UK pop "super"-producers

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Last night I was surprised to notice that Pet Shop Boys' "Miracles" is produced by Adam F of all people, although you'd hardly notice (a shame - how cool would it be to have a Pet Shop Boys that sounded like "Stand Clear"?!?). Which makes for an odd progression for this guy: intelligent d'n'b to techstep to hip hop back to d'n'b and now sprightly synth pop.

This seems to be an increasing trend in UK pop: the odd and surprising reappearance of "credible" dance figures as pop producers. I'm not sure if the trend was kickstarted by Cameron McVey (Neneh Cherry's hubby and producer of first Massive Attack album) and Nellee Hooper (Soul II Soul, Massive Attack's no. 2 album, Bjork) working with All Saints, but that seems a decent place to start. Then All Saints did stuff with William Orbit. Then McVey with the Sugababes. Then Nellee with Holly Valance, and now Mantronix with Kylie, Guy Sigsworth (Bjork) with Sugababes, Marius De Vries with just about everyone. I'm not sure if Betty Boo or Lene Nostrom + Girls Aloud counts, or Cathy Dennis with Kylie for that matter - but these are still odd revivals. Even a relatively new producer like Mushtaq (Mis-Teeq) has a dark past with Fun'da'mental.

What's odd though is how the process works in reverse to US pop, where the big producers start with pop/r&b/hip hop and then expand to credible artist albums and Dido remixes later on. In the UK, pop is like this magnetic pole where old hacks go to die and be reborn. Usually I'd be a bit suspicious of this process, but it's resulted in some awesome stuff, particularly Nellee Hooper's work with Holly and the some of the Guy Sigsworth tracks on the Sugababes album. But is there a broader significance to this? Certainly people like Orbit and Sigsworth seem to offer a sheeny high-tech vision of pop that's surprisingly light on the "black" sounds that otherwise dominate pop... Is this trip-hop/ambient's last hurrah?

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Friday, 28 November 2003 07:56 (twenty-two years ago)

Adam F?! bloody hell, his previous foray into pop (r n' b tinged of course) was that Boniface single, didn't do as well as you may expect it to, was in the same vein as Nio's 'Do You Think You're Special' which also deserved to be more successful than it actually was.

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 28 November 2003 10:34 (twenty-two years ago)

also don't forget Jonny L who went from hardcore rave anthems to techstep to the pop garridge Truesteppers and Dane Bowers, Victoria Beckham and Brian Harvey

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 28 November 2003 10:36 (twenty-two years ago)

i've always wondered about their motives but i suspect a lot of the time it comes down to a certain idealism in their youth believing they can make a lot of money without compromising (in their view) on their musical ethos and attitude (probably all pop haters yet believing deep down pop can be great e.g. most of them including Adam F probably always loved the Pet Shop Boys), but eventually - perhaps after being stitched up and messed around by labels who don't feel comfortable handling their latest 'uncompromising' product anymore AND having settled down and had kids their attitude changes in that a) they want to make MORE money and provide for the familt and or b) having had some success, proven themselves and mellowed out a bit their attitude to pop changes and they have less hang-ups about working in that genre/medium/for that market (giving them wider exposure esp. now in the age of the producer as young cool megastar in their own right). not saying all this is really true but i can see it as a possible explanation in some cases.

producers who went the other way: Coldcut! Rebel MC! Norman Cook (before coming out the other side bigger than ever)! Adamski!

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 28 November 2003 10:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Surely the most oddball is how many great songs Karen Poole has been responsible for in the last two years.

― edward o (edwardo), Friday, 28 November 2003 11:04 (twenty-two years ago)

you mean there was Karen Poole goodness even before "It's Your Duty" and "Sweet Music"? spill, spill!

(obviously, i ask for non-Alisha's Attic answers!)

― Mind Taker, Friday, 28 November 2003 16:55 (twenty-two years ago)

It's really hard to track down everything she's written, but Holly Valance's "Whoop" and Dannii Minogue's "Put The Needle On It" are great. She's done a Sugababes one, don't know which though.

― edward o (edwardo), Friday, 28 November 2003 18:26 (twenty-two years ago)

Karen Poole seems to be partly-responsible for Buster and Conversation's Over and GLORIOUSLY Caught In A Moment on Three which all backs Ed up v. neatly here. There is copy of Illumina by ver Attic in local outlet shop discount bucket, is this worth my £2.49?

― Alex in Doncaster (Alex in Doncaster), Friday, 28 November 2003 18:43 (twenty-two years ago)

The idea of the "super producer" is an incredibly bad idea anyway.

The producer should first and foremost help the act get her/his own songs sound as technically perfect as possible. Writing songs and deciding genre is up to the artist, not the producer.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Friday, 28 November 2003 22:26 (twenty-two years ago)

Karen Poole also co-wrote the Amy Studt singles which I enjoyed.

― Paul R (paul R), Saturday, 29 November 2003 20:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Geir,so you're saying that the producer's job is purely technical?I don't think so,isn't that the engineer's job?In the world of manufactured pop the producer is king.God forbid what crap we'd have if the likes of Girls Aloud & The Sugababes actually started writing/choosing their own stuff.A lot of 'credible' artists get away with too much self indulgent crap as it is.I can't believe you rate the role of the producer to technician,it's unbelievable.

― Paul R (paul R), Saturday, 29 November 2003 21:02 (twenty-two years ago)

Well, the Sugababes, specifically Mutya and Keisha, do co-write most of their stuff I think. That was their hook when they first came out anyway.

Me and Edward were discussing the other night who's going to be the Karen Poole, Cathy Dennis and Betty Boo of tomorrow, and decided it was rather difficult to predict as BB apart, none of thsoe three seemed obvious. Keisha, Mutya and Sophie E-B were names mentioned, James and Mattie from Busted too.

― Nick H (Nick H), Sunday, 30 November 2003 02:09 (twenty-two years ago)

It should so absolutely totally be Justine Frischmann

― Alex in Doncaster (Alex in Doncaster), Sunday, 30 November 2003 22:02 (twenty-two years ago)

Fits the pattern. Someone who has some big hits, then has their next album and its singles drop off the face of the earth.. (Cathy Dennis, Alisha's Attic and Betty Boo all fit don't they!)

― edward o (edwardo), Sunday, 30 November 2003 22:37 (twenty-two years ago)

Siobhan D should surely be in with a chance also. Although if I'm permitted to drag this topic into GloriousLadiesOfIndiepop terrain then Marie du Santiago/Emmy-Kate Montrose, as they were allegedly the "pop" faction of Kenickie and are now surely just biding their time.

Lauren L possibly an even better bet but seemingly distressingly preoccupied with TV-presenting at the moment, also I am still deluded enough to believe that she will deliver that life-alteringly-perfect solo album yet. Maybe she too will go teenpop guru after this underperforms in hideously undeserving stylee.

― Alex in Doncaster (Alex in Doncaster), Sunday, 30 November 2003 23:20 (twenty-two years ago)

The thing is that it's like ex-football player's stepping into management - it's not necessarily the big-hitters you;d expect who make the best step up to the new side of the job. < /Dom Passantino>

― Nick Southall (Nick Southall), Sunday, 30 November 2003 23:26 (twenty-two years ago)

Are you saying Kenickie were big hitters Nick?

― Nick H (Nick H), Monday, 1 December 2003 00:20 (twenty-two years ago)

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