harry pussy vs john coltrane

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some guy playing scales on electric guitar for 2 mins (with some woman doing primal scream therapy and a drum kit being thrashed around): they've split up and not many ppl have heard of them vs 'some guy' playing scales for 20 mins but ppl call it 'spiritual' and you can buy his recs at yr nearest local rec store.

(just got a couple of 12'' (through the sc** l***), which arrived this morning)

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 5 July 2003 07:50 (twenty-three years ago)

7'' actually.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 5 July 2003 08:08 (twenty-three years ago)

thanks for codifying my problem with jazz, julio.

harry pussy by a hundred fucking miles.

― your null fame (yournullfame), Saturday, 5 July 2003 08:11 (twenty-three years ago)

b-but null its the same thing!

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 5 July 2003 08:12 (twenty-three years ago)

right, but one sucks and the other doesn't.

― your null fame (yournullfame), Saturday, 5 July 2003 08:16 (twenty-three years ago)

haha b-b-but...

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 5 July 2003 08:18 (twenty-three years ago)

man if there was a harry pussy vs. john coltrane manga then the universe would suddenly radiate goodness and joy

― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Saturday, 5 July 2003 13:48 (twenty-three years ago)

Coltrane brings it way harder than any whitey I've ever heard.

― Rem Lezar, Saturday, 5 July 2003 15:00 (twenty-three years ago)

''man if there was a harry pussy vs. john coltrane manga then the universe would suddenly radiate goodness and joy''

*remind self to invent time machine*

rem- would you like a medal for being 'controversial'?

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 5 July 2003 15:13 (twenty-three years ago)

i never could stand coltrane. never got it. ornette i understood - clowny silly soppy funky childish jazz MESS.
IT'S THE PUSS.
IT@STHE PUSS
ITVYUJ YPSS
IN Gsd Yp UUUUss
yeah!!!!!!

― bob snoom, Saturday, 5 July 2003 15:57 (twenty-three years ago)

Yeah, Ornette > Harry Pussy > Coltrane, as far as can tell, but I'm by no means an expert on any of the above.

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Saturday, 5 July 2003 20:32 (twenty-three years ago)

I've never understood people who are into jazz but don't like Coltrane. It's ironic that he gets the "spirituality" tag - which I give fuck-all about - when I think what puts people off him is the cold, clinical aspect to his tone and to much of his playing.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Saturday, 5 July 2003 20:41 (twenty-three years ago)

BTW i do like both and i think bill orcutt's guitar would 'fit' with late period coltrane (maybe that's just me but you know..), this 'taking sides' thread is a bit of a joke, of course.

so why would you say its clinical? is it bcz he is so wrapped in his technical perfection? I'm not sure it leaves me cold (on the last concert i get more out of what pharoah sanders is doing and that's the one coltrane disc i have been listening to) or hot right now?

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 5 July 2003 20:48 (twenty-three years ago)

He's cold in a lot of ways. "cold" in the sense of his tone; just in the sense of the tone color he produces from his reed, owing to his embouchure. He is immediately recognizable; you'll never confuse him with, say Coleman Hawkins or his contemporary Sonny Rollins - both of whom I would readily describe as "warm". Also, he practically never employs vibrato, as most reedists do. This further removes any analogues his playing may have with vocalization, singing, which many reedists allude to in their playing. And yes, his technically immaculate style, his employ of fast runs - ok "scales" sometimes, sure - and his "sheets of sound", definitely set him apart as a freak, a cyborg.

And that's why I love him!!

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Saturday, 5 July 2003 20:56 (twenty-three years ago)

but, you know, throw out everything I said when you audition something like "Alabama" - simply one of the most beautiful expressions of humanity ever recorded.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Saturday, 5 July 2003 21:02 (twenty-three years ago)

i find sense in the term spiritual with coltrane because of the way his tone can so move you.

but maybe it was used because of how religion helped him with heroin, perhaps.

― martin (martin), Saturday, 5 July 2003 21:07 (twenty-three years ago)

I mean, he himself was an incredibly spiritual person, there's no doubt about that. I love the comment in the liners to Live in Japan where he says he's primarily a vegetarian because it helps him keep in command of his emotions.

Everyone knows the only reason he never smiled was because he was self-conscious about his bad teeth, right?

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Saturday, 5 July 2003 21:12 (twenty-three years ago)

i luv coltrane & could easily listen to nuthin else for weeks or months, i like h.pussy but but i wouldn't care if i never heard them again

― duane (lucylurex), Saturday, 5 July 2003 23:53 (twenty-three years ago)

Duane pretty much states my position on this, I gotta say.

― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Sunday, 6 July 2003 01:21 (twenty-three years ago)

ultimately, he was a funny guy. Writing "Giant Steps" and forcing generations to come to learn and navigate its ridiculous changes = a cruel joke surely?

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Sunday, 6 July 2003 01:45 (twenty-three years ago)

PPl often say that Coltrane plays the tenor like an alto, dunno if that's really accurate/true, but maybe it accounts for this perceived 'lack of warmth' - funny tho', I always think of Sonny Rollins as a much 'colder' player than Coltrane, more ironic ("There's no business like showbusiness") and detached, and without any of JC's honking out-passion.

― Andrew L (Andrew L), Sunday, 6 July 2003 07:02 (twenty-three years ago)

''Everyone knows the only reason he never smiled was because he was self-conscious about his bad teeth, right?''

I don't think this is widely known but i found out abt, what, a year ago.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Sunday, 6 July 2003 07:49 (twenty-three years ago)

its harsh but, ah, searing no? i mean its only cold if you think *extreme* emotions are cold. its not cuddly warm melancholy.

the sheets of sound/giant steps "cyborg" identity might put people off as "oh he's got chops he must be a muso" cold.

― gaz (gaz), Sunday, 6 July 2003 08:53 (twenty-three years ago)

i don't have much of a prob with the sheets of sounds thing. but it might have been problematic when he went into 'free' areas.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Sunday, 6 July 2003 09:04 (twenty-three years ago)

hardly cold though...insane maybe.

― gaz (gaz), Sunday, 6 July 2003 09:18 (twenty-three years ago)

rubber sheeets vs sheets of tin foil

― bob snoom, Sunday, 6 July 2003 14:26 (twenty-three years ago)

um, there was no 'insanity' to it. it was a 'process' that he thought abt and set out to execute, i think.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Sunday, 6 July 2003 14:28 (twenty-three years ago)

okay so i like 'ascension' but not 'giant steps' so much, what else should i listen to that sounds more like the former and less like the latter?

― thom west (thom w), Sunday, 6 July 2003 14:36 (twenty-three years ago)

Hey Thom. Coltrane started abandoning changes within a couple of albums after Giant Steps...I'd say you should at least check out the quartet stuff like Crescent, Live at Birdland, Ole Coltrane, etc. as the middle ground between his straight-ahead and 'ecstatic' free years. For another (not quite so) large group later album though, Meditations is probably the one. It's got Pharoah and Rashied Ali and Elvin Jones on it, right before Elvin quit.

― Jordan (Jordan), Sunday, 6 July 2003 15:39 (twenty-three years ago)

Hey Thom. how about Albert Aylers "Ghost Signs." i think that's what it's called. not near my vinyl at the mo. fairly free i'd say...

and re coltrane, it's all about "love supreme" i say, though "favourite things" is v special.

― martin (martin), Sunday, 6 July 2003 18:33 (twenty-three years ago)

julio i'm not saying i find giant steps cold, or ascension insane. i'm just saying i could see how other folks might...

― gaz (gaz), Monday, 7 July 2003 00:49 (twenty-three years ago)

ole = latin jazz-house

― Josh (Josh), Monday, 7 July 2003 01:56 (twenty-three years ago)

holy mother of lamb shit, have you ever heard Coltrane's "Meditations?" Ow.

― gage o (gage o), Monday, 7 July 2003 13:06 (twenty-three years ago)

i think of coltrane's tone as "cool", not "cold". i don't think harry pussy's music is particularly warm either.

― j fail (cenotaph), Monday, 7 July 2003 18:42 (twenty-three years ago)

i like both.

by the way...

http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=siltrecs&include=0&since=-1&sort=3&rows=50

tom lax of siltbreeze is selling some old siltbreeze stuff... including a harry pussy cd... buy it now for cheap as hell with free shipping!

― msp, Monday, 7 July 2003 19:16 (twenty-three years ago)

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