Taking sides: Abba vs. The Carpenters

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Very upbeat, ornate, well-orchestrated 70's hit machine with male composers and female vocals vs. very sad, ornate, well-orchestrated 70's hit machine with male composer and female vocals

I prefer the Carpenters. They just hit me right there, you know? Abba, I never really got at all.

― My name is Kenny (My name is Kenny), Monday, 25 August 2003 05:13 (twenty-two years ago)

Abba for me. 'The Visitors' is a miracle. I love many of the singles and there's at least one good non-hit track on each of the nine albums (uhm if you count 'I Am Just A Girl' which granted you have some courage to appreciate)

The Carpenters no longer send me screaming from the room, now I'm simply not getting them. They sound good backwards.

― jl (Jon L), Monday, 25 August 2003 06:36 (twenty-two years ago)

The Carpenters. Karen, looking back, was a perfect tragic figure in a way that the faceless ABBA kids could never have been. Plus, Karen was an amazingly skilled singer, who was never given the credit she deserved due to some unfortunately saccharine arrangements. I can think of few pop singers to stay so deftly behind the beat.

― derrick (derrick), Monday, 25 August 2003 06:47 (twenty-two years ago)

I love them both...Carpenters have the edge in pure emotional impact perhaps, but ABBA wins out overall by being more musically interesting, and just for their sheer consistency.

― Angus Gordon (angusg), Monday, 25 August 2003 11:23 (twenty-two years ago)

ABBA have countless thousands of good album tracks

― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Monday, 25 August 2003 11:28 (twenty-two years ago)

The Carpenters by a country mile. ABBA is okay, though I find the cult of ironically dancing to their songs to be annoying, but the Carpenters actually move me in a way ABBA does not. Also, I simply find more to listen to in their music (all thos Bacharach songs). I can't be completely definite about this, since I'm only familiar with ABBA from some of their hits (but then again, the same is true of the Carpenters).

― Al Andalous, Monday, 25 August 2003 12:04 (twenty-two years ago)

I am able to dance to ABBA non ironically, a feat I have not achieved for many 80s chart hits or indie anthems.

I never really liked the Carpenters much.

― N. (nickdastoor), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:11 (twenty-two years ago)

My favourite Carpenters songs are "Rainy Days and Mondays", "Goodbye to Love", and "Hurting Each Other".

― sundar subramanian (sundar), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:17 (twenty-two years ago)

I like 'Solitaire'

― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:19 (twenty-two years ago)

The Carpenters never rocked. Ever. They never lifted themselves out of the mawkish, syruppy swamp of dreary milksoppery. They never danced, they only smiled the beautific smiles of the zombified undead. Shun them.

Abba, by comparison, were sublime. Better tunes. Better hooks. More versatile.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:21 (twenty-two years ago)

They sound good backwards.

Hahahaha.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:21 (twenty-two years ago)

I don't think I recall any Carpenters song.

― Siegbran (eofor), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:33 (twenty-two years ago)

What does ironic dancing look like? Do people do air quotes or something?

― Angus Gordon (angusg), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:37 (twenty-two years ago)

The worst is when it leads to ironic sex.

― N. (nickdastoor), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:40 (twenty-two years ago)

I know it when I see it. (There are body language ways of saying: "I'm doing this, but I'm not really serious" or "Look at me being a show-woman wah ha ha," etc.)

Did you really come, or was that an ironic orgasm?

― Al Andalous, Monday, 25 August 2003 12:41 (twenty-two years ago)

What does ironic dancing look like? Do people do air quotes or something?

oh bloody hell - i hope not.

I go for the Carpenters for "Goodbye to Love" and "Superstar" - though i prefer Sonic Youth's Cover. ABBA are good too, obviously but i have od'd on them and i find that there ain't much feeling there. Fun though - when i was a kid i used to sing along to "Thankyou gor the Music" and imagine i was onstage singing along to an audience - it seemed to real to me.

― jed_e_3 (jed_e_3), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:45 (twenty-two years ago)

(I don't necessarily always know it when I see it, actually, but I feel pretty sure of it often enough.)

― Al Andalous, Monday, 25 August 2003 12:53 (twenty-two years ago)

ABBA. I haven't heard that many Carpenters' songs, but the ones I have heard haven't really left good impressions on me. Maybe they're too sad.

― dleone (dleone), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:56 (twenty-two years ago)

Carpenters are GRATE, but Abba is ACE!!!!! And no, I'm not being 'ironic', nearly all their stuff from the "Waterloo" album onwards is top drawer!!!! (Mind you, the 'Benny-Bjorn-Agnetha-Annafrid-Ploppypants' era stuff before that is mostly utter bollox, but they had to start somewhere!!!!) And some of the album-only traxxz are even better than their hit parade ventures- stuff like "Suzy Hang Around", "Hey Hey Helen", "Tiger", "Eagle", "Move On", "Our Last Summer", "Lovers Live a Little Longer", "The Visitors", "Soldiers"... Even the B-sides have grebt chunes like "Cassandra"- Bjorn and Benny arguably give Bacharach a run for his money in terms of good pop songs!!!

And while I'm here, what's all this piffle about the Carpenters being really sad (in emotional terms) in comparision with Abba!?!?! Karen Carpenter certainly counts as a "tragic figure" because of what happened to her, but have any of you lot actually listened to some of Abba's songs?!?!?!? A great deal of them seem to be detailing the long slow process of Agnetha (the blond one) and Bjorn (Frog-face, no beard) fighting their way round to getting a divorce!!!! The obvious example being "The Winner Takes All", which is probably one of the most bitter and humiliating pop songs ever written about seperation!!! It just goes on and on about it- for nearly five minutes!!!!! And the person wot sings the words used to be married to the person wot wrote 'em!!!! And this is their biggest UK hit, going straight into the top of tha hit parade, and staying for 4 weeks, back in the olden days when you needed to be a rather massive act to do that kind of thing!!!! And that's before we even get to the paranoid atmosphere surrounding "The Visitors" album, which affects even supposedly "jolly" tracks like "Head Over Heels"!!!!!

And if you want a tragic character, Agnetha is probably if anything more mixed up than Karen was, except given that she's a) Swedish and b) well off, she's probably won't die of anything other than of old age...

Erm, that's it!!!!

― Old Fart!!! (oldfart_sd), Monday, 25 August 2003 12:58 (twenty-two years ago)

Agreed about "The Winner Takes It All," gut-wrenching stuff. Also, of course, some of the Carpenters' songs are almost comically happy--eg "Sing," "Close to You"--but people tend to interpret even them as having a melancholy undertow or whatever because of what happened to Karen.

― Angus Gordon (angusg), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:03 (twenty-two years ago)

the faceless ABBA kids...

wtf? "kids"? already when Abba *started* as a band, three of its four members must have been something like 27 or 28 years old.
some kids.

well, i also have grown tired of a few of the Swedes' most obvious hits, yet that still leaves (to my own sweet surprise) a lot of their other songs i still love immensely.

and it's almost the same with the Carpenters for me. only in their case i'd be hard pressed to name the actual titles of the uninteresting songs.

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:05 (twenty-two years ago)

I used to prefer the Sonic Youth version of "Superstar" but I don't anymore.

I will say that I don't actively hate Abba as violently as I used to.

― sundar subramanian (sundar), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:13 (twenty-two years ago)

Sundar, are you a cold-hearted replicant? How could you possibly Abba?

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:15 (twenty-two years ago)

the carpenters move me deeply, i dont know why, but their simplicity was sublime and the fate of karen makes me feel upset for humanity.

abba was a v. good dance band.

why is this a question, they are apples and oranges ?

― anthony easton (anthony), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:17 (twenty-two years ago)

sure those songs are happy but Karen carries so much sadness in her voice.

"i'll say goodbye to Love, no-one ever cared if i should live or die,
time and time again the chance for love has passed me be
and all i know of love is how to live without it - i just cant seem to find it.

So ive made my mind up i must live my life alone
and though its not the easy way i guess i've always known - id say goodbye to love"

give up before you even get it. thats my life.

anyway of course angus prefers ABBA - he's Australian!

― jed_e_3 (jed_e_3), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:18 (twenty-two years ago)

Huh, true Jed, and I grew up in the 70s, ABBA is in my blood like vegemite. (Except I hate vegemite.)

― Angus Gordon (angusg), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:19 (twenty-two years ago)

I too grew up with Abba and can't remember hearing ever hearing, or even hearing of, The Carpenters, until I was at university.

My suspicion is that the entire Carpenters history and catalogue was invented by the 70s nostalgia industry circa 1989. They're not fooling me.

― N. (nickdastoor), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:25 (twenty-two years ago)

Obviously ABBA's bestest but I'm perplexed by the love shown for The Visitors. Sure, it has some truly remarkable moments - the title track, Like An Angel Passing Through My Room - but it's not exactly the band's peak is it? They're exhausted into a numbness and while the painfulness of their relationships breaking down, that are catalogued in the songs, hold a grim fascination the band seem to be going mechanically through the motions a lot of the time; they’ve all but given up. An ABBA running on empty can still out-run any Carpenter, but give me the firing-on-all-cylinders ABBA anyday.

― David Merryweather (DavidM), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:35 (twenty-two years ago)

ABBA's best work is as good as pop music gets. Period.

― Alex Firtzin (AlexZ), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:46 (twenty-two years ago)

...plus Abba wrote all their own songs (and, yes, I'm aware Richard C. penned the occasional tune)

― Dadaismus (Dada), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:49 (twenty-two years ago)

OH NO ABBA REALLY ARE THE POP GROUP IT'S OK FOR ROCKISTS TO LIKE.

― N. (nickdastoor), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:55 (twenty-two years ago)

The Carpenters

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:57 (twenty-two years ago)

"penned"

― mark s (mark s), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:57 (twenty-two years ago)

OH NO ABBA REALLY ARE THE POP GROUP IT'S OK FOR ROCKISTS TO LIKE.

No, they're simply the better band.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:58 (twenty-two years ago)

Yes, "penned", what's it to ya?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Monday, 25 August 2003 13:59 (twenty-two years ago)

Has anyone else seen the really hilarious made for tv movie about the carpenters? i think i saw it on lifetime. it was a classic. both abba and the carpenters make me ill, sorry. but that movie was highly entertaining!

― Emilymv (Emilymv), Monday, 25 August 2003 14:03 (twenty-two years ago)

I liked that Carpenters movie but then I liked the Beach Boys one too.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Monday, 25 August 2003 14:04 (twenty-two years ago)

ABBA are better who cares

― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Monday, 25 August 2003 14:05 (twenty-two years ago)

i've seen the todd haynes carpenters movie....

as for the thread question: ABBA

― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:19 (twenty-two years ago)

oh i'd love to see that Todd Haynes Movie.

i put my oar in earlier for the Carpenters, now i don't know -hearing alll these eulogies to ABBA has made me less sure - they are both beautiful.

― jed_e_3 (jed_e_3), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:39 (twenty-two years ago)

I like both of them but I don't really see what they have in common - Abba were a pop band and The Carpenters more a kind of MOR act.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:42 (twenty-two years ago)

the carpenters, for me, evoke a certain period and not much more (an exception: "superstar"). abba were epic.

― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:47 (twenty-two years ago)

....d and The Carpenters more a kind of MOR act.

....as in "GOD HELP ME, I CAN'T TAKE IT ANY MOR!"

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:49 (twenty-two years ago)

alex do you like abba?

― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:49 (twenty-two years ago)

also hating the carpenters is so 1972. :)

― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:50 (twenty-two years ago)

I love Abba.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:51 (twenty-two years ago)

I just found the Carpenters so inspidly mawkish, they made fuckin' Captain & Tenille sound like Blue Cheer.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:52 (twenty-two years ago)

richard c. had pretty good taste in material. his arrangements were usually well-balanced too. he did good things with long lengths as well, generally w/o resorting to gimmickry. but the actual sounds that comprise those arrangements are sometimes hard to take, tinny synths and overly tinkly pianos, and karen's voice which is always go-for-broke. there's a dispiriting sameness to their records, which means (i think) they're better heard now and again on the radio than played back to back on the turntable. abba, however, are epic. (did i say that already?)

c. & t. had some ok arrangements too! but the songs weren't as good as the carpenters'. and despite my misgivings abt karen's voice she's way more distinctive and arresting than tenille.

― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 25 August 2003 15:53 (twenty-two years ago)

ABBA,ABBA,ABBA. Old Fart is bang on on the almost unbearable 'Winner Takes It All', and then there's 'the Day Before You Came' with a lyric that Jarvis circa 'inside Susan' would have given his tweed collection to have written...
'Close To You' is still a marvellous thing though.

― Myron Kosloff, Monday, 25 August 2003 16:17 (twenty-two years ago)

"scrawled in own blood"

― thom west (thom w), Monday, 25 August 2003 16:19 (twenty-two years ago)

Skipping 18 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

''rubbernecking''?

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Tuesday, 26 August 2003 07:31 (twenty-two years ago)

The people for whom this thread boils down to Taking Sides: Death vs Divorce, Julio!

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 26 August 2003 07:57 (twenty-two years ago)

I think I'd have to give it to ABBA for not only being a band but also a soap opera at the same time.

They fell in love with each other and broke up and got married and divorced, the details are hazy now, but the bittersweet situation where you're a famous writer of love songs and you've had a tragic love affair with the woman who sings your songs, and you break up, and write a song about it, and she sings it... unbeatable.

If Richard and Karen had fallen in love ... not so entertaining...

― johnh, Wednesday, 27 August 2003 01:01 (twenty-two years ago)

i don't think i've ever heard anything by the carpenters

― robin (robin), Wednesday, 27 August 2003 01:18 (twenty-two years ago)

Carpenters by a mile - ABBA's songs are great, but they have so few interesting production ideas - Richard Carpenter, on the other hand, is a mad genius (for evidence of the "mad" part pls. note that the guitar solo toward the end of "Superstar" somehow made it through mixing and onto the record). The last Karen sessions on the "Lovelines" album...God, what an amazingly great singer.

― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Wednesday, 27 August 2003 01:32 (twenty-two years ago)

i thought ABBA's signature vocal production was pretty interesting, you know, the slightly sharp-ness making it sound so shiny and vibrant. (i will say no more on the matter, as i know fuckall about production and don't want to risk making a fool of myself)

― The Lady Ms Lurex (lucylurex), Wednesday, 27 August 2003 02:22 (twenty-two years ago)

ABBA's production is great and really versatile (IMHO). I'm not a Carpenters expert, but it doesn't seem to me they have the range ABBA's got. They've done great-produced rock songs, disco songs, synth pop songs, ballads, and every hybridization thereof, all in different style.

I've been quoted as saying "The Smiths and ABBA are the two greatest bands of all time" on listening binges.. No air-quotes.

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Wednesday, 27 August 2003 03:07 (twenty-two years ago)

J0hn OTM re. the "Superstar" guitar solo.

Richard deserves our skepticism for forcing Superstar: The Karen Carpenter Story underground, although I can appreciate why he did it.

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 27 August 2003 03:36 (twenty-two years ago)

Sometimes it's best to determine something like this from those who reproduce the original artists work, in this case:

Carpenters as sung by Wing
http://www.wingmusic.co.nz/
vs
ABBA as sung by Salma & Sabina Agha
http://www.wingmusic.co.nz/cd5.html

seems like a toss up...

― PeterALopez, Thursday, 28 August 2003 16:45 (twenty-two years ago)

...or "Abba as sung'n'played by Björn Again"? (Which wz (un)pretty piss-poor, i'd say)

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 28 August 2003 16:50 (twenty-two years ago)

"Two for the Price of One" is greatness amateurist. One of the few (only?) times Abba really got freaky and perverse -- yet another example of them growing older and moving on. Ah, maturity. That song about the kid going off to school on the other hand, ick.

― dleone (dleone), Thursday, 28 August 2003 17:48 (twenty-two years ago)

it's not the lyric as much as the vocal on that song that bothers me. keep the guys away from the microphones!
the lyric is passable in a sub-kinks way but it doesn't fit on the album. the lead-up to the chorus is kind of neat.

― amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 28 August 2003 17:50 (twenty-two years ago)

The intro to that song is one of the all-time great Corvette Summer early 80s underdog white male intros. I like the chorus too, especially how they have the guitar playing 8ths over the single note bass riff. ABBA were a detail-fanatic's fantasy - I really don't get any criticisms of their production.

― dleone (dleone), Thursday, 28 August 2003 17:53 (twenty-two years ago)

ANY criticisms? they have some rub stuff and some mediocrities. on the "ring ring" record, "sitting in a palmtree," "intermezzo no. 1," "man in the middle," i'm not too keen on the 2nd side of "abba: the album" although it is sort of a fantastic period piece a la "tarkus".... although by "super trouper" they were pretty unstoppable, i'd agree.

― amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 28 August 2003 17:56 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, I really just meant production, as in sound quality, arrangement. ABBA records, to me, are like the great fruition of Curt Boettcher, Brian Wilson and George Martin schools of pop production. Obviously, not all of their songs (especially on the early records) are up to that standard.

― dleone (dleone), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:00 (twenty-two years ago)

that combination sounds like more of a toothache than abbas songs typically are.

― amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:04 (twenty-two years ago)

i'm so glad someone mentioned Wing on this thread.

― The Lady Ms Lurex (lucylurex), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:07 (twenty-two years ago)

now ILM is complete.

― The Lady Ms Lurex (lucylurex), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:07 (twenty-two years ago)

Carpenters were just _really_ boring, making nonsense easy listening songs. While ABBA were at times musical geniuses, particularly on their later early 80s stuff.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:31 (twenty-two years ago)

To me, that combination sounds like a lot of AM pop radio from the 70s, but ABBA were one of the few bands to take California and Brit Invasion pop and turn it into something pretty sophisticated -- the only other really popular group I can think of that even tried to do something like that was The Eagles, and for me, they went off the deep end in another direction entirely.

Also, even if I didn't like ABBA's songs, I would still like their production, just as I would for all those artists mentioned in the last post.

― dleone (dleone), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.sheepproductions.com/tps/introduction/giant.jpg

"it is happening...again"

― amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:40 (twenty-two years ago)

Carpenters were just _really_ boring, making nonsense easy listening songs. -- Geir Hongro

...Why do I get the uncanny feeling it's an imposter posting?

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh no, I wouldn't expect Geir to like The Carpenters at all

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 29 August 2003 13:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Dada, you could be right...

― t\'\'t (t\'\'t), Friday, 29 August 2003 13:56 (twenty-two years ago)

Friend of mine made this assertion to me this week. See if you agree (I don't, for whatever that's worth):

The Carpenters - dicernible english + Jesus & Mary Chain = Cocteau Twins.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 29 August 2003 14:41 (twenty-two years ago)

two years pass...

I have both the carpenters and abba records and have studied both in detail whilst i agree with most comments i am sure that whilst the melodic and lyrical arrangements are outstanding on both abba and the carpenters tracks, abbas have a little more going on, the attention to detail is nothing short of remarkable, the riffs and catchy hooks, tracks like these come along once in a lifetime. Also it has been widely
documented that Andersson & ulvaeus in terms of song wrinting skills are second only to Lennon and McCartney, now then bet you didnt know that.

― paul Beresford, Tuesday, 1 November 2005 11:18 (twenty years ago)

I have both the carpenters and abba records and have studied both in detail whilst i agree with most comments i am sure that whilst the melodic and lyrical arrangements are outstanding on both abba and the carpenters tracks, abbas have a little more going on, the attention to detail is nothing short of remarkable, the riffs and catchy hooks, tracks like these come along once in a lifetime. Also it has been widely
documented that Andersson & ulvaeus in terms of song writing skills are second only to Lennon and McCartney, now then bet you didnt know that.

― paul Beresford, Tuesday, 1 November 2005 11:19 (twenty years ago)

It also has to be remembered that the vast majority of great Carpenters tracks were artful arrangements of songs composed by others.

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Tuesday, 1 November 2005 11:51 (twenty years ago)

Karen, looking back, was a perfect tragic figure in a way that the faceless ABBA kids could never have been

As was pointed out above, Agnetha from ABBA is almost as much of a tragic figure as Karen was.

ABBA is okay, though I find the cult of ironically dancing to their songs to be annoying

I don't ironically enjoy ABBA or the Carpenters, I sincerely enjoy both groups. If anything, I find Sonic Youth's cover of Superstar to be more of an ironic hipster pose than anything associated with the revival of interest in ABBA's music.

I give the edge to ABBA, because their album tracks and lesser-known songs from Arrival onwards are way better than the equivalent Carpenters material. Rainy Days and Mondays, Superstar and the like are untouchable, but some of the Carpenters' album tracks and filler material is just awful. And there was no excuse for Calling Occupants of Interplanetary Craft, which makes the tweest ABBA tune sound like Metallica.

― John Hunter, Tuesday, 1 November 2005 20:39 (twenty years ago)

Whoops, that should have read "some of the Carpenters' album tracks and filler material are just awful."

― John Hunter, Tuesday, 1 November 2005 20:40 (twenty years ago)

ABBA, no question about it.

― walter kranz (walterkranz), Tuesday, 1 November 2005 20:55 (twenty years ago)

Majestic though Abba were, they didn't do anything *quite* as great as Goodbye To Love, so.....The Carps shade it.

― Dr. C (Dr. C), Tuesday, 1 November 2005 20:57 (twenty years ago)

god that's like having to choose between chocolate and sex

no way, i'll have both

― rentboy (rentboy), Tuesday, 1 November 2005 21:01 (twenty years ago)

Illegal Art used to have the Haynes film. looks like they are having some server issues at the moment, but they do offer it as a DVR:
http://www.illegal-art.org/

ABBA is my pick, however.

― patita (patita), Tuesday, 1 November 2005 21:16 (twenty years ago)

This thread is much more hilarious than it had any right to be! More surprising too - I was expecting more of an all-out ABBA blitzkrieg.
(They get my vote.)

(Waiting patiently for AIR SUPPLY vs. LITTLE RIVER BAND.)

― Myonga Von Bontee (Myonga Von Bontee), Tuesday, 1 November 2005 22:22 (twenty years ago)

six months pass...

I second the "Carpenters by a country mile" comment. Sure, ABBA's tunes were much more danceable, but that's not a fair comparision, because the Carpenter's songs were anything but disco numbers. However, nothing ABBA produced comes close to the quality of Karen's absolutely sublime vocals, particularly when she sang in the key of A (as in just about all of their hits). Yeah, yeah, yeah, the songs were saccharine, but still, just focusing on her vocals, I really don't see how ABBA's vocal talents could in any way be considered equal, let alone superior. Totally tragic she died so early - who knows how much more her talent would have developed?

― Anthony Lewis, Monday, 1 May 2006 05:26 (nineteen years ago)

three weeks pass...

I grew up in the 90's, but can't find anything close to ABBA.
Carpenters are good to, but ABBa gets my vote.I get annoyed when people dismiss ABBA as light-weight disco outfit, they haven't most of their songs .Waterloo and Dancing queen do not describe ABBA completely.They are most successful group(second only to the Beatles).
But note The Beatles and the Carpenters were British,ABBA weren't.
HAD ABBA HAILED FROM ENGLAND OR THE US THEY WOULD Have been dubbed as the MOST SUCCESFUL BAND EVER MILES AHEAD OF ANY LEGENDARY BAND(THIS INCLUDES BOTH THE BEATLES AND OF COURSE THE CARPENTES).

― krishanu, Thursday, 25 May 2006 11:26 (nineteen years ago)

The Carpenters were not British, they were Americans.

And please don't bring The Beatles into this. That does ABBA no good. Every sane person knows that The Beatles are bigger and more important than ABBA. And would have been even if ABBA were English.

I certainly think ABBA had their moments, and they were certainly underrated at the time, at least by people who knew music better than most people did. But comparing them to The Beatles is just pointless)

(on the other hand, comparing a mediocre MOR act like Carpenters to and actually great pop acts such ABBA is just as pointless)

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Thursday, 25 May 2006 11:49 (nineteen years ago)

The Carpenters never rocked. Ever.

Neither did ABBA, unless you count "So Long, "Rock Me" and "Hole In My Soul" as "rock". But they were great nevertheless (as opposed to Carpenters, whose only passable song was the Bacharach-penned "(They Long To Be) Close To You")

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Thursday, 25 May 2006 11:51 (nineteen years ago)

They deserve each other, readers, don't you think?

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Thursday, 25 May 2006 12:07 (nineteen years ago)

'The Carpenters never rocked. Ever.'

Is that not like criticizing Neil Young for never singing opera? But don't forget Tony Peluso's fuzz guitar solo on 'Goodbye To Love'. Like when Dylan went electric, it was viewed as an impurity by some of their fans.

― Carlos Keith (Buck_Wilde), Thursday, 25 May 2006 20:41 (nineteen years ago)

one year passes...

any act with karen carpenter as lead vocalist wins (takes it all, even)

― gershy, Sunday, 7 October 2007 07:11 (eighteen years ago)

Abba vs. Carpenters is a good match. I'll go with the latter, while preferring the former. I mean...never mind.

― Bimble, Sunday, 7 October 2007 07:17 (eighteen years ago)

What does ironic dancing look like? Do people do air quotes or something?

-- Angus Gordon (angusg), Monday, August 25, 2003 12:37 PM (4 years ago) Bookmark Link

The worst is when it leads to ironic sex.

-- N. (nickdastoor), Monday, August 25, 2003 12:40 PM (4 years ago) Bookmark Link

lol

― latebloomer, Sunday, 7 October 2007 07:58 (eighteen years ago)

Hahah. I can almost imagine a really bad 80's song playing after those quotes.

― Bimble, Sunday, 7 October 2007 08:51 (eighteen years ago)

i don't really care about those two bands. but the carpenters win obviously because of karen's voice. can someone explain to me why the carpenters are supposed to be mor and abba pop? i mean if the carpenters music is not pop what else would be? their ballads are often very corny and on the verge of kitsch but still. the ubiquity of abba in the seventies on german radio and tv has totally ruined their music for me. and my ten year old self liked them in the beginning when "ring, ring", "sos" and "waterloo" came out. but i didn't like "dancing queen" from the first time i heard it. and i had to listen to it many times. it was played on about every party i went to in the late seventies/early eighties. i ended up hating that song which by the way is much better than "fernando" (their biggest hit according to the german wikipedia). that ballad is really stinking dross.

― alex in mainhattan, Sunday, 7 October 2007 17:36 (eighteen years ago)

can someone explain to me why the carpenters are supposed to be mor and abba pop?

It's a matter of artistic control. ABBA (at least the two males) always had more than The Carpenters, who had all of their material written by professional outside writers.

Karen Carpenter had a great voice, but a voice just isn't enough. A good pop act has to have their own style and their own songs in addition.

― Geir Hongro, Sunday, 7 October 2007 22:35 (eighteen years ago)

I so love being so right.

― Alex in NYC, Sunday, 7 October 2007 23:35 (eighteen years ago)

Karen Carpenter had a great voice, but a voice just isn't enough. A good pop act has to have their own style and their own songs in addition.

Insanity non-shockah. Ask George Martin how he feels about Richard Carpenter's production skills.

― J0hn D., Sunday, 7 October 2007 23:47 (eighteen years ago)

And there was no excuse for Calling Occupants of Interplanetary Craft, which makes the tweest ABBA tune sound like Metallica.

That would be among one of the best Carpenters tunes. Except they didn't add anything new to the glorious Klaatu original, of course.

― Geir Hongro, Monday, 8 October 2007 09:42 (eighteen years ago)

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