box!

The beats have to be a little less skittery, and a bit more crunchy. The vocals a little more gloomy

Hm. VNV Nation perhaps? Covenant?

haha I didn't see Trayce's post about Apop! Whoops!

Dude we gotta stop sharing a brain cell.

i said all i had to say. none of you guys get it, i guess. . . sigh

PRIME SINISTER

Heh. I understand what you're saying andi.
I am somewhat embarrassed when my friends come over and notice my Skinny Puppy collection. I want to downplay my gothiness, if possible. etc. etc. However, I'm probably missing your point. Right?

Oh, the Covenant tracks I've heard are totally rad. Thanks Trayce!

Aha! I thought that might be closer to what you were after when you said crunchy beats and doomy vocals :) "Call the ships to port" and "Like Tears in Rain" are stompin'.

Skinny Puppy are AWESOME.

Also: I want to downplay my gothiness, if possible. etc

I spent my first 3 years on ILX doing that but I gave up, cause bugger that. I like what I like.

Good point, Trayce! Maybe I'll have to take that into consideration for myself. ;)

Ok, a few more suggestions are in order!

http://www.cartonionline.com/gif/CARTOON/Darkwing_Duck/Darkwing_duck.jpg

I'm sorry that you feel we've failed you, andi. :( What is it that you're upset we didn't respond to exactly?

These're like the best band names I've ever heard.

Ok, a few more suggestions are in order!

OK try :wumpscut:, maybe possibly And One, oh and Wolfsheim! Though they're more pretty/sad and less rargh gloom stomp dance.

crunchy beats and doomy vocals

It's been a while since I got anything new in this genre but after watching "Call the Ships to Port" and "Bullet" I bought Covenant "Northern Light", and what a great album it is.

So I'm curious about this stuff again. Last saturday I grabbed a newer Leaether Strip EP from a second hand shop. It's called "Faetish" and so far it's a bit embarrassing and I'm not liking it very much (I had heard and loved the old classic track "Japanese Bodies").

I've also given some spins to mid-period DIVE, which is noisy but you can dance to it.

And a couple of old favorites:

* The Eternal Afflict's "San Diego", a cheesy goth-dance anthem it there ever was one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwxGGtHLvY4

* Love is Colder than Death - "Wild World". I was obsessed by this infectious unknown song till I finally got it IDed. It's in the first LiCtD album, "Teignmouth", which I think can be obtained cheap from Metropolis.

Leaether Strip's "Japanese Bodies", live 1992: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQEo2M4bnWc

i love you guys, and i don't want to suck your blood. ! (haha).

love is colder than death is pure cheese.

sam rosenthal, if you see this by chance, i love you. i'm sorry. i just wish it wasn't this way. i'm trying to straighten it all out. i'm trying to. i wish i could. we need more mes and trayces and neds. what the hell is wrong with the average music lover? i love projekt records, and believe in projekt records. so, lambaste me.

don't get me wrong, i'm twee as fuck. i um. i just love music. i care about these things. i'm no poptimist, i'm no rockist. i love it all. any voice that can make me believe, and voice that can make me swoon. i love music. sam rosenthal, lisa feuer, rose melberg, amelia fletcher, calvin johnson, that fucking dude from the apartments, lee remick, etc.

ps: i've had three drinks now

"wild world" is really good! if you like that one, try "down and out" from mental traveller. they're both great in that first xymox album kind of way.

oh yeah, mental traveller being a love is colder than death album, not a band.

"swandive" by this ascension is a really good song.

Light & Shade is way better than that album

Inspired by Faith and the Muse's upcoming Spring tour, I ended up writing a piece about 1990s darkwave, how the tour is bring a whole host of them back to the stage, and why it 90s-era goth/darkwave deserves some love.

http://theskysgoneout.tumblr.com/post/464250237/is-1990s-darkwave-finally-making-a-comeback

nice article Jason but God does it make me feel old. I remember seeing Faith & the Muse in 93 at the Roxy and I really never thought they'd be referenced as "seminal", to put it mildly...

Among many goths today they are referred to reverentially, and they may be one of the few (American) bands from the genre that can pull off a tour of this scope. Have you heard any of their later stuff? I get the impression you were unimpressed with their '93 performance.

apparently John Peel called Xymox "darkwave" on his radio show back in 1985. anyway, I'm listening to Phoenix and it's an underappreciated Xymox album. So many good songs!