Taking Sides: Jeff Barry vs. John Barry

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Inspired by the Cole Porter vs. Paul McCartney thread, I'm doing Barry vs. Barry. I'd say that Jeff wins easily, given that I like him more than anyone even mentioned on the Cole vs. Macca thread ('cept maybe Dylan). However, I don't really know John's work on beyond Bond, so I'm eager to learn. (Subjects for possible future threads, should anyone want to start one: Barry Mann vs. Barry Manilow, Cynthia Weil vs. Kurt Weill, Pitney [Gene] vs. Whitney [Houston], Allen Ravenstine vs. Gracie Allen, Max Martin vs. Peter Max. [Direct comparison may be hard on that last one, though I'll take Martin over Peter any day. I'd take Don Martin over Peter Max. Hell, I'd take Don Adams over Peter Max.]) Remember: A VOTE FOR BARRY IS A VOTE FOR FUN!

― Frank Kogan, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

On the Jeff side: the theme to Mean Streets; a classic song by cartoon characters; the greatest song ever that everyone associated with has tried to repudiate ("Hanky Panky"); and so much more.

― Frank Kogan, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Not an answer, but another question for Frank...Don Martin vs. Dean Martin? Eh? ;]

― Jess, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

We can take care of all these in one fell swoop, no?

Barry
Barry
Weill
Whitney
Allen*
Max

*The male Allen wins by virtue of "The Modern Dance." By "The Modern Dance" I do not mean The Modern Dance.

― Andy, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Isn't Peter Max just in-flight magazine fodder?

― Kris, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Isn't Peter Max just in-flight magazine fodder?

More so than "30 Seconds Over Tokyo" is, I imagine.

― Frank Kogan, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Good in-flight Magazine fodder would be Real Life -- Real Life the record and not Real Life the Albert Brooks movie. Though I suppose you should understand the distinction since Real Life the movie -- due to its form of media -- could never be considered magazine fodder. In-flight fodder, yes -- but not in- flight magazine fodder.

― Andy, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Even on Virgin Atlantic?

― Kris, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Kogan v Kogan: Is Frank a subject for cloning, or is he not?

― Richard Kogan, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Kogans everywhere, goddammit! Cloning is a success!

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

McGear (Mike, brother of McCartney and member of The Scaffold) vs McGuire (BARRY, 'Eve of Destruction' and member of The New Christry Minstrels.)

― Andrew L, Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Lene Lovich vs. Lena Zavaroni

― dave q, Saturday, 18 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

10cc vs. Burton Cummings

― dave q, Saturday, 18 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Re Lene/Lena: ill, very ill.

― Sean, Monday, 20 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Sigh. I guess I'm going to have to do this myself. Wish I knew better what I was talking about (esp. in regards to Barry).

John Barry's James Bond theme: He used "advanced" harmonies from the suspense-film soundtrack, organized it along the lines of Latin big-band jazz. (Is this right? Does it make sense?) I don't think he was the first with this style, but he may have been the first to throw hard-twang guitar on top. I like how, in the decade leading up to Bond, a guitar style had expanded its connotations from "hillbilly guitar boogie" to "hep-cat rockabilly" to "surf music" to "international jet-set sophisticate." And I like the subsequent cultural reverberations of the James Bond style - e.g., ska-jazz combos in Jamaica taking it up as the newest form of mid- '60s cool. Further reverberations? Entryway (along with cocktail jazz) for 20th century Eurochromaticism into r&b? Precursor to Isaac Hayes?

Jeff Barry: co-wrote the best Ronettes song ("Be My Baby"), the best Crystals song ("Da Doo Ron Ron" or "Then He Kissed Me," take your pick), the best Darlene Love song ("Christmas, Baby Please Come Home"), the best Jelly Beans song ("Baby Be Mine"), the best Dixie Cups song ("Chapel of Love"), the most famous Shangri-Las song ("Leader of the Pack"), the even better "Out in the Streets," the best over-produced Ike & Tina Turner song ("River Deep, Mountain High"), the first Tommy James song ("Hanky Panky"), the first Manfred Mann hit ("Do Wah Diddy Diddy"), and the most sugary bubblegum song ("Sugar Sugar"). And also he co-produced the early Neil Diamond songs, such as "Cherry Cherry." And maybe did other great things, but I don't know his later work, the stuff with Andy Kim (other than "Sugar Sugar"): I think the two went on to TV theme songs.

In the early '60s Jeff Barry and partner Ellie Greenwich obviously weren't the only people doing what they were doing: they were just the best of a very good bunch. They and the Brill Building crowd extended the work of people like the Everly Brothers, Buddy Holly, and Lieber & Stoller in putting r&b, r&r, etc. together with Tin Pan Alley so that, for a moment, anyway, Eurosweet tunefulness and rock 'n' roll were one and the same. The lyrics were passionate but managed to say smart things quickly. "Chapel of Love" goes "Bells will ring, the sun will shine/I'll be his and he'll be mine/We'll love until the end of time/And we'll never be lonely anymore." In other words, they are lonely now - a point probably not lost on young listeners like David Johansen and Joey Ramone.

― Frank Kogan, Wednesday, 22 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

But Frank, what about Monte Norman?

― dave q, Thursday, 23 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

MONTY Norman. He recently won a court case against The TImes newspaper for printing John Barry's claim that he alone wrote the Bond theme, not the credited Norman. Also seem to recall that Norman 'borrowed' the basic melody from a Carribean tune, interesting in the light of Frank's comments abt James Bond ska etc.

― Andrew L, Thursday, 23 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Well, I hadn't heard of Monty Norman until today, which further supports my contention that I don't know what I'm talking about when it comes to John Barry. A brief Web search seems to indicate that critics (at least the few I looked at who had an opinion) believed Barry even if the jury believed Norman. But anyway, what doesn't seem to be in dispute is that it was Barry's arrangement, so therefore I'd still credit Barry with bringing in the surfslinger guitar.

― Frank Kogan, Monday, 27 August 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

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