The History of Oppositional Dualities & Music Scenes

80's Hair-metal vs. Synth-pop

How exactly did you forget the mods vs. rockers, btw?

60's / 70's / 80's: Skinheads vs.... well.... pretty much everyone really (perhaps most notably, they were frequently anti- the very people who made the music they favoured (R&B, Soul, Ska); and if there was no-one else about, they'd start kicking each other's heads in - so not only spectacularly dumb but largely self-destructive)

70's: Teds vs Punks, Mods vs Punks, Rockers vs. Punks, Straights vs Punks, in fact Pretty much everyone vs. Punks (punk enters classroom as small, scrawny new kid who just won't keep his big mouth shut and ends up getting picked on by all the other kids)

80's: Punks vs. Mod(Revivalist)s (Punk ceases to be the smallest kid in the classroom and finds someone even smaller and weedier to pick on)

Well, I'm mainly interested in debates as they happened at the time, not so much retrospectively. I do have an idea from talking to my Dad that folk & college jazz like Dave Brubeck were definitely seen as a more refined & sophisticated alternative to pop/rock & roll when he was in college in the early '60s. Just wondering if this is something that keeps repeating.

heh. does this remind anybody of the "who beat up who" monologue in "SLC Punk"?

fusion vs. 'free' jazz (miles davis is still more 'fusion' even if influenced by Stockhausen, as some free players definitely were)

fusion/canterbury 'art' rock vs. other 'art rock' e.g. Caravan vs. 10cc vs. Henry Cow vs. Roxy Music (see below)

the '80s and '90s

ambient as easy listening electronic music, elevator music vs. 'ambient' as coined by brian eno, as foreground/background, interesting/fleeting, furniture or center of attention

'acid jazz' easy listening music vs. real mind-bending jazz improv or composition from several decades

'lounge' easy listening like 'The future sound of london', 'the brand new heavies' (ha, ha, what names) vs. 'space age bachelor pad music' as defined by Stereolab, an intelligent wide selection of textures, rhythms, 'pop song' constructs, pseudo-political ranting mixed with 'oohhh, aahhh, be-bum, be-boo, ..'

and Sterelobs committed approach to 'pop music' reminds me of a specific favourite of mine from another time, another place :
roxy music, crooning re-contextualised as ambiguous or confused confessional or 'talking cool' posing, confusion of sincerity with a tone people sometimes use to convince potential play-pals that they really feel something deep, the social games people play and the poses, and like stereolab, a long hard look at pop music conventions of the day (in this case 'glam rock') as a possibly meaningful music/art vs. bryan ferry '70s solo, often covers, often ferry attempting a new yet sincere angle song by song, crooning (2.H.B.), soulful belting ('let's stick together'), hamming it up like roxy music ('sympathy for the devil', 'the in crowd'), smouldering/sulking ('it's my party'), nick cave style menace ('a hard rains gonna fall')

It kind of did feel that simple for 5 minutes in 1987.

but then they lezzed up
and metal slobbered and joined in

but hey who wouldn't

"It's just not Como maaaaaan!"

Glenn Ford then wishes he was in a western movie armed with a carbine so he could finish off the punks like they deserve.

goth and industrial were all the same shit to me. go indiepop, I think.

'politics' of industrial = left or right both lead to totalitarian dystopias so fuck voting cos its all completely fucking fucked

(NMA were not goth)

Never had you pegged as a Cream fan, D.