The gay thread

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To quote Mr Raggett: what 'sounds gay'? And who defines that, and how?

― JoB, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I'm trying to answer this question and coming up blank (for the time being); even an outrageously gay performer like Jobriath really only sounds sassy and glam rock to me, not really "gay"... does sounding gay mean sounding girlish or effiminate? Or campy? Or "sensitive"? I think each performer must define it for himself; just like gay people themselves, there is not one set of characteristics that epitomise being gay. I may have more on this later.

― Sean, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Tom says: "Who decides that? The record-buying public." I say: the clubbing gay crowd in particular have a lot to do with this as well, surely? When I think of supposedly "gay" music I think of eighties hi-NRG music, like Divine and Sylvester. Does anyone have a more current perspective? I believe Kylie figures in there, someway. (BTW, lots if not most gay people probably despise any notion of "gay music". At least my one gay friend does.)

― JoB, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Thanks, Chris. Quick roundup of today's gayness, starting with the roads. The M70, the A3, the B664 and the A48(M), they're all gay as of midnight tonight. The gay elements are potassium, zinc, hydrogen, copper and argon. Quick look at the world's walls - the Wailing Wall is gay, Hadrian's Wall is very gay, the Great Wall Of China, that's not gay, and the Old London Wall has also stopped being gay. Gay cars next, they're the same as last night - all Volkswagens registered between 1982 and 1985, they stay gay for another fortnight. And finally, the gay seas are the Caspian and the Mediterranean, so see you there. Chris.

― Alan Trewartha (at home), Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I think of eighties hi-NRG music

Ok, that type of sound definately sounds "gay" to me, and in this case it's a pejoritive.

― Sean, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Erasure.

― Nude Spock, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Yes, Spock, you're totally right. I've always thought they sounded totally gay, and again in a bad way.

― Sean, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The original context of the question was to do with public taste, though, and public taste isn't a difficult beast to diagnose. If you got a thousand american record-buyers and played them fifty pieces of music each and asked them to describe those pieces, I bet you would find "sounds gay" cropping up as a descriptor plenty of times. So yes Alan as a denotative word 'gay' is meaningless when applied to music but as a connotative word it isn't.

― Tom, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Besides if any sea is gay it is surely the Caspian

― mark s, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

yeah, you're right. sorry I was being a smart arse -- and I didn't even attribute the quote (The Day Today for anyone wondering), making me seem doubly arrogant.

I'd agree there is some music that people would describe as gay, I own a lot. It's still not something I care to do though. Oddly, the same isn't true of clothes.

― , Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Korn is gay, Slipknot is not. Nashville Pussy is gay, Turbonegro is not. Iron Maiden is gay, Judas Priest is not. To me, like "English- sounding", it's just a synonym for cheesy.

― Kris, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

HEY!!!!

Is there such a thing as hard core gangsta gay rap music? How about gay rap music, period? If so, why is it so damn UNpopular, considering how popular rap music is?

― Nude Spock, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Scott Walker, Pulp, Momus,Ute

― anthony, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Anal Cunt! (Especially Picnic of Love).

― Tadeusz Suchodolski, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

nelly,oasis,blur,the beatles,dmx,missy elliot,nelly futarado(sp),the clash, and lake michigan

― kevin enas, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

i think there is a queer aesthic, i find it hard to define , erhaps it is a touch more ironic and theatrical ?

― anthony, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

A Moon Beneath the Grindsledge. Need I say more about gay music.

― Luptune Pitman, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The Caspian Sea is actually a lake, ya know. As to what sounds gay, that depends on what stereotype you want to vomit up. If you run with the idea that gays are all wimpish sissies, Coldplay or Starsailor could sound gay. Still, not all gay music is like that Supersister song Coffee, as I'm sure the mainstream theory is.

― EdwardO, Tuesday, 16 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I prefer the adjective "fruity."

― sundar subramanian, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

A Moon Beneath the Grindsledge? it's Grindsludge...and since you cannot spell you are in my gay list now

― kevin enas, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Is there such a thing as hard core gangsta gay rap music?
Yes indeed. I can't recall the name of the band but they do indeed exist. Were they any good? I can't remember. So probably not.

― Helen Fordsdale, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

RAINBOW WARRIORS!

― ethan, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I remember a conversation with a gay ex-colleague about bars in London. He mentioned one that I had no idea was a 'gay bar'. 'Really, I never knew?!' I said. So he said 'For goodness sake. There's no such thing as an official gay bar. There's no umbrella organisation that goes around giving official accreditation to bars, so that they can put an 'approved' sticker in their window.' I was richly amused by the thought. Rather like kosher restaurants having rabbinical authorities inspect the premises, so would the gay authorities go on their inspections, making sure all the criteria were being met.

― Daniel, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

soft cell sounds gay. i think momus sounds macho.

― chaki, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Think in these terms: "Dude, I like Belle & Sebastian but that doesn't have to mean I take it up the poopshoot?!"

― Alacrán, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The word disco is going to be used for this , right?

― anthony, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Eminem

― dave q, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

this is unrelated, but when is mainstream pop culture going to show more obvious influences from the gay community? i only started wondering about this cos i was listening to something on the radio which i guess is in the charts, with some guy singing some love song about someone who i thought was 'sandy', ie a guy. this really interested me cos it was the first piece of pop music, pop in the sense of 'in the charts' that was about a gay relationship, or whatever. i realised later that it was actually 'candy', so that was that shot to pieces. but there are the seeds, whatever yo think of them, of more equal representation of gay people on the tv, obv. "queer as folk" is what im thinking, but im sure theres other examples....why hasnt this pervaded the world of pop? when will it?

― ambrose, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

ambrose - kylie is no 1, before whacko jacko..the hordes have already invaded.

― Geoff, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

yeah but kylie isnt singing about eating out her lover.......

i mean, lyrically, not just what gay people listen to.

― ambrose, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Pavarotti

― Johnathan, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Fred Durst is a total Bear icon.

― Arthur, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

gay doesnt= stupid and useless. nor does it have conotations of crappiness. and unlike the current myth, gay people are not all about sex with other gay people, just like straight people arent all about sex. no, wait, i take that back. its all anyone ever thinks about.

― chameleon, Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The Frogs are just about the gayest thing out there! Just give It's Only Right And Natural a spin once. That's gay.

― Dan I., Wednesday, 17 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The Clash (jumpsuit era and beyond) were very gay, while the Buzzcocks never drew a gay breath.

― Dan, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Exactly!

― Kris, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Gay: ELP, Black Flag, Germs, NWA, Venom

Not Gay: King Crimson, Bad Brains, Pere Ubu, Devo, Bathory

As constant readers know, these are 10 of my all-time favorites, so nothing pejorative or laudatory implied. Just a question of 'sensibility'.

― dave q, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

For 'Devo', read 'Geto Boys', and for 'Pere Ubu' read 'Devo'

― dave q, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

It's definitely time for the "disco" vs. "gay" distinction we developed. "Gay" = word used by American pre-teens for anything they don't like, e.g., "Math class is so totally gay."

"Disco" = term we've decided upon for aesthetically linking things to stereotypes of homosexuality, e.g., Erasure, a band that just screams gay, gay, gay, gay.

Root/epitome/source/center of universe of this whole question, including "disco," homosexuality, gay, and music as gay = VILLAGE PEOPLE.

― Nitsuh, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

re: Bathory, I think all black metal is pretty gay. Venom is like the gay version of Judas Priest. Gay: Whitehouse, not Gay: Masonna.

― Kris, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Root/epitome/source/center of universe of this whole question, including "disco," homosexuality, gay, and music as gay = VILLAGE PEOPLE.

Except that Turbonegro isn't gay at all and clearly the Village People are their primary influence. I think Kraftwerk's way more gay than the Village People, perhaps even the epitome of gay. Van Halen is not gay, Van Hagar is absurdly gay. Gay = overserious to the point of comedy? Gay = I laugh at, rather than with?

― Kris, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

That would make the Bee Gees gay, Sylvester not-gay, and Barry White fails miserably at being gay even though he's been wearing a sailor suit in Tiffany's display window trying to 'pass' for 30 years.

― dave q, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Well, yes. I'd flip flop Bathory and the Germs in your scheme.

― Kris, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Black Flag weren't gay until Henry came on board, when they went from being a great band to being a great band who happened to be really gay.

― Dan, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I agree with all of that, too, except I don't think they were ever all that great post-Henry.

― Kris, Thursday, 18 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

The new Robert Downy music video makes Elton John seem more uh...gay- er than the old music video I'm Still Standing. Did that make sense?

― Lindsey B, Sunday, 21 October 2001 00:00 (twenty-four years ago)

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