Can somebody help me to start doing things that are actually useful with my synth?

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Ok I know there are a couple of synth topics knocking round already but I really don't understand most of what's being said and have no grasp of the technology at all. Here's the thing: I've had a Korg MS2000 since May-ish and I've sort of gradually learned what the buttons do and how to make cool noises with it. What I need to know is how to go about like, actually USING it, particularly in terms of playing live.

If you want to use a synth live as anything more than something to make squiggly noises in the background of a traditional rock-type lineup (say I want to create some kind of faintly sinister synthpop affair with bits and pieces of guitar here and there), do you need a sequencer or something? Are these as horrifically expensive and complicated as I expect?

Forgive the vagueness, but if anybody's got any good advice/links etc pertaining to this sort of thing then I'd be grateful.

― Ferg (Ferg), Saturday, 1 November 2003 19:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Sell it and buy a real instrument (only joking)

― Dadaismus (Dada), Saturday, 1 November 2003 19:09 (twenty-one years ago)

First of all, learn to play it. Contacting a piano teacher may be a good start....

Then, let the programming come afterwards, as playing is more important than sounds anyway.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Saturday, 1 November 2003 19:16 (twenty-one years ago)

if you are playing the synth live, it might be better to learn how to play, but if you are going to play another instrument while the ms2000 is playing, then a sequencer would help. they can be very cheap or very expensive. the workhorse alesis mmt-8 will be around $100 used. it is not necessarily the best or fanciest option, but, from what i have heard, they are fine to start off with. what you will want in a sequencer is something that will have functions that will allow you to mute or unmute different parts and sections/sequences on the fly so that you will not have to stick with whatever arrangement you would write out before the gig.

― Aaron Grossman (aajjgg), Saturday, 1 November 2003 20:01 (twenty-one years ago)

doesn't it have a built-in sequencer?

― jones (actual), Saturday, 1 November 2003 20:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Uh I'm drunk as well as astonishingly synth-dumb but like, it has a mod sequencer thing that lets you modify a note in various cool ways but I assumed you'd need a more advanced dedicated one to be able to like trigger different arpeggios n'shit independently during a set and that?

― Ferg (Ferg), Sunday, 2 November 2003 03:27 (twenty-one years ago)

It all depends on what you want it to sound like. What kind of records are you into, and what kind of sounds and arrangements are you looking for in your music? I am not trying to be a smart ass, but your question is so vague that it is difficult to give you direct constructive advice.

― Disco Nihilist (mjt), Sunday, 2 November 2003 03:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Well, I guess the fact that I'm not quite sure what I want/how to explain it is a problem here, but I like the Human League and Magazine and Tuxedomoon. I guess one of the things I'd want to try would be a sort of 'Incubus (Blue Suit)' Tuxedomoon type thing with synth sequences overlapping and stabby guitar on top. But y'know I quite like the kind of bleepy synthpop thing Ladytron and Adult. do as well.

Possible better topic title would've been 'how do poor people make synthpop?'. A lot of it may be the fact that I haven't actually experimented enough yet anyway and am being lazy.

― Ferg (Ferg), Sunday, 2 November 2003 05:28 (twenty-one years ago)

does it have MIDI?

― mark p (Mark P), Sunday, 2 November 2003 05:34 (twenty-one years ago)

if so, get a software sequencer and start doing tracks!

― mark p (Mark P), Sunday, 2 November 2003 05:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, someone's sending me Cubase soon. This may help relieve my mental block over all this. I'm just being a bit twitchy about it until then.

― Ferg (Ferg), Sunday, 2 November 2003 05:38 (twenty-one years ago)

you should be able to download a cubase demo and brush up in the meantime

― mark p (Mark P), Sunday, 2 November 2003 06:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Listen very closely to every piece of advice given by Geir Hongro - then do the opposite

― Dadaismus (Dada), Sunday, 2 November 2003 15:16 (twenty-one years ago)

First of all, learn to play it. Contacting a piano teacher may be a good start....

Then, let the programming come afterwards, as playing is more important than sounds anyway.

The worst thing that ever happened to electronic music was when Moog introduced a keyboard into the equation. Thankfully however, keyboard technique is once again entirely irrelevant in the production of electronic music - yet one more form of music Geir, on the evidence of the comments above, has absolutely no knowledge. Does he know anything about anything?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Sunday, 2 November 2003 15:20 (twenty-one years ago)

behold gierismus:

http://www.pantheon.org/areas/gallery/mythology/europe/roman/janus.gif

Ferg, are you planning on playing solo, or playing w/a band?

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Sunday, 2 November 2003 15:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Ha ha, yes, very funny, yawn.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Sunday, 2 November 2003 15:34 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh yes, because learning to play an instrument is precisely the WRONG way to go about creating music!

― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Sunday, 2 November 2003 15:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Surely no-one, apart from Geir, thinks you actually have to learn to play an instrument to create music? Is this 2003 or am I dreaming?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Sunday, 2 November 2003 15:43 (twenty-one years ago)

"learning to play an instrument" is not necessarily the same as geir's (admittedly very poor, given that the thread starter has a 4-note polysynth, not a piano) advice abt having piano lessons. Nevertheless, some degree of facility can be quite handy, or so I've found anyway. If you are using modern midi/audio sequencers, or grooveboxes, for example, they do tend to push you towards pattern-based linear music.

That whole trope w/r/t rockin' bob moog and his plebby 1v/oct keyboards ruining synthesiser music historically = college/academic people with access to ems synthi 100s and buchla electric music easels bemoaning the fact that the unwashed/unschooled now have access to the same tools. I don't know where you picked that one up from, but it is rubbish. I can remember all the bleating from academia when the dx7 came out, and suddenly pop bands had access to linear fm synthesis that you didn't have to spend 25,000 pounds on. oh no! it's a toy that you can lift under your arm, not like my college's ems delaware box!! it's going to ruin it all for everyone!! yadda yadda yadda. elitism = sux0r.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Sunday, 2 November 2003 16:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah personally I have very little interest in learning any Proper Technique, because this would make it difficult for me to play by stabbing idly at the keys with one hand while drinking with the other and staring into space.

Pashmina, I'd rather have a band because I don't think I could get away with playing solo really. Just having one other person would probably be enough (unless I manage to find a surprising amount of people who can play violin and saxophone), but I'm still searching for like-minded types round my area at the moment. The sinister-bedroom-songwriter-on-Cubase thing in the meantime seems like my best bet.

― Ferg (Ferg), Sunday, 2 November 2003 16:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Learning to play does not necessarily mean taking formal lessons! If you can make music that does not suck, then you may have mastered your instrument. (You've probably also unconsciously learned music theory in some form but shhh don't tell anyone they will call you elitist!)

― Curt1s St3ph3ns, Sunday, 2 November 2003 16:32 (twenty-one years ago)

I've been in bands plenty of times before, both with other musicians who are/were better than me (adv. - you get better quickly) and w/people starting at the same skill level (adv. more rewarding in my eperience, plus more fun, but it takes longer) and either way, it was worthwhile, even when the bands sux0r3d, or didn't get anywhere. I learned how to play better (read more effectively in the context of whatever the band was doing) and how to make the right sounds to be heard effectively, or something. Even when I just write & record stuff on my own with my synthesisers, the things i learned playing w/bands was useful.

One thing I would do if I were in yr situation - buy a drum machine & learn how to program it (patterns and songs) Make sure it has midi (ie avoid "Zoom" models, or vintage units) so you can connect it w/yr ms2000, then you can have the built-in sequencer play along with it. That's fukcing great phun just on it's own...

(good models used (ie cheap) -alesis sr16 [avoid hr16 units, they have this very annoying problem w/the buttons], boss dr550, roland r8, r8mk2)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Sunday, 2 November 2003 17:06 (twenty-one years ago)

can someone link the other synth threads mentioned please? thx

― ron (ron), Sunday, 2 November 2003 17:18 (twenty-one years ago)

have a trawl around in here, ron:

http://ilx.wh3rd.net/category.php?catid=71

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Sunday, 2 November 2003 17:20 (twenty-one years ago)

thanks ph4y :)

― ron (ron), Monday, 3 November 2003 03:42 (twenty-one years ago)

does anybody listen to jill scott, and can tell me what kind of synth is floating around over the top of 'i think it's better'. the one with quite a bit of filter mod, i guess there are probably a few synths on that song but that's the one i'm curious about. i tried to find some other songs w/ it but was coming up blank, although i know i've heard it other places

― ron (ron), Monday, 3 November 2003 03:46 (twenty-one years ago)

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