postdating punk again?

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My Real Player says The Ramones are "Pre-punk."

― JesseFox (JesseFox), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 04:57 (twenty-two years ago)

Well I've heard it said that Shakespeare's character Puck was the first punk.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 05:11 (twenty-two years ago)

Aren't the Ramones reg rock? (As in 'transg rock'==Throbbing Gristle.)

― nestmanso (nestmanso), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 06:49 (twenty-two years ago)

I think 'pre-punk' is a commonly used term to describe a number of bands: Velvet Underground, Stooges, Television, etc... I guess its related to 'attitude' as much as music

― Robin Goad (rgoad), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 07:09 (twenty-two years ago)

everyone is missing Jesse's point

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 07:10 (twenty-two years ago)

They were pre-English punk, therefore pre-punk *ducks*

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 07:11 (twenty-two years ago)

a contrario, what is post-english punk?

― Marcel Grospig Jr. (grouffman), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:19 (twenty-two years ago)

How is "pre-punk" different from "proto-punk"?

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:20 (twenty-two years ago)

How is RealPlayer an authority?

― dave225 (Dave225), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 13:53 (twenty-two years ago)

RealPlayer's not an authority. It just interested me, that's all. "Punk" seems like one of those things that's forever being repositioned culturally and chronologically -- like moving the chains on a football field. I'm guessing that Colin's right with the "pre-English punk" line (RealPlayer calls The Clash "Old School Punk"). But I bet Johnny Ramone would kick your ass if you tried to tell him he was just "pre-punk."

― JesseFox (JesseFox), Wednesday, 20 August 2003 15:12 (twenty-two years ago)

It's a funny word, 'punk' isn't it. It says, 'yes i smell, I am garbage'. It reclaims former landfill for new growth. It may be a strategy rather than a recent musical development. It may even be a basic human strategy, a basic human archetype?

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Thursday, 21 August 2003 05:00 (twenty-two years ago)

That's the only justification I can think of for claiming Shakespeare's Puck is a punk. But he was! He was.

― colin s barrow (colin s barrow), Thursday, 21 August 2003 05:02 (twenty-two years ago)

Lester Bangs called Punks "Punks" before The Ramones shared a surname. Lester Bangs... Real Player. A close tie but I'd side with the dead guy.

― Speedy Gonzalas (Speedy Gonzalas), Thursday, 21 August 2003 06:15 (twenty-two years ago)

why? he can't hurt you.

― Dave M. (rotten03), Thursday, 21 August 2003 06:30 (twenty-two years ago)

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