ADMIN: personal vendettas, vigilante action, etc

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IF YOU DON’T LIKE THE EFFECTS, DON’T PRODUCE THE CAUSE
— George Clinton

Over recent weeks antagonisms between certain posters escalated beyond a joke, even for those directly involved. It’s obvious from several threads and voluminous email traffic that:
i. the main antagonists themselves were regretting that things have degenerated so far and would like a measure of sanity to be restored…
ii. several of the contributors to this situation are nevertheless incapable - out of anger or perverse enjoyment or whatever - of NOT piling back in whenever the opportunity arises

The threat of legal action has also arisen - seriously, as a wind-up, in anger or in desperation, it hardly matters, in a situation where mutual perceptions have gone so badly awry. The moderators have decided that a line be drawn, ground-rules established and preventive measures taken.

What’s primarily at issue is respect for the privacy of other posters, an issue which arises in different ways.

a. Spamming fellow posters’ emails, particularly with porn spam, is totally unacceptable. Obviously the ILX moderators would like to be able to abolish spam netwide: unfortunately we do not have that power. Threats on the boards to spam fellow posters’ emails is also unacceptable, as is encouraging other posters to do the same: we CAN and WILL police that.
b. Sustained and aggressive or abusive speculation about fellow posters’ private lives, sexuality and beliefs, with a view to wounding, insulting or intimidating is unacceptable. Friendly teasing or flirting in this same area is of course fine. We accept that the line between off-colour edgy fun and actual harassment will be drawn differently by every different poster, that no advance ruling is workable, that mistakes will be made, that misunderstandings will arise. The policing of this difficult territory will therefore be sensitive, insightful, impressive, ultimately influential at an international level.
c. Publication of personal information about other posters is unacceptable without their permission. Voluntary disclosure of such information on the boards (including names and email) will be taken as permission for others to use such information, but clearly NOT as permission to abuse them (as for example in the pursuit of a or b).

More generally (this should be obvious but is restated here for clarity), serious threats of personal violence against fellow posters are unacceptable. The moderators’ judgements will be final, on any line to be drawn at any given time, between the affectionate joke threat (fine, however lurid) and the genuine threat (unacceptable, however physically unrealistic).

ACTIONS TO BE TAKEN BY THE MODERATORS:
In our judgement, a series of threads, designed – by the poster’s own email admission – to annoy and provoke, cumulatively generated an atmosphere in which the routine minor but mutual disrespecting of one another’s personal space, privacy and diginity was nbot only tolerated, but escalating. Until threats of spamming and violence were being exchanged. Since the latter is clearly totally unacceptable, we feel compelled to introduce a rather harsher policing of such threads than we would prefer. Thus:

All threads we deem to have led to the current situation will now be LOCKED, as will all current threads relating to this incident (except this one). However NOTHING FURTHER on these threads will be deleted: there has to be a full public record of the sequence of incidents, exchanges and threats, as they led to present situation. They cannot be revived, and will gradually sink into the deep ooze of ILX: until only historians, archivists and random googlers will ever view them.

All FUTURE THREADS AND POSTS (ie subsequent to the posting of THIS thread) that the moderators consider an attempt to restart THIS PARTICULAR FIGHT (or its worst offshoots), whether by the named antagonists or other stirrers, will IMMEDIATELY be deleted. This is not negotiable. Absolute freedom of expression clearly clashes with the right to have one’s privacy respected: the moderators will draw lines here to suit, not abstract principles leading to endless dreary debate, but their own immediate convenience and the sense of the situation. Those do don’t like this can go set up their own boards elsewhere, moderated according to their own rules: good luck with that.

Included in these deletions will ALL FUTURE THREADS of the specific type that led to this situation: unanswerable, goading questions leading to cumulatively abusive speculation and counter-speculation about posters’ lifestyles, sexuality etc. We accept that this last stipulation is harsh, and that these threads were NOT necessarily started with the worst of motives, but given the mix of people now posting to ILX, it’s clear that future provocations of this type will, if sustained, simply lead us back to where we are now, and the re-establishment of a climate of casual mutual disrespect towards fellow posters’ right to privacy. We do not intend (or expect) to be back here again.

ACTIONS TO BE TAKEN BY ALL:
Regarding spam harvested by the presence of any poster’s email on ilx, there is nothing the moderators can do. We advise you to close compromised accounts and start others, better protected. ILX is easy to google and large, a very inviting feast for spambots, which we have no doubt have fed long and deeply. Many posters have accounts which they use only for ILX: others take a variety of anti-spam activities. We can only advise that, if spam is a genuine bother to you, you adopt one or all of these quarantine strategies.

Everyone involved in this fracas to date is of course absolutely free to post and to start threads as before, on any topic – unless they sin against the above, very narrow stipulations. Posters who make repeated habit of causing the moderators to delete their threads and posts run the risk of being banned, because the moderators are human and their patience is not inexhaustible.

mark s (mark s), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:33 (twenty-one years ago) link

A FABLE: Two small boys discovered that when they banged the side of the nest with a stick, the hornets buzzed and danced in a comical fashion. "That is a bad idea," said the bee-keeper. "But it is funny and we are such immensely clever fellows," said the small boys. "Nevertheless it is a bad idea," said the bee-keeper. "Haha it roxx and u r all lame," said the boys, and banged the nest again. The hornets buzzed and danced. Every day the boys returned to enjoy the turmoil they could so easily make — until one hot, still, close day the stick rattled so incessantly that it awoke, from ancient dreamless sleep, the dark warrior hornets of the hivemind’s Unconcious. Up and out swarmed the warrior hornets, buzzing and dancing and swooping and settling, great soft crawling vibrant carpets now sat horridly on the faces and eyes of the boys. From across the garden the beekeeper watched, as the boys twitched and screamed. The hornets were eating, with dreadful speed and relish, through into moist young boybrains. At one point the beekeeper made a move to help, but really the sun was so warm, and his drink was so nice, and his book was so interesting, and the hornet-hum was so soothing now that the boys had stopped moving and squeaking, and besides small piles of dry bones have always been easier to deal with and tidy away than actual live people....

THE MORAL: If you would like the ILX moderators to respond swiftly, attentively and sympathetically when you appear to have need of their response, don’t go out of your way to piss them off beforehand.

mark s (mark s), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:34 (twenty-one years ago) link

Mark S == Font of Eternal Wisdom
Bow down before his august glory ye snivelling maggots!

Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:39 (twenty-one years ago) link

What if one of the people doing things like this has the power to moderate the moderators? That's what bothers me.

Nicole (Nicole), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:50 (twenty-one years ago) link

not one of Aesop's better works, still the advice has been heeded as of...now.

stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:55 (twenty-one years ago) link

what if one of the moderators is editing posts all over the place?

Jon Williams (ex machina), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:55 (twenty-one years ago) link

QUIS CUSTODIET IPSOS CUSTODES?!?!

jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:56 (twenty-one years ago) link

".... serious threats of personal violence against fellow posters are unacceptable...."

Just to make sure I'm absolutely clear about this, what are the moderators' views regarding posters who make thinly veiled threats involving, oh I dunno, just to pick an example totally at random off the top of my head, swarms of flesh-eating warrior hornets?

Stewart Osborne (Stewart Osborne), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 14:59 (twenty-one years ago) link

Yeah, Sure, Rorschach keeps the ILM'ers on a tight leash...but who keeps Rorschach on a tight leash?

Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 15:03 (twenty-one years ago) link

What's this all about? The only "locked" threads I've seen are about Beyonce Knowles and Björk's hairy nipples. Stupid, yes (what can you expect from Calum?), but hardly offensive. Has something worse happened that I'm unaware of?

(Love the pic, Horace...)

Tuomas (Tuomas), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 15:05 (twenty-one years ago) link

um, posters were threating to spam each other, as i recall, on the beyonce thread. haven't even looked at the bjork one.

Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 15:06 (twenty-one years ago) link

Tuomas the situation as I understand it is that from threads of that type all sorts of nastiness had sprung (suspected spamming, threats of spamming, more general threats, personal attacks, etc etc) so from now on all those sorts of threads are fair game for immediate moderation.

Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 15:33 (twenty-one years ago) link

Just to make sure I'm absolutely clear about this, what are the moderators' views regarding posters who make thinly veiled threats involving, oh I dunno, just to pick an example totally at random off the top of my head, swarms of flesh-eating warrior hornets?

HYSTERICS

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 16:39 (twenty-one years ago) link

I don't want to speak for Dan, but I'd say "Hit Rock Bottom" has come to mind.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 16:54 (twenty-one years ago) link

Haha it roxx and u r all lame

i'd TOTALLY read more Aesop if all the characters spoke like this. I'd also be entertained by people's attempts to spell "Fox" in such a fashion.

i dunno. I like the odd drooling threads--it gives me somewhere to post the non-sequitors that i find.

Kingfish (Kingfish), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 18:32 (twenty-one years ago) link

That's beautiful.

colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Tuesday, 17 June 2003 22:08 (twenty-one years ago) link

"All FUTURE THREADS AND POSTS (ie subsequent to the posting of THIS thread) that the moderators consider an attempt to restart THIS PARTICULAR FIGHT (or its worst offshoots), whether by the named antagonists or other stirrers, will IMMEDIATELY be deleted. This is not negotiable."

the moderators (mark s), Wednesday, 18 June 2003 15:08 (twenty-one years ago) link

What the hell is that "sexy beast" crap? That's about as sexy as a rabbit turd.

David R. (popshots75`), Wednesday, 18 June 2003 15:41 (twenty-one years ago) link

i believe that it had to do with the shot of Ray Winstone's balls-in-a-speedo that the title card is flashed over in the opening.

and i see that someone else here peruses Fark.com...

Kingfish (Kingfish), Wednesday, 18 June 2003 16:43 (twenty-one years ago) link

haha!

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 18 June 2003 17:19 (twenty-one years ago) link

''"All FUTURE THREADS AND POSTS (ie subsequent to the posting of THIS thread) that the moderators consider an attempt to restart THIS PARTICULAR FIGHT (or its worst offshoots), whether by the named antagonists or other stirrers, will IMMEDIATELY be deleted. This is not negotiable."''

me thinks sinker needs to read the trucker hats thread to lower his blood pressure (oh wait!)

Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 18 June 2003 17:30 (twenty-one years ago) link

Any chance of nipping this one in the bud?

Classic or Dud: Music videos with nudity

Aaron W (Aaron W), Friday, 27 June 2003 14:04 (twenty-one years ago) link

Its you know who, along with the Bloodhound thread they are both gone.
Please don't bait him, it just doesn't work.

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Friday, 27 June 2003 14:21 (twenty-one years ago) link

Sigh. But there went my (read HSA's) Barry Six-And-A-Half joke. Sigh.

kate (kate), Friday, 27 June 2003 14:22 (twenty-one years ago) link

[post deleted by moderators: "Posters who make repeated habit of causing the moderators to delete their threads and posts run the risk of being banned, because the moderators are human and their patience is not inexhaustible."]

Spooner, Friday, 27 June 2003 14:45 (twenty-one years ago) link

[post deleted by moderators: newbies are welcome to ilx]

Spooner, Wednesday, 2 July 2003 11:50 (twenty-one years ago) link

http://www.cherchies.com/products/lemn_dill_seasoning.jpg

Nicole (Nicole), Wednesday, 2 July 2003 11:53 (twenty-one years ago) link

aw shucks is that eminem vs bloodhound gang thread gone? I was saving that one to read later because I thought it sounded like a good question.

Sam (chirombo), Wednesday, 2 July 2003 12:57 (twenty-one years ago) link

The moderators, and anyone sufficiently geeky (and I don't mean musically geeky) might want to read this: http://www.shirky.com/writings/group_enemy.html

Sample quote (heavily condensed):

"In the Seventies ... a BBS called Communitree launched, one of the very early dial-up BBSes... Communitree was founded on the principles of open access and free dialogue. And the notion was, effectively, throw off structure and new and beautiful patterns will arise.

And, indeed, that does happen... And then, as time sets in, difficulties emerge. In this case, one of the difficulties was occasioned by the fact that one of the institutions that got hold of some modems was a high school. And who, in 1978, was hanging out in the room with the computer and the modems in it, but the boys of that high school. And the boys weren't terribly interested in sophisticated adult conversation. They were interested in fart jokes. They were interested in salacious talk. They were interested in running amok and posting four-letter words and nyah-nyah-nyah, all over the bulletin board.

And the adults who had set up Communitree were horrified, and overrun by these students. The place that was founded on open access had too much open access, too much openness. They couldn't defend themselves against their own users. The place that was founded on free speech had too much freedom. They had no way of saying "No, that's not the kind of free speech we meant." "

foop, Wednesday, 2 July 2003 15:30 (twenty-one years ago) link

"Absolute freedom of expression clearly clashes with the right to have one’s privacy respected: the moderators will draw lines here to suit, not abstract principles leading to endless dreary debate, but their own immediate convenience and the sense of the situation. Those do don’t like this can go set up their own boards elsewhere, moderated according to their own rules: good luck with that."

mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 2 July 2003 15:35 (twenty-one years ago) link

i wonder if those who advocate 100% unregulated free speech would be in favour of their personal details/address/parents address/phone number being posted?

gareth (gareth), Wednesday, 2 July 2003 15:54 (twenty-one years ago) link

i'm disappointed my hilarious 'male dominated' joke in reference to spooner was deleted

stevem (blueski), Wednesday, 2 July 2003 20:27 (twenty-one years ago) link

two months pass...
Has it only been to monthes?

Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Tuesday, 9 September 2003 12:19 (twenty-one years ago) link

Verily.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 9 September 2003 13:56 (twenty-one years ago) link

six months pass...
Couldn't the sexist threads count as personal vendettas? I mean if the titles of those threads were directed at a specific person on the board, they would obviously be unacceptable.

a (Amity), Wednesday, 17 March 2004 23:58 (twenty years ago) link

obviously. so what's your point?

the surface noise (electricsound), Wednesday, 17 March 2004 23:59 (twenty years ago) link

Which in particular a? If you mean the ones on ILE you should say something on the 'Moderation Request' board - link at the bottom of every thread? If they're on ILM I will go take a look.

Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Thursday, 18 March 2004 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah I guess I meant ILE at the moment, never mind though.

a (Amity), Thursday, 18 March 2004 07:36 (twenty years ago) link


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