What the PnJ results would look like if only women voted.

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skimming through the PnJ/Feminism thread and saw Chuck wonder this aloud, and since I wondered myself, I did the math. I counted ballots where the first names give a fairly clear indication that the voter is a woman, ending up with 110 ballots. I'm sure I missed a handful, but these results should be fairly meaningful. The number to the right is total points, with real PnJ rank in parenthesis:

1. Outkast 578 (1)
2. White Stripes 330 (2)
3. Yeah Yeah Yeahs 271 (5)
4. The Shins 211 (6)
5. Cat Power 166 (14)
6. Dizzee Rascal 157 (10)
7. Basement Jaxx 142 (8)
8. Jay-Z 123 (13)
9. Radiohead 118 (4)
10. Fiery Furnaces 115 (28)
11. The Stokes 111 (12)
12. Belle & Sebastian 102 (18)
13. 50 Cent 100 (15)
14. Postal Service 98 (17)
15. Rapture 98 (25)
16. Missy Elliott 96 (24)
17. New Pornographers 94 (7)
18. Fountains of Wayne 85 (3)
19. Lucinda Williams 81 (16)
20. Death Cab for Cutie 80 (34)
21. Rufus Wainwright 79 (11)
22. Drive-By Truckers 69 (9)
23. Calexico 68 (83)
24. My Morning Jacket 65 (19)
25. Kathleen Edwards 65 (57)
26. Ted Leo 64 (20)
27. Justin Timberlake 62 (46)
28. Four Tet 61 (29)
29. Grandaddy 60 (30)
30. Pernice Brothers 59 (22)
31. Kings of Leon 58 (26)
32. Errase Errata 55 (131)
33. Beyonce 53 (58)
34. Junior Senior 52 (27)
35. Warren Zevon 51 (21)
36. Broken Social Scene 50 (40)
37. British Sea Power 49 (85)
38. Raveonettes 47 (56)
39. R. Kelly 47 (44)
40 (tie) TV on the Radio 46 (72)
40. (tie) Distillers 46 (92)

Dropped out:
23. Libertines
31. The Darkness
31. Johnny Cash
33. Notwist
35. Bubba Sparxxx
36. Mars Volta
37. Led Zeppelin
38. Liz Phair
39. Johnny Cash

Fountains of Wayne takes a tumble. Also interesting that Liz Phair falls, though I suspect the gender spread for her voters may be the same its always been.

have at it.

― chris herrington (chris herrington), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:20 (twenty-one years ago)

hey chris, with justin did you figure in women's carryover votes from 2002 as well? (this might apply to other records too, of course.)

― chuck, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Fountains of Wayne are The Chosen Band of Males shockah?

― Barry Bruner (Barry Bruner), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:25 (twenty-one years ago)

no -- forgot the carryovers

― chris herrington (chris herrington), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:26 (twenty-one years ago)

Also interesting that Liz Phair falls, though I suspect the gender spread for her voters may be the same its always been.

In my experience there's always been way more dudes into Liz Phair than any women I've known.

― El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:26 (twenty-one years ago)

yeah the liz phair fall/jay-z rise thing is kinda neat (i've definitely noticed recently that all the liz phair praise I've read is from dudes)

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:27 (twenty-one years ago)

chris h i kiss you

― Matos W.K. (M Matos), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Calexico appears to be the major beneficiary along with Erase Errata

― Gear! (Gear!), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:28 (twenty-one years ago)

so, same shit, different bag then.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:30 (twenty-one years ago)

not sure how to add in the carry over since the individual votes that are carried over aren't linked (unless I'm missing something, but Northern State should have carryovers from me, so I think I'd notice that.)

I'm going home now -- will check in on this later tonight.

― chris herrington (chris herrington), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:31 (twenty-one years ago)

So were The Libertines the biggest fallers then?

Very interesting, I began doing something like this on the day, and then realised that I didn't have the stamina. Kudos.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:33 (twenty-one years ago)

R. Kelly rises!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:34 (twenty-one years ago)

the Stokes is a cool name (sorry)

― pete s, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:36 (twenty-one years ago)

nice to see the fiery furnaces at #10.

― jody (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:37 (twenty-one years ago)

The math is WRONG, as Ted Leo is still not #1.

Also, El Diablo Robotico OTM re:Liz Phair fanbase

― Donna Brown (Donna Brown), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:37 (twenty-one years ago)

Stokes=Fiery Furnaces cover band

― Donna Brown (Donna Brown), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:37 (twenty-one years ago)

NICE

― jody (Jody Beth Rosen), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:38 (twenty-one years ago)

chris - for the carryover vote, go to the voice homepage, go down toward the bottom under "specials" or whatever where it says pazz and jop 2002, and key on the albums in question (say, timberlake or notwist etc), and see if any 2002 voters were women...

― chuck, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:40 (twenty-one years ago)

my god won't somebody PLEASE think of the Timberlake fan club?

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:41 (twenty-one years ago)

i see 20 more points for justin, springing him into 19th above lucinda (a less predictable dropper than liz?) here are the carryovers (no ballot names though).

― andrew s (andrew s), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:45 (twenty-one years ago)

new pornogaphers somewhat plummet too, hmm...

― chuck, Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:52 (twenty-one years ago)

nice!

"I counted ballots where the first names give a fairly clear indication that the voter is a woman" -- i wonder how many might've been missed? people like me with ambiguous non-american names, ppl with unisex names like 'cory' and 'jamie' and 'terry' and any M2F transsexuals and etc

― geeta (geeta), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:56 (twenty-one years ago)

new pornogaphers somewhat plummet too, hmm...
and yet the old pornographer goes up. thoia thoing!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Wednesday, 18 February 2004 23:57 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm surprised by the rufus wainwright plummet.

― fact checking cuz (fcc), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:03 (twenty-one years ago)

i counted you geeta

― chris herrington (chris herrington), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:08 (twenty-one years ago)

Haha, I'm a girl, I just realised.

― David A. (Davant), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:15 (twenty-one years ago)

yep -- Timberlake moves up to 19th -- everything else holds steady.

I think I only remember seeing one vote for Johnny Cash Unearthed.

― chris herrington (chris herrington), Thursday, 19 February 2004 00:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Could someone who knows about statistics take random subsets of all the voters, of the same size as the subset of women, and do the same thing, then see if the differences between those and the whole poll are less pronounced, indicating that the women did vote differently *because* they were women?

― mei (mei), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:46 (twenty-one years ago)

there's still too much stupid boy shit on the list.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:47 (twenty-one years ago)

though I guess I have to stop calling it that now.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 19 February 2004 01:52 (twenty-one years ago)

As per geeta's sub-request, the new results from voters with names that could be either gender:

1. Ryan Adams (48)
2. Al Green (53)
3. Sean Paul (80)
4. Bonnie Prince Billie (114)
5. Rickie Lee Jones (120)
6. Nick Cave (122)
7. Nelly Furtado (178)
8. Rainier Maria (234)

No one else made the lists. As you can see, big shifts.

― Sean Carruthers (SeanC), Thursday, 19 February 2004 02:11 (twenty-one years ago)

you guys have WAY too much time on your hands.

― Mr. Snrub (Mr. Snrub), Thursday, 19 February 2004 02:12 (twenty-one years ago)

time isn't that sticky

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Thursday, 19 February 2004 02:16 (twenty-one years ago)

every female didn't vote, and the female who did aren't exactly a representative sample, i mean Johnny Cash dropped?!!!

― Orbit (Orbit), Thursday, 19 February 2004 03:16 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't know what this list means, but some things on it make me very happy.

― Kerry (dymaxia), Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Cat Power moved up too! I like this list -- feels smoother, less unsettled angsty and more *settled* angsty, less aggro and more intro. I really wanna see the singles totals too, tho!

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:21 (twenty-one years ago)

west coast based transexuals list pls

― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:24 (twenty-one years ago)

go eat a dick ams. (then we can add you to a list, too!)

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:24 (twenty-one years ago)

This is a way more interesting list somehow.

― scott m (mcd), Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:25 (twenty-one years ago)

i was just joking, but i'll eat a dick anyhow

― amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:26 (twenty-one years ago)

I just checked Notwist's 2002 female vote, by the way. They got only 5 lady points that year (from Daphne Carr); not sure if that pushes them back into the top 40 or not.

Sterling, do you think Chan Marshall is unsettled angsty or settled angsty? (I have no idea what the difference is, myself. I just think she's lifeless.)

I was gonna say I liked the list above, too, but then I noticed that I like six of the ten albums that dropped out, most of them as much as I like Calexico! Though not as much as I like Justin Timberlake.

― chuck, Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:28 (twenty-one years ago)

Johnny Cash, Johnny Cash, and Led Zeppelin dropping out (and Warren Zevon plummeting) adds up to something good, though, I think. (I LIKE the Zeppelin album, but still...)

― chuck, Thursday, 19 February 2004 19:31 (twenty-one years ago)

5 points wasn't enough to push Notwist into top 40.

― chris herrington (chris herrington), Thursday, 19 February 2004 20:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Circa Nude As The News and prior i'da said unsettled angsty for sure, but circa Free its settled angsty as far as i'm concerned. This might just be because she gets around to resolving her chords more often.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Thursday, 19 February 2004 20:20 (twenty-one years ago)

I mean in this in complete seriousness - maybe in the future, we can add more info boxes to P&J to help analyze the data afterwards - I know that's not going to be a popular option with everyone, but I for one, think this is all well-nigh fascinating (but maybe that's b/c I'm a sociologist by training).

I'm totally surprised Rufus dropped as well, but I guess Rufus is more of a guy thing after all? Or maybe there's just a lot of P&J male voters who like Rufus' cabaret theatrics (and I include myself in that) vs. women. I'm so NOT surprised to see Fountains of Wayne take a dip tho'.

― Oliver Wang (Oliver Wang), Saturday, 21 February 2004 23:41 (twenty-one years ago)

I think there are maybe two records on the newly feminized list that I voted for: Postal Service and Fiery Furnaces. I voted for Missy and Fountains as singles. I don't know what this all means, other than I like shit that no one else likes.

Let's see the list of 30something Jewish women with fake red hair from Philadelphia. Oh nevermind.

Sara

― Sara Sherr, Sunday, 22 February 2004 00:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Almost forgot: Erase Errata and The Raveonettes.

― Sara Sherr, Sunday, 22 February 2004 00:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Let's see the list of 30something Jewish women with fake red hair from Philadelphia. Oh nevermind.

We're all 30something Jewish women with fake red hair from Philadelphia! We just hide it well.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 22 February 2004 00:10 (twenty-one years ago)

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