Bands you forgive people liking because of their gender

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now I'M NO SEXIST BUT....

ok so naturally everybody has bands that you kneejerkily assume that the fans of are morons. But are there groups you forgive people for liking simply because of their gender? I totally ignore the fact that numerous girls I know love Travis, but if a guy announced his fanship I'd probably give him endless shit for it. And while I would give anybody shit for like IDM, I'd probably more curious as to why a girl actually does.

Do you find yourself doing this? And does anybody want to be THAT GUY who humorlessly stands by his gender-based distinctions for over 300 posts? I'll probably chicken out.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 8 November 2003 21:51 (twenty-two years ago)

Anyone can listen to anything as far am I'm concerned, but when it bleeds over into real fandom, there are some lines to be drawn. I am naturally suspicious of males who listen to lots and lots of Tori Amos and/or Ani DiFranco.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 8 November 2003 21:56 (twenty-two years ago)

I am naturally interested in males who listen to Tori Amos and/or Bjork... until they talk to me.

― Eric H. (Eric H.), Saturday, 8 November 2003 21:57 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm more interested in girls than guys in general

― cinniblount (James Blount), Saturday, 8 November 2003 21:58 (twenty-two years ago)

Hey! I love Bjork!

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 8 November 2003 21:58 (twenty-two years ago)

I (heart) Tori.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 8 November 2003 21:59 (twenty-two years ago)

Its more a chauvinism thing, innit? Girls can't be into good music?

I see it a lot, especially as you get into more head nod or "out there" sounds. A really good friend of mine - who happens to also be very attractive - listens to gabber, breakcore, and IDM. She's also the subject of a rather large number of people who "can't believe [she] listens to the music [she does]." The implication is that girls can't like anything more complex than simple pop music.

I also knew someone who callously explained that she works at Muzak, who supply ... guess what? ... music to stores, so this constant exposure to music was the explanation for her broad and strange tastes. She obviously wouldn't like any of this music if she didn't work there, she's just a girl.

I won't even get into girls who actually write this stuff.

― Xii (Xii), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:00 (twenty-two years ago)

Shut your mouth and kiss me!

(oops, sorry. I'll never do that again.)

― Eric H. (Eric H.), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:01 (twenty-two years ago)

guys do seem more likely to let their tastes define 'who they are' or to think that your taste in ______ defines how good a person you are/whether they like you/etc.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:07 (twenty-two years ago)

< / broad overgeneralisation>

― cinniblount (James Blount), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:07 (twenty-two years ago)

Music geek guys, definitely. A show of hands... how many girls have you decided not to get to know better because they listened to terrible music and for no other reason?

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:10 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah but how many people did you decide to get to know better because they listened to great music and for no other reason?

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:11 (twenty-two years ago)

Haven't really done it with music, but I have developed pathetic crushes on dudes based on their taste in films.

― Eric H. (Eric H.), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:12 (twenty-two years ago)

I am naturally suspicious of males who listen to lots and lots of Tori Amos and/or Ani DiFranco.

Having given this some more thought, I realize that's not a gender issue, either. I'm just as suspicious of girls who bring up Tori in an early conversation. "Oh please," I'm thinking, "please don't tell me you own your own set of fairy wings."

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:17 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah but if I guy brings them up then you can ask them how that's working out for them.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:23 (twenty-two years ago)

if A guy.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Bad taste shouldn't be excused because of gender, Anthony you bloody MISOGYNIST! I'm an equal-opportunity persecuter! I don't care what sequence of chromosones comprise your genetic structure and determine your sex, if you like ______ (fill in name of hated band-of-the-moment here), YOU SUCK!

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:54 (twenty-two years ago)

I totally forgive your knee-jerk hostility towards groups who co-opt your chosen aesthetic identity, Alex. cuz yer a dude.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 8 November 2003 22:55 (twenty-two years ago)

Yay! Two beers for me and my silly pal Anthony!

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 8 November 2003 23:02 (twenty-two years ago)

i'm suspicious of anyone with a more than passing interest in Ani DiFranco. Especially girls. Especially lesbians. Blech. It's like a fucking scourge. I forgive it in no one.

― Blood and sparkles (bloodandsparkles), Sunday, 9 November 2003 01:36 (twenty-two years ago)

If the girl's cute enough, I'll "forgive" her for liking anything.

I don't like music geeks, though (even though I guess I am one). My girlfriend has like 10 CDs and two of them are Sheryl Crow. She's a bright girl, though no fun to buy records with (I'd rather do that alone anyway).

I'm not into this "the fans of Band X That I Don't Like are morons" mentality. Any musician with more than 8 people in their audience will have a healthy amount of morons in there. I actually think you can tell very little about a person based on their music taste. Unless they have scary obsessions.

― Phantom Power, Sunday, 9 November 2003 02:37 (twenty-two years ago)

My roommate seems to listen to artists based on their hair or style, or if she knows them personally (she's practically a groupie for the open-mic nights around Hollywood), preferably both. Her favorite band is this awful garage rock group called the Vacation, who are skinny soulless fuckers with greasy mops of hair. I swear if they shaved their heads she'd be done with 'em in a second...

― Gear! (Gear!), Sunday, 9 November 2003 03:53 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, well I'm probably being a bit blustery, I've forgiven much worse taste in people, and would do so in the future. I'm mostly bark.

I just get really sick of everyone being so into ani difranco that every time someone names her as their fave artist I want to gnash my teeth.

I have my scary obsessions, so I probably shouldn't judge.

― Blood and sparkles (bloodandsparkles), Sunday, 9 November 2003 05:29 (twenty-two years ago)

I usually can't talk to anyone who either doesn't have an appreciation for music or likes the most atrocious form(s) of music available (i.e. filk, Zendik stuff, Rent, yar yar yar).

― Xii (Xii), Sunday, 9 November 2003 06:37 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm discovering that I don't dislike indie girls as much as I dislike indie boys because I often enjoy their company and sometimes enjoy their looks. I like the ones who don't have "crazy" hair anyway. That can be so annoying. Is this what you meant?

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Sunday, 9 November 2003 06:50 (twenty-two years ago)

this thread baffles me. seriously. girls on average tend to be less of the dull completist trainspottery sort of music fan, sure. which is a GOOD thing!!

i think i've had more wide-ranging musical taste than ANY guy i've been with. when i date somebody i generally introduce them to more music than they ever do to me. now if only i could find a dude who could talk to me about jazz, musique concrete, and german microhouse 12"s. i once made out with a guy with the fall's 'live at the witch trials' playing in the background. 'what is this shit?!' he said. 'only the greatest band ever,' i said. 'oh okay, whatever', he said.

also ppl who place too much emphasis on music's effect on personality = LaYmORz. liking good music doesn't mean yr not an asshole etc.

― geeta (geeta), Sunday, 9 November 2003 08:02 (twenty-two years ago)

also pop music roolz doodz

― geeta (geeta), Sunday, 9 November 2003 08:04 (twenty-two years ago)

everything geeta said = OTM

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Sunday, 9 November 2003 09:10 (twenty-two years ago)

I find the concept of forgiving people for liking certain bands amusing.

― jel -- (jel), Sunday, 9 November 2003 09:43 (twenty-two years ago)

girls on average tend to be less of the dull completist trainspottery sort of music fan, sure. which is a GOOD thing!!

They also, on average, tend to be more likely to listen to Sarah MacLachlan, which is a BAD thing.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Sunday, 9 November 2003 09:49 (twenty-two years ago)

But on the other hand, boys are FAR more likely to listen to AC/DC, and of course most of the boys here think that's fine, but what girl would defend that? And who's to say what's good or bad?

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Sunday, 9 November 2003 09:54 (twenty-two years ago)

''I find the concept of forgiving people for liking certain bands amusing.''

yeah, you have to wonder abt what kind of social skills these ppl have jel.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Sunday, 9 November 2003 09:56 (twenty-two years ago)

you have to wonder abt what kind of social skills these ppl have

Oh, don't get all superior. Everyone understands that certain bands carry certain social connotations, especially when you're younger. So, say a 25 yr-old person you know is REALLY into Metallica. A little behind the times, dontcha think? Perhaps a bit inclined toward the cheesy and the obvious? Not someone you'll be going to the museum with anytime soon, right? See, these judgements are not based on pure air.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Sunday, 9 November 2003 10:02 (twenty-two years ago)

with everything that is implied here, this still comes across as a snobby thread, even if it wasn't intended that way!

― Vic (Vic), Sunday, 9 November 2003 11:54 (twenty-two years ago)

but i think people still "forgive" girls less for liking pop-dance boybands than they do boys for liking metal sludge garbage...do u ever hear anyone say "oh he's astupid boy, he likes linkin park!" or etc, as much as you hear "she's a stupid girl, she liked n sync!"

― Vic (Vic), Sunday, 9 November 2003 12:08 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.darkhorizons.com/2001/shallow/p-hal.jpg

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Sunday, 9 November 2003 13:07 (twenty-two years ago)

People like music for all kinds of different reasons, and like music at different levels of 'intensity'.

This mindest of judging people based on what music they like is often just a roundabout way of congratulating oneself for having good music taste (cuz that's so hugely important). "I'm better than them".

― Phantom Power, Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:28 (twenty-two years ago)

this thread is fucking disgusting

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:33 (twenty-two years ago)

i seriously have to wonder if some of the respondants have actually ever been around women before

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:34 (twenty-two years ago)

and, no, walking behind them with a length of wire in your pocket and your other hand on your cock doesn't count

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:35 (twenty-two years ago)

i mean this:

They also, on average, tend to be more likely to listen to Sarah MacLachlan, which is a BAD thing.

is so fucking errant it's like...jesus wept, baby

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:36 (twenty-two years ago)

and does anyone actually hear people saying things like "she's just a stupid girl...she listens to n*sync" in their daily life? if so, watch out, because the police tend to frown on grown people lurking around playgrounds.

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:42 (twenty-two years ago)

is it like how sarah practically weeps, in that adia song ?

and jess, i'm agreeing with you about this thread and yes, i did hear that - not on playgrounds but college campuses!

― Vic (Vic), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:44 (twenty-two years ago)

no, no i know..."all of life is a playground"

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:45 (twenty-two years ago)

For the record I'm harsh on anyone with a silly haircut, not just indie girls

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:50 (twenty-two years ago)

But let's be honest, have you ever seen a girl who listens to good music with stupid bangs and a sloppy dye-job ?

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:51 (twenty-two years ago)

by good music I mean not indie, but I don't really mean that. I can't stop judging people, HELP!

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:52 (twenty-two years ago)

Anyway, I had a real thought. If you were really interested in stopping sexism, I think you might encourage threads like this that express latent sexist thoughts and then gently tell how they're wrong.

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:56 (twenty-two years ago)

haha!

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 15:58 (twenty-two years ago)

I am naturally suspicious of males who listen to lots and lots of Tori Amos and/or Ani DiFranco.

Which surely says more about you than it does about them?

(I don't know a single Tori fan who is into fairies, incidentally.)

Otherwise... jess otm throughout, this thread is pish.

― The Lex (The Lex), Sunday, 9 November 2003 16:25 (twenty-two years ago)

Skipping 37 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

just do it in a different way than David Allen just did. Please.
-- Anthony Miccio (anthonymicci...), November 9th, 2003.

Aww Anthony. Is somebody mad? I'm sawwy.

― David Allen, Sunday, 9 November 2003 19:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Why would the guy walking behind the girl, touching his penis, have a length of wire in his pocket?

― d k (d k), Sunday, 9 November 2003 19:31 (twenty-two years ago)

i would like to share a case of beer and a viewing of heavy metal parking lot with this thread. i hope a case is enough.

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 9 November 2003 19:33 (twenty-two years ago)

generalisation train-starring wesley snipes.

― Ronan (Ronan), Sunday, 9 November 2003 19:35 (twenty-two years ago)

id be so impressed if a girl said she didnt like idm and free jazz

― amateur!st (amateurist), Sunday, 9 November 2003 19:45 (twenty-two years ago)

j/k

― amateur!st (amateurist), Sunday, 9 November 2003 19:45 (twenty-two years ago)

I remember when ILM was all about self-consciously emulating the taste of teenage girls. WHat happent?

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Sunday, 9 November 2003 19:53 (twenty-two years ago)

I think I can forgive people liking certain bands (to an extent) regardless of their gender when it's clear that they don't invest as much time and thought into their music-listening as hapless, trivia-fixated goons like myself. All the hellfired exhorting I can muster won't make the slightest difference to someone who simply doesn't care that Rancid are ripping off the Clash (or some similar assertion). I can scream "RAISE YOUR STANDARDS, YOU PABULUM-GORGED SHEEP!" all I want, but if someone merely likes the way an artist sounds and doesn't give a rolling rat fuck about said artist's place in the great chronology of music, it won't make a difference. It just doesn't matter as much to some people. That's not a judgement...I'm not asserting superiority over them. But in just the same manner I couldn't possibly give less of a damn who wins the SuperBowl, who just made a bajillion dollars on the stock market or who the fashion designer of the moment is, not everyone can muster a raised-eyebrow at the notion of Hugh Cornwell re-joining the Stranglers or the re-release of previously vinyl-only archival material by the Modern Lovers, etc.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:05 (twenty-two years ago)

the re-release of previously vinyl-only archival material by the Modern Lovers, etc.

is this just anecdotal or ARE THEY ACTUALLY RE-RELEASING PREVIOUSLY VINYL ARCHIVAL MATERIAL BY THE MODERN LOVERS????

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:06 (twenty-two years ago)

Hahaha.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:07 (twenty-two years ago)

'Underlying the current impasse is an eternal oscillation between two equally problematic positions. The first is a now discredited transcendental universalism, a view from nowhere enabling a putatively objective knowledge which can be used to inform rational social and political decisions. The second is the relativising of all views as mere expressions of a concrete particularity - a local place in a world of incommensurable, non-totalisable perspectives - which don't have sufficient critical purchase to address the pressing problems of the day. Together, Simpson the unrepentant dialectician tirelessly insists, these two positions produce an antinomy or aporia, not the potentially productive contradiction that may lead us to a higher plane of understanding and a more effective way of acting. As such, they reflect or express the current dilemmas of a late capitalist, liberal democratic society in which we can't make up our minds whether we actively create the social world or are merely its passive victims.'

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:15 (twenty-two years ago)

word!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:16 (twenty-two years ago)

I thought this thread was just for being silly... oops

― Blood and sparkles (bloodandsparkles), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:21 (twenty-two years ago)

it was. oh, it was.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:24 (twenty-two years ago)

the first is a now discredited transcendental universalism

Example: Gier Hongro, who is not only objectively correct himself, but also knows which music is objectively correct in itself.

the second is the relativising of all views as mere extensions of a concrete particularity

Example: Anthony Miccio wondering if the musical tastes of gurlz are 100% determined by their 'situatedness' as gurlz, and whether his own perspective 'azza' male might nevertheless allow him to step outside of the presumed sexism that entails in patriarchy.

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:25 (twenty-two years ago)

Anthony Miccio wondering if the musical tastes of gurlz are 100% determined by their 'situatedness' as gurlz, and whether his own perspective 'azza' male might nevertheless allow him to step outside of the presumed sexism that entails in patriarchy.

keep putting words in my mouth and I'm gonna put my dick in yours.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:28 (twenty-two years ago)

azza male.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:28 (twenty-two years ago)

kizza me

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:29 (twenty-two years ago)

kizza my azza!

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:36 (twenty-two years ago)

isn't one of the defining characteristics of situatedness the fact that it can change? i guess that's what makes it problematic as an objective judgement point. does listening to music reinforce or thwart identity. "i wanna lose myself in the music"

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:36 (twenty-two years ago)

"i wanna rock"

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:39 (twenty-two years ago)

But that's what you were saying, Anthony, in the original question, isn't it? You were saying that despite being male you are no sexist, and then asking if because of being female, the bad music taste of some girls might be forgiveable. In other words, you were (quite admirably) asking a question about the relationship between situatedness and taste, and, in your question, proposing the possibility of someone transcending the category they find themselves in. So the next question I'd ask is, if we aren't to end up in discredited Hongroland, where does that transcendence lead us? On what is its authority based? In other words, the girls who transcend their girlness, are liking music based on their _______ness?

And yes, disco stu points the way here. In the age of 'Azza' we all have different hats and can switch them around freely. But I'd say we never lose our 'selves' completely in music.

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:39 (twenty-two years ago)

"i wanna rock right now/i'm rob base and I came to get down/i'm not internationally known*/but i'm known to rock the microphone"

*is this true? wtf england?

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:40 (twenty-two years ago)

momus how come england didn't give it up for rob base?

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:41 (twenty-two years ago)

also did teddy riley actually produce 'it takes two'? (pharell said 'he did')

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:41 (twenty-two years ago)

and that middle aged white girl with the hair and the nose who really seems to be 'connecting' with rob in the video - what's her story?

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:42 (twenty-two years ago)

norway isn't discredited (pending results of 'norway vs. base')

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:43 (twenty-two years ago)

jesus this thread could have been a comic opportunity to reaffirm your personal individuality by voicing your confusion (or acceptance of) with generalized tastes found in sections of BOTH genders, but the orginial post was broad enough that it devolved into the usual "guys do this, girls do that" joyless shit. I've already apologized for that. However, I'm not gonna have somebody warp my joshy statement into an entire philosophical argument. The point was to see if other people find themself doing this and where, NOT whether or not such an act was RIGHT. I'm not trying to figure out GIRLS, Momus, anymore than I'm trying to figure out BOYS.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:45 (twenty-two years ago)

believe me i have tried!

"i wanna rock right now"

xpost, you beat me to it, blount.

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:45 (twenty-two years ago)

my first sentence was in response to momus.

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:46 (twenty-two years ago)

*is this true? wtf england?

he did write the lyrics before the song became popular..haha anyway

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:49 (twenty-two years ago)

so you're saying rob base WASNT possessed of a time machine?

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:51 (twenty-two years ago)

'tis true, goato. 'tis true...

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:53 (twenty-two years ago)

Shifting the emphasis onto 'me' -- do I find myself forgiving people for lapses in taste when I take into account their situatedness -- doesn't change the point at issue. It's still about what you say as an alternative to 'He would like that, he's a Bah'ai!' Now, political correct humanism would prompt us to say, instead, 'He would like that, he's a human being just like me', which is vague, banal and meaningless. Or it would prompt us to remain silent on matters of taste. Or simply to document what others like without judgement. It might even prompt us to go even further into 'situatedness' -- 'You can't understand why he likes that without looking at how he was abused as a child...' None of this is a satisfactory resolution to the problems Simpson lays out in his book 'Situatedness; or why we keep saying where we're coming from'.

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:56 (twenty-two years ago)

the emphasis was actually on rob base & dj e-z rock. get over yourself.

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 20:59 (twenty-two years ago)

I sigh - alongside the usual allottment of Jesus and Homer Simpson and other rudimentary wood cut-outs is an assortment of snowflakes dressed in the christmas lights. All snowflakes have been donated and decorated by local church and youth groups: Christian Womens Leagues, The Downs Syndrome Fun Club and Youth for Christ. I wonder what the Junkies of America or The Serial Killers Appreciation Club would have done with their snowflakes. I wonder what mine would look like? A party of one, never have been completed, just uncut wood and buckets of paint. I would stand by the incomplete mess, looking guilty and offering apologies to all of my viewers. An old man is excited when they turn on the lights: 'Is it not fabulous?', ennucianting the final word, with furious spits and stutters.

Malnourished children in dirty ski jackets 'ooo' and 'ahhh' and stare like starry eyed wanders. I light a cigarette. An old woman asks “What do you think of the Northern Lights?” I smile and think of my sister. She ook me to the parade every year until I was eight. I used to think all the bright and shiny lights and how it felt like Christmas came early. "I don't know".

“I think it’s shit.”; and she turns away from me, hobbling down the parking lot to wait for the bus that brought her there. I laugh.

― Cat, Sunday, 9 November 2003 21:13 (twenty-two years ago)

times are getting ill

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 21:14 (twenty-two years ago)

it's time to get ill.

"i was at a party last week and the usual assortment of techno guys was there and they were all discussing records by their CATALOG NUMBERS. i had to leave"

― disco stu (disco stu), Sunday, 9 November 2003 21:19 (twenty-two years ago)

The Woolworth store is five years gone. Instead a dying mall sits in its place, a dying mall that has been slowly vacanting for years. I have, though sole choice have become the mall's archivist and have been surveying it's brief life since it opened five years ago.

Amazing. The final dollar store finally vacanted. I make my way to the big metal map of the mall near the exit. With a black marker I draw a bit fat line through Crazy Dealz position on the map of the mall. Two more critical stores to go before I officially pronounce the thing dead. On an impulse I circle the ‘You are Here’ spot on the map, several times. I don’t know why because soon, when the mall is empty, I will no longer even be here.

― Cat, Sunday, 9 November 2003 21:25 (twenty-two years ago)

women be shopping

― cinniblount (James Blount), Sunday, 9 November 2003 21:29 (twenty-two years ago)

and only 126 posts in

― goato mountington (dubplatestyle), Sunday, 9 November 2003 21:30 (twenty-two years ago)

I thnk the better quesiton here (and I'm writing this while taking a break from marking a pile of West Indian lit papers, so forgive me if I'm completely inarticulate)is why we decide to place people in certain categories due to gender or some other such criteria. I think this is what Momus is getting at--craftily, of course, considering that Momus likes to raise the issue of identity politics and their falibility while at the same time wanting to deny the relevance of those he considers blasted politically correct humanist jerks, hence the desperate defense of Vice.

I think that this question could have easily been "Bands you forgive people for liking because of their gender/sexual preference/nationality/race etc. etc." It's a fun question to ask ironically (I, for instance, forgive my pal, who was born and raised in Greece, for loving the Eurovision song contest, black turtlenecks, and nude beaches), but as soon as we start taking this up a notch into let's-quote-random-theorists-and-discuss-issues-of-essentialism, we should remind ourselves that we all come from a particular subject position that informs not only our tastes, but our opinions regarding the tastes of others.

Hell, I love dancehall, broken shit, electroclash, indie, punk rock, minimal tech house, idm, hip hop, soul, pop, and I'm a chick. I am, however, right there with you folks on the DiFranco issue.

― cybele (cybele), Sunday, 9 November 2003 21:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Momus likes to raise the issue of identity politics and their falibility while at the same time wanting to deny the relevance of those he considers blasted politically correct humanist jerks

The thing is, 'identity situatedness' is both inadequate and inevitable. You can tell me that your friend is an Ukranian female of 23, a believer, an Aquarian, a bisexual, and so on, and I still won't be able to predict what music she listens to. But neither will I be able, when I actually see her mp3 library, to say that all those indentity categories have played no part in her choices.

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 9 November 2003 22:12 (twenty-two years ago)

(I like Vice for the same reason that I like ILX: they're both curious and confused about these issues, which are contradictory, ongoing, unfinished, undecided. Vice and ILX will both venture, playfully and curiously, into the minefield of identity politics just to see what happens.)

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 9 November 2003 22:21 (twenty-two years ago)

Shucks, I think we agree here...

― cybele (cybele), Sunday, 9 November 2003 22:42 (twenty-two years ago)

To thread question: I don't do this, because I am not a social retard.

― Carey (Carey), Sunday, 9 November 2003 23:00 (twenty-two years ago)

uh, not saying that anyone who does this on this thread is specifically one.

― Carey (Carey), Sunday, 9 November 2003 23:01 (twenty-two years ago)

You really put your foot in it with that gaffe, Carey!

― Momus (Momus), Monday, 10 November 2003 11:29 (twenty-two years ago)

six years pass...

Last.fm preferences by gender and age:

http://cdn.last.fm/blog/posts/genderplot_artists.png

― Jane/Devil (Sanpaku), Wednesday, 29 September 2010 16:06 (fifteen years ago)

Last.fm genre/tag preferences by gender and age:

http://cdn.last.fm/blog/posts/genderplot_tags.png

I think I'm a 26 year old girl.

― Jane/Devil (Sanpaku), Wednesday, 29 September 2010 16:10 (fifteen years ago)

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