Taking Sides: Michael Rother vs. Duane Allman

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a) Both come from areas with confused relationships to their pasts - rich in cultural achievements yet absolutely bloody appalling in other areas, so objectionable that both had to be occupied and 'reconstructed'. Also, people from both places like to drive really FAST.

b) Allman shot himself in the foot to get out of going to 'Nam. Rother did community service in a nuthouse as a conscientious objector.

c) On "Layla", the master tape was accidentally sped up, and that's how it was released. Neu - Well, you know.

d) Both do stuff that people either find mesmerizing and hypnotic and consciousness-elevating or really, really boring. Very long tracks where either (depending on taste) nothing actually happens or infinitesimal shifts in TIMBRE (not 'rhythm') and schematics of same provide the developmental/textural action. Both have a similar tone ('melting Silly Putty') and both dominate their groups' sound with a (rare in guitarists) kinetic-yet-meditative intelligence that precludes any display of crass or baroque indulgences. Self-indulgence per se, actually, like Zen or something. And listen to those sounds at minutes 12-14 of "Mountain Jam"! That's cosmiche.

― dave q, Saturday, 8 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Tangentially, all conditions being equal, who would win, stock-car racers or F1?

― dave q, Saturday, 8 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Tangentially, all conditions being equal, who would win, stock-car racers or F1? Also, that should mean 'NO self-indulgence per se'

― dave q, Saturday, 8 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

For those who think this comparison ridiculous, remember that track on Stereolab's 'Mars Audiac Quintet' that rips Canned Heat's "On the Road Again"?

― dave q, Saturday, 8 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Stereolab haven't ignored the boogie, they just pervert it. Sorta.

I'd choose Rother if only because there's less immediate chance of spilled bongwater in the vicinity. Others may have differing experiences.

― Ned Raggett, Saturday, 8 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Rother, if for no other reason than he was never married to Cher.

― Michael Taylor, Sunday, 9 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

GREG Allman was married to Cher.

― Kris, Sunday, 9 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Duane for melody, Rother for space. It's a dead heat for sideburns.

― Mark, Sunday, 9 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

four months pass...

Rother, if for no other reason than nobody in his family married Cher.

― mt, Thursday, 2 May 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

dave, will you write a book so I can read it on the bus?

― Josh, Thursday, 2 May 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

one month passes...

Umm Duane Allman was one of the best guitarists ever. There is no comparison here.

― asdf, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Allman, for a thousand reasons, Nos. 1-5 being:

1. he writes better pop songs 2. his jams are way spacier 3. he has the sartorial edge (that German future-leaning look is in the final analysis way more hippied out that D's hair) 4. he's a much more potent icon than Rother: a lens through which to view several images ("guitar hero," "tragic hero," "burnout," etc) 5. he is in no way shape or form responsible for Stereolab

― John Darnielle, Friday, 7 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I heard an excellent Allman Bros guitar solo on the radio the other day. What's a good place to start with them?

― sundar subramanian, Saturday, 8 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Eat a Peach is their masterpiece, the one they were working on (or had just finished, I don't have the lore memorized) when Duane Allman, riding on his motorcycle, was hit and killed by a truck that was hauling peaches through the south. The morbidity of the album title is a nice way into the album's governing mood, which is a mildly aggressive sort of melancholy. Be warned that it has an instrumental jam on it that lasts for over half an hour -- if you can get into blues-based guitar jams, then you'll love it, but if you can't, well, it's got all the excesses at once (even a long drum solo). The pop songs on the album, though, are country-tinged rock having experienced a transfiguration: "Ain't Wastin' Time No More" (one of my favorite songs EVAH) and "Melissa" are, to me, singular moments of despair-as-epiphany worth the price of admission.

― John Darnielle, Saturday, 8 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

All of their first couple of albums up to EAT A PEACH (including the Fillmore Concerts) are some great stuff...

I'd say the two must-owns are BROTHERS AND SISTERS and EAT A PEACH

― Joe, Sunday, 9 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Gregg shot himself in the foot, not Duane. Duane was exempt from the draft.

― Donnah Dee, Monday, 10 June 2002 00:00 (twenty-three years ago)

five months pass...

i'm going to respond to this

― cba, Wednesday, 13 November 2002 20:27 (twenty-two years ago)

one year passes...

Well go on then, we're waiting, that's almost two years now, long enough surely?

― Soon Over Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:15 (twenty years ago)

Who's been pressing random today?

― mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:26 (twenty years ago)

Actually I've been listening to a crap Michael Rother album today and wondering what other people have to say about it, the answer: diddley squat.

― Soon Over Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:27 (twenty years ago)

I just pressed Random. I got a killing joke thread. Guess who...

― mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:28 (twenty years ago)

Now the Diddley Squat album, on the other hand, is excellent

― Soon Over Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:29 (twenty years ago)

interesting. some time back i wasted a few minutes while chemically er enhanced deciding that southern boogie was the american equivalent of at least the less electronic strains of krautrock and i included CCR in my theory because even though not genuinely southern the do present the boogie in a truly pleasing crunchy manner. but then i abandoned the theory because i didn't care all that much. but this thread reminded me.

― andrew m. (andrewmorgan), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:39 (twenty years ago)

"Keep On Chooglin'" is the US equivalent of motorik

― Soon Over Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:47 (twenty years ago)

exactly. you feel me.

― andrew m. (andrewmorgan), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:48 (twenty years ago)

Re-reading dave q's initial post I think i'd take issue with the idea that "both dominate their groups' sound" - not really true for MR

― Soon Over Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 5 November 2004 17:53 (twenty years ago)

You think it's Dinger's drums?

― Naive Teen Idol (Naive Teen Idol), Friday, 5 November 2004 19:40 (twenty years ago)

Sorry just had to put in another word for 'Keep on Chooglin'. Chooglin. Chooglin.

― 57 7th (calstars), Friday, 5 November 2004 22:24 (twenty years ago)

For the dude who wants some Allmans to listen to. I have a different take than the others. First, the Brothers and Sisters LP is decent but, remember, DUANE IS NOT ON IT. He had been dead for about two years. Brothers and Sisters is Allmans as Dicky Betts band. Personally, it is decent but I don't think the post-Duane version stands up in anyway to Duane-era. As somebody said earlier, Duane is a fucking musical genius, or something to that effect. He is one of my fave, fave guitarists, which actually doesn't mean shit. But, he did have a singular vision for fusing free jazz to southern boogie to delta blues to Dead-style jamming, and he made his band pull it off AND he could write a great pop tune, too. As for Eat a Peach, it is real cool. The acoustic shit is inspired and pretty harrowing. They are tributes to Duane. However, all the studio tracks ARE POST-DUANE, and the live tracks are leftovers from Live at the Fillmore East, which me thinks is one of the great epic live albums and THEE must own for understanding what the hell the Allmans were doing. It is utterly hypnotic. Now onto studio records, try the first two record, which are studio tracks. This is where Duane as pop songwriter stands out. The jams are cut down and recorded brilliantly. The names of these two records are selft-titled and Idlewild South. This is real-deal American blues music. Duane is authentic. So, also check out the Duane and Greg Allman record (aka Allman Joys), which is mild southern soul-garage material recorded shortly before they formed the Allman Brothers Band. Also, you HAVE to track the Duan and Greg's other pre-ABB band, Hour Glass. And, also listen to Duane Allman Anthology Volumes I and II. Here is playing guitar behind Aretha Franklin, King Curtis, Wilson Pickett and more. Great shit. Yow. I went nuts.

― Justin Farrar (Justin Farrar), Friday, 5 November 2004 22:54 (twenty years ago)

five years pass...

Practicing guitar: no pain, no Duane.

― Mark, Saturday, 24 July 2010 03:30 (fifteen years ago)

Duane

― Stormy Davis, Saturday, 24 July 2010 04:30 (fifteen years ago)

four years pass...

I've had Anthology for a long time; "Little Martha" was the song I always put on mix-tapes, the rest I forgot about. I was making my way through some vinyl a friend passed along today, and was surprised by how great Eric Clapton's "Please Be with Me" was. Thought I'd never heard it, but apparently I had--on the Allman album.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYtnoffSW8s

― clemenza, Monday, 13 October 2014 22:12 (eleven years ago)

I've never heard the Allman Brothers... knowingly that is, I think they've got a famous instrumental which might used as theme tune for a TV show (which I am hoping is NOT Top Gear).

― ... and a Martin Parr photo essay (Tom D.), Tuesday, 14 October 2014 12:52 (eleven years ago)

It is.

― strychnine, Tuesday, 14 October 2014 12:55 (eleven years ago)

I suspected it was.

― ... and a Martin Parr photo essay (Tom D.), Tuesday, 14 October 2014 12:56 (eleven years ago)

This blurb from 10 years ago about Eat a Peach is NOT true:

"However, all the studio tracks ARE POST-DUANE, and the live tracks are leftovers from Live at the Fillmore East, which me thinks is one of the great epic live albums and THEE must own for understanding what the hell the Allmans were doing."

Duane is on most of Eat a Peach: all of the live stuff, and the studio stuff on the latter part of the album. Blue Sky, Stand Back (one of his best performances) and Little Martha.

― Prince Kajuku (Bill Magill), Tuesday, 14 October 2014 15:52 (eleven years ago)

I think they've got a famous instrumental which might used as theme tune for a TV show

"Jessica," I assume?

― clemenza, Tuesday, 14 October 2014 19:32 (eleven years ago)

duane soloing over a neu! motorik beat would have been the ultimate stoner music

― u2 removal machine (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 14 October 2014 19:50 (eleven years ago)

^ listen to "Jessica" at 3/4 speed

― example (crüt), Tuesday, 14 October 2014 21:09 (eleven years ago)

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