Why can't indie people take care of vinyl records?

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Every time I buy a used record by Yo la Tengo or Guided by Voices the record is always in unbelieveably bad shape. I can buy used jazz records that are 50 years old and they look absolutely pristine, but every indie record I buy looks like it's been used as a scratching post by wild dingos. Do indie fans not care about sound quality? Do the stoner faction indie fans sometimes mistake lps for frisbee golf discs? Am I the only person who gets annoyed when indie kids think it's cute to play records on worn out Fisher Price turntables? This insanity has to stop!

― William R Henderson (Cabin Essence), Friday, 13 June 2003 23:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Hmm, well, I do know a lot of "indie"(!?) fans and it varies a lot, but quite a few of them are quite fond of throwing their LPs around in a drunken stupor, putting something on the play one song, then flinging it off and to the floor while putting on something else... Obviously this results in LPs in saddeningly bad shape.

Actually, these are more "rocker" types than "indie"; but I have no idea what people mean by "indie" nowadays. You darn kids with your newfangled genres!

― Øystein Holm-Olsen (Øystein H-O), Friday, 13 June 2003 23:34 (twenty-two years ago)

i had a friend who treats their records and CDs appallingly. when they once asked me if they could borrow one of my CDs, you could have heard my derisive cackle three suburbs over.

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Friday, 13 June 2003 23:35 (twenty-two years ago)

tR00 i|\|Di3 +|-|uGzz d0 |\|0+ s311 +|-|3ir \/1|\|Y1

― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Friday, 13 June 2003 23:37 (twenty-two years ago)

luckily i've sold nearly 300 of my 7" singles in the last few months. and they were MINT i tell you. stoney cold mint!!!!1

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Friday, 13 June 2003 23:42 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah but you know whose records you NEVER find in less than totally sandpapered-looking cond'n? uriah heep! uriah heep fans need to learn to look after their shit.

― duane, Saturday, 14 June 2003 00:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Every time I buy a used record by Yo la Tengo or Guided by Voices the record is always in unbelieveably bad shape.

I've found buying new stuff on Matador is chancey at best (the first LP of the last Bardo Pond 2LP is completely unlistenable, the road in front of my house has a smoother surface than the newest Arab Strap LP, the bonus 7" with the last Soft Boys LP damaged the last song on the first side of the 12" in the packaging) so maybe indie kids aren't to blame for the faulty YLT and GbV albums.

― Vic Funk, Saturday, 14 June 2003 00:43 (twenty-two years ago)

My version av Durutti columns LP the return of the Durutti column is pretty sandpapered looking (maybe it´s because the cover is made of SANDPAPER?)

― Jens (brighter), Saturday, 14 June 2003 00:49 (twenty-two years ago)

My vinyl's in great shape. It's my CDs that I treat like shit.

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Saturday, 14 June 2003 01:31 (twenty-two years ago)

MEAN

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 14 June 2003 01:32 (twenty-two years ago)

I can't even take care of my teeth, but I have cheap burned CDs that are five years old without a scratch on them. Music is important. My girlfriend throws her music around like everything's a cassette tape, leaves CDs in the car floorboard and ungly disrespectful shit like that, and she doesn't have a music collection worth talking about. It wounds me.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 14 June 2003 02:02 (twenty-two years ago)

My LP and CD collection is immaculate.

― Sean (Sean), Saturday, 14 June 2003 02:52 (twenty-two years ago)

My version av Durutti columns LP the return of the Durutti column is pretty sandpapered looking (maybe it´s because the cover is made of
SANDPAPER?)

boy oh boy, i envy you!! that record costs a fortune. triple figures anyhow. you do know that the members of joy division glued all those sandpaper covers on to the records, right? they did it for a little extra spending money.

― scott seward, Saturday, 14 June 2003 03:12 (twenty-two years ago)

My CDs are in OK shape. They always go back in a holder of some sort - jewel case or binder - right away.

My vinyl probably isn't great. I don't have anywhere to store it, so they're stacked on top of my entertainment center.

― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Saturday, 14 June 2003 04:00 (twenty-two years ago)

watching young wannabe dj's (where i work - they teach folk how to mix vinyl) and their vinyl handling skills makes me cringe time after time. whack the record on, manhandle the vinyl, scratch in the style of a chimp with a turntable then they whack the vinyl off and slide it under the turntables. thing is, the turntables are on concrete slabs.

even thopugh the records they use are pretty poor, it would still make you cringe.

― frenchbloke (frenchbloke), Saturday, 14 June 2003 06:33 (twenty-two years ago)

My vinyl's in great shape. It's my CDs that I treat like shit.

This is where the rockist in me comes out... part of me still has a hard time believing CD is a "real" medium. CDs seem so disposable and replaceable, but vinyl is forever.

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Saturday, 14 June 2003 06:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Dude, I paid for it, it's mine, I'll treat it how I want to.

― nabisco (nabisco), Saturday, 14 June 2003 06:50 (twenty-two years ago)

If you take care of CDs, they're not disposable, and then you don't have to replace them. But I know what you mean. I take care of my CDs, but I adore my vinyl.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 14 June 2003 06:51 (twenty-two years ago)

Dude, I paid for it, it's mine, I'll treat it how I want to.

This is true. You want a shitty-looking and sounding music collection, you got it.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 14 June 2003 06:52 (twenty-two years ago)

This whole thread is wrong because MINT ylt and gbv records are worth like, what, $2 apiece? It's not like indie fucks have vintage Soul Searchers or John Patton or Audio Two records lying around the "pad" anyway.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Saturday, 14 June 2003 07:06 (twenty-two years ago)

vinyl is beautiful, and you gotta treat it like your first born cept with no beatings. however, as someone was saying, buying new indie vinyl can be chancy. It depends on the label, but matador and domino and sometimes rough trade these days are pretty bad offenders, and the strangest thing is they often press their records on heavy vinyl, but for some reason whenver i buy one off those labels, its almost always somewhat off-centre or with surface damage, so the advantage of heavy vinyl is completely negated. That said, drag city, touch and go, and k recs in my experience do great vinyl. as for second hand indie vinyl, ive never sold any of mine, and i dont think ive bought much indie second hand, ive never really found a second hand record shop with a huge selection of indie

― Bob Shaw (Bob Shaw), Saturday, 14 June 2003 08:00 (twenty-two years ago)

hey!
i'm an 'indie fuck' and i've got an Audio Two 12"
lying around my room!

― joni, Saturday, 14 June 2003 10:27 (twenty-two years ago)

who cares... i dont buy records

― faggotry (faggotry), Saturday, 14 June 2003 13:59 (twenty-two years ago)

actually on a slight tangent I get v. cross when people moan at me about how unreliable CDs are and how they skip all the time etc and then you find that invariably the subject keeps their discs all over the floor, desk etc...well duh of course they're gonna get scratched, off to the gulag for you, chump

― DG (D_To_The_G), Saturday, 14 June 2003 14:04 (twenty-two years ago)

jesus christ they're just pieces of plastic with goddamn chords, sentiments, and "room sound" on them (not that music isn't holy, but there's a LOT more out there than just my collection so why shouldn't I ATTEMPT irreverence about it?). Forgive me if I don't make sure to brush the records thrice a month or keep my CD cases from getting cracked when they bash around my backpack.

Also, any indie rock I sell back will be in poor shape cuz I'll have been screaming "THE MONEY I WASTED ON YOU IN HIGH SCHOOOOL!" as I slam it back in its case. Though I doubt I'd sell back my Yo La Tengo (except MAYBE Ride The Tiger and probably New Wave Hot Dogs if it wasn't digitally encased next to my copy of President Yo La Tengo).

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 14 June 2003 14:31 (twenty-two years ago)

Dude, I paid for it, it's mine, I'll treat it how I want to.

Right on. CDs in particular can take a hell of a lot of abuse and still play just fine. There's no need to be so anal about it.

Personally, I've come to a point where as long as I have a digital copy of a song (or can easily find one), I just don't care about the physical cd. They are replaceable. I don't care about packaging anymore, I've thrown away most of the cd packaging that I've ever had last year to make more space. When I buy cds now, I usually only actually listen to them on my computer or on a burned cdr.

So, yeah, I totally understand why someone would want to keep their vinyl pristine, but the people who are getting all uptight about cds are just being ridiculous.

― Matthew Perpetua (Matthew Perpetua), Sunday, 15 June 2003 03:20 (twenty-two years ago)

In some ways, a lot of the comments in this thread inadvertantly make a good case for why vinyl has become mostly obsolete.

― Matthew Perpetua (Matthew Perpetua), Sunday, 15 June 2003 03:23 (twenty-two years ago)

'selection bias'

― Josh (Josh), Sunday, 15 June 2003 06:16 (twenty-two years ago)

i dunno about vinyl getting obsolete, cos when you have a good piece of vinyl it feels so alive, like a band of ghosts is playin in your livin room. cds feel flat in comparison, like a product, rather than a work of passion.

― Bob Shaw (Bob Shaw), Sunday, 15 June 2003 21:51 (twenty-two years ago)

i used to think that* but then i woke the hell up to myself

*may not be true

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Sunday, 15 June 2003 22:31 (twenty-two years ago)

CDs on average have a slightly less "seductive" vibe sonically (since I don't know the actualy term for it I might as well get poetic on it). Though I believe this difference (which recent improvements to digital recording have helped to erase somewhat) exists, it's NOWHERE as important to my listening pleasure as the songs themselves. I tend to be much pickier about that then on what format I have the songs.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 15 June 2003 22:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Let's not forget that mastering for CDs sucked until the early 90s

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Sunday, 15 June 2003 22:37 (twenty-two years ago)

I really do think vinyl sounds a bit better, but I'm no audiophile and I don't make a big deal of it. I did finally break down and buy a record cleaner last year though. More from a protect-my-investment point of view and I'm certainly not anal about using it. I only use it if a record looks really smudged/dirty/whatever.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Sunday, 15 June 2003 22:42 (twenty-two years ago)

I love that quote from Mr. Show about vin-yeel: CDS!?!?! Music wasn't meant to be heard with such...clarity! You need those snaps and crackles and shit. *pulls out his victrola*

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 15 June 2003 22:46 (twenty-two years ago)

i'd love one of those fancy turntable-type cleaner things. especially to clean up my aussie-pressed vinyl (which all sounds noisy and grotty)

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Sunday, 15 June 2003 22:47 (twenty-two years ago)

This? http://www.nittygrittyinc.com/

― Sean (Sean), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:08 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, or the Moth one, or the Loricraft..

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:10 (twenty-two years ago)

or the VPI hw-16.5 (the best value one as far as i can tell)

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:12 (twenty-two years ago)

i've done me research, as you can tell

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:12 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah, I've got the VPI. It really does work quite well, and effects a notable difference in sound quality with older records that have never been cleaned.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:40 (twenty-two years ago)

cds feel flat in comparison, like a product, rather than a work of passion.

Dude, you do know that vinyl records are made in factories, just like cds, right? It's not as if vinyl records are hand-crafted by the musicians out of dirt and twigs.

― Matthew Perpetua (Matthew Perpetua), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:58 (twenty-two years ago)

i've got this record that's on dirt and twig coloured vinyl

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:00 (twenty-two years ago)

Matthew, without me taking sides in the debate, a comment like that makes it obvious you don't even know - or are feigning ignorance of - the parameters.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:03 (twenty-two years ago)

vinyl sales go up, up, up every year. that's "new" vinyl sales. they bottomed out in the 80's(obv.)and have gone up ever since. that must say something. and that ain't all djs either(though, they don't hurt).especially since you have to go out of your way to find a lot of new vinyl.course it's only a smidgen of record sales.

― scott seward, Monday, 16 June 2003 03:05 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, that's very nice to know!

― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:10 (twenty-two years ago)

haha eventual result = all music will either be sold via digital softcopy over network or in vinyl format

― Millar (Millar), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:14 (twenty-two years ago)

Wouldn't surprise me. Who'd be a Cd loyalist?

― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:16 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't know about other genres but the bottom has disappeared out of indie vinyl sales - in the last couple of years several labels that released (and sold) stacks of vinyl are having major trouble breaking even now.

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:16 (twenty-two years ago)

The total number of new vinyl records selling in Australia is in the four figures. Which is Sod All.

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:17 (twenty-two years ago)

(per year i mean)

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:18 (twenty-two years ago)

(Actually it would surprise me btw)

― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:18 (twenty-two years ago)

i had a friend who treats their records and CDs appallingly. when they once asked me if they could borrow one of my CDs, you could have heard my derisive cackle three suburbs over.

Christ I hope you dont mean me! ;)

Much of my vinyl is sadly not in the condition it could be. This is for several reasons:
- I bought it 2ndhand to start with, it was already crackly
- an old friend used to DJ with my stuff and her idea of playing rekkids was to stack them all on top of each other out of their sleeves after she played them (oyyyy...)
- I admit, on occasion, I dont put a rekkid away when I should.

However in comparison I've been known to treat CDs like shit. I think sunconciously I assume they're unbreakable, and replaceable. I have stomped on this practice with DVDs as they are infinitely more costly and liable to skip/fail than audio.

I'd never make a collector.

― Trayce (trayce), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:19 (twenty-two years ago)

two years pass...

THE SOLUTION:

I only buy vinyl now, because i can digitise it using my Microtrack, then listen to it on my travels with my iPod, or at home on my stereo via my laptop. The Vinyl goes on the shelf and is lovingly gazed at in pristine condition until my wee lad takes custody of it.

― Laws, Thursday, 2 March 2006 13:02 (nineteen years ago)

My version av Durutti columns LP the return of the Durutti column is pretty sandpapered looking (maybe it´s because the cover is made of
SANDPAPER?)
boy oh boy, i envy you!! that record costs a fortune. triple figures anyhow. you do know that the members of joy division glued all those sandpaper covers on to the records, right? they did it for a little extra spending money.
-- scott seward (skotro...) (webmail), June 14th, 2003 4:12 AM. (link)

More than that, the rest of JDiv paid Ian to do their share. So, if you have this album, you have a piece of artwork made by Ian Curtis himself!

― mark grout (mark grout), Thursday, 2 March 2006 13:29 (nineteen years ago)

Perfect sound forever, my ass

― Roque Strew (RoqueStrew), Thursday, 2 March 2006 14:05 (nineteen years ago)

I tend to treat vinyl like the shroud of Turin, for the most part. But it's exceedingly rare that I pull vinyl out and listen to it. I don't buy new vinyl, I tend to troll used record stores and look for odds and ends.

― Brooker Buckingham (Brooker B), Thursday, 2 March 2006 16:02 (nineteen years ago)

I TAKE GOOd CARE OF MY RECORDS THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!!

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Thursday, 2 March 2006 16:10 (nineteen years ago)

i take good care of my records, but i am not an indie.
i got a copy of the 1st west coast pop art experimental band album the other day that was totally mauled with light scuffs & scratches, but it doesn't even sound bad! is it because it's mono? why do mono LPs tend to sound decent, even if they look like they're in really gnarly shape? i have noticed this also with some stones albums i have.

― Special Agent Gene Krupa (orion), Thursday, 2 March 2006 17:01 (nineteen years ago)

lol, i think i saw that one up on the acad3my ebay list the other day. or is it your own?

― midi sanskrit (sanskrit), Thursday, 2 March 2006 17:19 (nineteen years ago)

Your geekiest music collecting pet peeves

― Redd Scharlach (Ken L), Thursday, 2 March 2006 17:24 (nineteen years ago)

that one is my owwwwwn. if we ebayed one it wouldn't be beat up like mine is :(

some weirdos paid like $600-800 apiece for the first three love LPs. crazy.

― Special Agent Gene Krupa (orion), Thursday, 2 March 2006 17:31 (nineteen years ago)

Ian, I totally agree that scratchiness is much more tolerable with mono records. I think it's because you've got that single solid block of sound that you can focus on. When the surface noise is floating around in the stereo spectrum with the other sounds, it can definitely be more of an annoyance.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Thursday, 2 March 2006 17:50 (nineteen years ago)

one month passes...

As a perosn whos primarily interested in electronic music, indie doesnt interest me in the slightest.

however, all my LP's and realted are in great condition - with afew allowences for thing i bought when i was 12 and younger.

as far as record wear goes:

http://www.elpj.com/main.html

LAZER TURNTABLES!!

― Ed jackson, Wednesday, 19 April 2006 20:04 (nineteen years ago)

laser turntables are for complete idiots

― electric sound of jim (and why not) (electricsound), Thursday, 20 April 2006 07:53 (nineteen years ago)

rich ones.

― GOD PUNCH TO HAWKWIND (yournullfame), Thursday, 20 April 2006 08:04 (nineteen years ago)

$19,000 !

― mark grout (mark grout), Thursday, 20 April 2006 08:54 (nineteen years ago)

if you kids don't take care of your vulnerable indie vinyl, what am i supposed to do with it when I come to your house to steal it?

― smack, Thursday, 20 April 2006 12:57 (nineteen years ago)

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