Olivia Tremor Control (Update July 2012 -- Bill Doss RIP)

i don't think they were underrated but at the same time i don't know why there was such an OTC backlash. certainly some of my fave critics shat on them ... maybe they're not such big byrds fans?? (the critics, that is - i always thought the beach boys comparisons were a red herring)

yes, but WHYYYYYY????

It's hard to overstate how single-handedly Olivia changed Athens from a sleepy legacy town to a kinetic dreamscape, at least for a little while. It always pains me when their stock slides cuz of the glut that followed.

yeah those are pretty hard ones to defend. i guess for the first i'd say the human voice grates by its very nature. for the second ... well you've got me. i can remember how most of their songs go but i can't remember how a single one ends!! (don't they all end in an abrupt cymbal crash or what sounds like everyone just getting bored or tired and spontaneously stopping??)

-already heard the album and didn't like it
-was told not to buy album
-didn't have $2
-didn't actually have opportunity to purchase album (was just being cheeky)
-actually bought album for $1, or $3 or whatever
-?

nah, it just sounded to me like you were making a value judgement and saying it wasn't even worth $2, but i would be pretty surprised if someone who liked black foliage wouldn't find age of the sun worth the price of a subway ride. i mean it's kinda short since the last track is a 20 min wank, but still

I like Olivia Trmoer Control I don't know why there is so much hate for them and so much love for Disco Inferno. Besides them being not as good and being not British and having many 60s melodies and stuff.

x-post to chris: i got Up On The Sun ($3!) and if i go back, i'll probably get In A Car, cuz that one's $2... used CD sales are the best.

don't think noodley wank, think massive reverberating, decaying chord wank. like, it's a cool sound, but i rarely need 20 minutes of it.

...oh, just have a listen to Dukes Of Stratosphear's 'Shiny Cage' and you'll see.

Shameless or completely accidental?

I'm really sad to hear the new about Will Cullen Hart. It's so tragic how young both he and Bill Doss were when they passed.

This band is foundational for me. It's kind of shaking my world up tonight to hear two new songs from them after 13 years while processing this news. Both songs are wonderful. Garden of Light, especially. It's so intense to hear a new song sung by Bill Doss after so long.

In ‘99 I had a Sony discman and I took it and the Cubist Castle cd to Spain

I have some wonderful uploads from Dime back in the day, back in the peak Dime era, of some fantastic shows. I guess there's an official live record recorded in 2004 as well? I haven't heard it. Just lots of tapes from the 40 Watt. I forgot about that 2020 cover of "Ten Years Gone/Vitamin C" as well. Anyway, fantastic long jams, the kinda stuff I'm into, often with Bill Doss... IDK when Doss joined the Circulatory System, 2006? 2007?

I also remember hearing that Will Cullen Hart did his own fanmix of Smile... I'd love to hear what that would have sounded like. Kind of, you know, remix culture, right? Like Patrick Cowley doing Donna Summer or something.

wow, those 2 new songs are so great. :(

always be thankful to have seen them play live right before bill passed, and play with/see circulatory system on an off night during one of the NMH reunion tours. fantastic shows from my heroes.

Saw them in ny on the black foliage tour

I saw Circulatory System open for NMH in… 2014? Glad I got to have that experience. (Which was more the point of going than NMH frankly)

As I said upthread, promo for Nov. 29 vinyl reissue of Elephant Six doc soundtrack is my gateway to OTC, and it also incl. Hart solo track---looking fwd to their swan song---

A Celebration of Elephant 6 Visionary Will Cullen Hart

🐘🐘🐘🐘🐘🐘

Thanks for posting that, Brad

that's really nice! i should get around to watching that doc

Brad thx, that’s a really good cumulative tribute, just beautiful.

Schneider on WCH: “We met in sixth grade at a Cheap Trick concert in Ruston, through our mutual friends (and future E6 collaborators) Joey Foreman and Jeff Mangum”

I’m always like “how is this kind of shit reality?” and then I wonder if there’s some kind or weird woo mystical energy force that puts them together. Or if there’s some kind of woo interaction after random contact that catalyzes creative forces in the people. It’s very remarkable.

Listened to ‘Dusk at Cubist Castle’ again recently and it’s fair to say that, reflecting back, it changed my life as an 18-19 year old. incredible record.

I don’t know if I ever told this story, but here goes:
it was spring of my freshman year, I was really coming into myself as someone who writes and makes art and such, and I had had just an awful week— a guy I was seeing cut it off, and this woman I was seeing was always getting shithouse drunk and calling me late at night. (She is now a big dyke, of course, in the same way I am a big fag). Because of some scheduling stuff, I was poised to cook two meals for 80+ people on the first Saturday of May, when I was also scheduled to do my weekly radio show at 7a. But I hadn’t been sleeping well. So, at 6:30, I woke up, made sure all the food I had prepped the night before was still good in the industrial fridges, and then ate two tabs of pretty decent acid.

I got to the station and was immediately tripping pretty hard, so after playing a few psych gems, I decided I needed to just lie down— and I put on ‘Dusk at Cubist Castle’ because I figured it sounded varied enough that I wouldn’t get called out for it.

Possibly one of the better psychedelic experiences I ever had, prone on the cheap carpeted floor of this grungy college radio station, letting OTC just alter my consciousness.

After the radio show, I made my way back to the coop where I was cooking, still tripping hard, and put on ‘Dusk at Cubist Castle’ again. I cut tomatoes and salad greens for two hours, watching my hands morph with the tomatoes and thinking about how strange it was that I was also just a carbon based life form.

The lunch was a resounding success— like, it got a standing ovation from all the hippies in the vegan coop where I was living/cooking.

Then, since I was tasked with buying the alcohol for the next meal because I was the only one who had a fake ID, my friends whisked me around to various stores to buy booze and supplies, while I insisted we listen to ‘Dusk at Cubist Castle,’ of course. I ended up standing in line behind my creative writing professor, buying beer and sangria, while tripping face in a mid-range grocery store in rural Ohio.

Later that night my friend did a screening of Painlevé films as I was coming down.

Perhaps one of the best days of my life, if I am being honest— and OTC were a big part of it.

Defiiiine / a transparent

dream

That's a lovely memory to have!

Nice writeup. I'm currently listening to DACC independently of having seen this threadbump. It works just as well as a good morning album as a night of trip, although from recent experiences I'd say it's, for me, best suited as a 'hazy hot afternoon' zone-out. Wherever or whenever you listen, it's an incredible piece of work, and I'm kicking myself it's taken until the last few weeks to hear it

Easily in my top 10 albums that flow so awesome from start to finish. I'm sure I've listened to a couple hundred times, but still could not name any of the songs.

Thank you for sharing that, table! Sounds like a fantastic day.

https://oliviatremorcontrol.bandcamp.com/album/explanation-ii-instrumental-themes-and-dream-sequences

“New” thing
Ambient stuff by Will

This was released as the second disc on a 2 CD version of Dusk at Cubist Castle
https://www.discogs.com/release/442182-The-Olivia-Tremor-Control-Music-From-The-Unrealized-Film-Script-Dusk-At-Cubist-Castle

Well well...

On October 23, 2026 The Elephant 6 Recording Company will release the third and final album from The Olivia Tremor Control. The Same Place is a 27-track double album of all new unreleased music. Nearly 20 years in the making, the record is the bittersweet conclusion to an extraordinary band and their ingenious body of work. We invite you to join us in celebrating our friends Bill & Will. Welcome, welcome home.

https://elephant6.com/product/the-olivia-tremor-control-the-same-place/

https://elephant6.com/test/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/E6033-OTC.jpg

glad to hear this announced!

No way!! That's such great news. I've been anticipating this for so many years. The two released singles were both excellent, too.

Tracklist:

Whoops, hit submit too soon.

Tracklist:

01. Begin Now!
02. Advice From the Oceans
03. Timewaster
04. The Spinning Continuous
05. The Same Old Place
06. A Useful Planet, Partially Yellow
07. We Captured a Frame
08. Meeting Ourselves
09. Striping the Orchestra
10. Halfway Down
11. Now Begin
12. Have We Come Round
13. California Demise 4
14. Path of the Parallels I- Follow the Path
15. Path of the Parallels II- It’s Obvious
16. Path of the Parallels III- A River of White
17. Path of the Parallels IV- Membraned Wings
18. Path of the Parallels V- Universe Café
19. Path of the Parallels VI- Last Occupants
20. Path of the Parallels VII- The Same Place
21. Leaf
22. Seen It All
23. Garden of Light
24. It’s Not Impossible (Golden Times)
25. Mirrors Hear Us
26. Impressions Through the Ring
27. Fossil Faun

It's interesting to see a track called The Spinning Continuous on there. When Circulatory System's "Signal Morning" leaked in an early mix, that was the name of the track that was later renamed to "Round Again." And then there's also a track called "Have We Come Round" that quotes a lyric from that same track. They were working on this record a couple years after Signal Morning came out, so maybe some of the same ideas were still circulating.

wow, bringing back the longbox!

LET'S GO!!!

there isn't any other album i'm looking forward to more, kinda hard to believe it's finally coming out

crazy

robert schneider on facebook (https://www.facebook.com/robert.schneider.351/posts/pfbid0qprgsosDcJLLtQUfPELESCHJKcmk3Ng9Qef1MKR5f4iP6ses9mET3PfgYr7V7ejAl)

Gigantic Day: Please mark this day in your minds as a day of great joy and artistic triumph for The Olivia Tremor Control and the Elephant 6 Recording Co., my lifelong best friends 👑 ⛰️ 🌞 The *new* third OTC album, The Same Place, was begun almost 20 years ago and is so epic and majestic and interesting and moving — it rises on wings of flame from the mutual vision of OTC bandleaders Bill Doss and Will Cullen Hart, both who have left this world but their spark shines on. This beautiful concept album was completed by Will and the OTC band members with Athens, Georgia, producer-engineer Jason NeSmith over the last five years. Jason, our community and music scene will be forever grateful for your work with the OTC — thank you 🫂

The band had recorded most of the basic tracks engineered by Derek Almstead and Bill, and had almost completed many of the songs, when Bill passed away in 2012. I was on board to help finish and mix the ambitious record at the time — I engineered and co-produced the first OTC album and did engineering and mixing on the second record, as well as played on both, so I am kind of a member of the band ❤️ We all vowed to finish the album at the time Bill passed, there was so much momentum around it, but overwhelming grief and time lag and disorganization made it very difficult, and it took years of healing before we could return to the work.

With Bill there in spirit as a driving force, Will and the band and I, and our audio engineer friends, piled into Jason’s studio about six years ago and started the tracking and mixing process to finish the third OTC record ☀️ Very tragically, Will passed away in 2024 on the triumphant day the first new OTC single was released to the world. But Will’s momentum and Bill’s momentum never wavered in our hearts and community, and buoyed us and gave us a sense of purpose, and all their original plans and notes and recordings were still in effect. For so many years, we kept the spark of this album alive in our hearts as a community of friends — and kept the ball rolling until the time came that we were strong enough to pick it back up.
Jason NeSmith worked for years closely with Will. After Will passed, he and Derek and the OTC band members, along with producer (and Will’s close friend) Ron Kwasman and Amy Hairston and Kelly Hart (Bill’s and Will’s spouses and collaborators) — and I, as musician and co-planner and second set of ears — have worked to bring to completion this beautiful double album, that the Elephant 6 community has held as our central goal for almost 20 years.

this is fabulous news

yes, good news!

I have a great fondness for the Elephant 6 recordings of the mid-to-late 90s - Dusk at Cubist Castle, Avery Island, In the Aeroplane Over the Sea, Tone Soul Evolution, A Dream In Sound, Black Foliage: Animation Music, Vol. 1

Did anyone get a confirmation email from preordering this? The payment showed up on my credit card, but I didn't get anything from elephant 6.

I preordered and definitely got an email. Check your spam?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0UF4v0PW0w

we got another single a few days ago, "advice from the oceans"

https://toneglow.substack.com/p/tone-glow-239-the-olivia-tremor-control

wonderful interview about how the album was finally finished

hmm the album ends up as the kinda underwhelming sort of reunion album, where it still sounds like them but just doesn't hit the same highs anywhere near as consistently

what do you do when the magic's gone? and so on

a bit of a shame because dusk at cubist castle is one of my favourite albums ever and this is nowhere near that, but it's still great to have one last album from them, it's not bad, just not on the level of their previous masterpieces which is a very high bar to meet

dusk at cubist castle is really such a miraculous album, i still don't really understand how they managed to make green typewriters actually work

It's pretty amazing to finally hear this after so long... I was never certain it'd ever come out.

I'm still digesting it, really. I was surprised at the way Garden of Light fits into the sequencing. It's such a huge song IMO, feels like a centerpiece of the album to me right now, but that little manic song before it just seems to undercut it a little rather than build up to it. Maybe I'll feel differently on later listens.

On the other hand, the way Path of the Parallels builds into The Same Place is magical, really enhances an already great song.

Leaf is an immediate standout to me.

The very end of the album really hit for me, hearing Bill come in and harmonize on that iconic old Circulatory System melody... I didn't expect that. Actually I twigged to a lot of random Circulatory System references in this album. I wonder whether there are, like, Sunshine Fix references or something, never got as into that band.

the problem is just that the first two albums are filled with the most incredible better-than-the beatles psych pop songs and the songwriting just isn't as strong as that here but it's still quite a nice sprawling psych album

On second listen I pretty much agree with you. This is a good album but I'm not seeing it reaching the pinnacles of their first two. Then again, this band's always been a grower, so I'm gonna hold out judgement for a little while.

It is growing on me...

Leaf reminds me of that middle period of Pink Floyd where they were briefly functioning as a egalitarian group of songwriters doing psych folk stuff.

Halfway Down is surprisingly 90's twee, like early of Montreal kind of stuff. So catchy and fun.

It's amazing the way you can feel this album come together out of all these little disparate fragments. The source material spans from such a long range of time, and if you've been listening to E6 bands from across that range (especially Circulatory System), in a lot of cases you can almost carbon date certain pieces just by hearing them.

really really glad this exists, it's so great to hear bill's voice again <3

this is great. my expectations were high and this blows past them. it's such a bummer we'll never get to see these songs performed live

I think it sounds great -- especially the first half. Can't wait to spend some quality time with the LP tonight.

"The Spinning Continuous" is my favorite cut so far.

Don't think this is an early overreaction but was getting 'this is the best album' vibes even on the first listen

I don't disagree.

Power move putting the album's catchiest song (ostensibly) on side 4.