Tarkus

Prog can be funny and brilliant (ie War Of The Worlds album, erm, do ELO count?), just rubbish (ELP etc, sorry I'm not thinking well today, I have a hangover, there should be more here), or scarily appreciated by people who like Krautrock by being shunted into the Kosmiche category (Tangerine Dream etc).

Only the first is good, obviously, and not in an ironic way.

Help me out w. a tarkus track-listing. ELP had the millwall barmy army of fan-bases as i recall: the lie-cliche that this music depended on the genteel middleclasses is more boring than that the music was "bloated" (tarkus was a single LP after all: "welcome back my friends to the show that never ends we're so glad you could attend come inside come inside" was a triple, no?)

Side 1: TARKUS - shorter than I thought it would be. Includes "Eruption", "Mass", "Battlefield" I think, a couple of other things and then "Aquatarkus"! It is difficult to tell where any of these start and stop except of course for AQUATARKUS because Keith Emerson makes bloopy noises.

Side 2: "Jeremy Bender" - music-hall nonsense like Oasis used to put as a filler on their albums.

"Bitches Crystal" - "There was a bitch/She had a crystal" - this is what we wanted it to go like. It didn't.

The third track which goes "God / How could you lose / Six million Jews"

At that point I passed out.

I'm still bummed that Pitchfork didn't run a Tarkus vs. Emergency & I artwork resemblance thing.

And Tom, dare you challenge the underwater capabilities of the half- armadillo/half-tank?

(PS Why is it assumed that you're being ironic if you like the British art-rock of 1972 but not if you like the British art-rock of 1979?)

'Mekanik Destruktiuw Kowmandoh', Mr Q , is by Magma, and is a BIT BLOODY MUCH.

ANYTHING is less offensive than that stupid shit "Fat LEs"

I would post more, but am going to listen to "Gracious!" (Vertigo, 1973-ish) Harpsichord-led prog, and great. Also, in thee interests ov "previous form being taken into account", I wd like to admit to owning "Emerson Lake and Powell" on CD!!!! ELP's best trax0r is "the endless enigma", from "Trilogy", they weren't anywhere near as good as THE NICE (boringly conventional this is, but TRUE!!!)

Will Tom dare to buy "Tales From Topographic Oceans" then, eh? EH???

Well, obviously.

The thing is that I share one of the Faycycler's unhip fascinations, unashamedly and utterly, and am a little nervous about taking the other one on ...

it would, after all, be quite funny to make up a band somewhere in the 500...

no you don't have to call me that.

Help.

I gave a friend of mine a copy of 'Stairway...' and he went out and bought 'Emerald City' by Teena Marie (no.9) - it was horrible!!

Great little feature by Steve Davis on French Prog in the latest Q - he namechecks Magma, Weidorje, Heldon, Cheval Fou, Bernard Szajner. Mr Snooker says "The French '70s albums are every bit as legendary as the Germans - You will be chasing them sooner than you think!"

Made In Japan is unbelievable. Rivals Joy Division live recordings for intensity and kicks them for consistency. You were right about "Space Truckin'." I must have sex with Jon Lord.

dq is OTM re Cygnus X-1. And Hemispheres is about due a re- evaluation. IIRC they said "to be continued" at the end of X-1 but when it came to it, they couldn't think of a way to carry on. Fans were expecting Rush-do-"Star Wars" but got all this greek god stuff instead. I used to skip the first half of 'Book 2' and head for that ghostly middle section. But I suspect the best writing is actually in the "song proper" i.e. first 10 minutes.

Yeah, the first side of Hemispheres is pretty majestic (including - especially? - the first 10 minutes). So why don't I like math rock?

I got the vinyl Made In Japan

x0x0x

Anyway, can I mention "Presto", the most underrated Rush album and their last great moment. 'Show Don't Tell' is riff-tastic and stands up against anything from their back catalogue.

"Grace Under Pressure" is also good.

"Cygnus X-1" and "Hemispheres" (side 1 of the album) have my votes as the best things Rush has ever done. (dave q is not exaggerating about the former. I am a little surprised by the acclaim for Farewell to Kings as an album though. Aside from "Cygnus X-1" it seems like their far-and-away most conventional album from that period, basically like a late Led Zeppelin album with more intricate playing and without as many songs about girls. The songs are generally solid though I usually need to skip the solo in "Cinderella Man" and "Madrigal" is fairly disposable.) 2112 has my enthusiastic vote as their best album. I even find the songs on side 2 really satisfying.

It's been a couple of years since I've heard Moving Pictures but I have a feeling I wouldn't be too big on it. I can accept the 3 big hits as classic mainstream AOR singles but "YYZ" is even more nauseating than "La Villa Strangiato." I guess I'm more into the older hard rock/power-metal or proggy stuff.

p.s. Dominique: Grace Under Pressure is AT LEAST a *1/2... :)

That's sorta what I suspected. I think I feel pretty much the same way about them.

The fruit-rock production of Permanent Waves and Moving Pictures does rub me the wrong way a bit (though not quite as much as the fruit-rock music) but I think I like the sound of all the albums earlier than that. The writing, music-wise, doesn't seem flimsier to me than that of other comparable bands (seems way stronger than Jethro Tull, for example) nor does the sound seem that much smaller. Is Zenyatta Mondatta a Police album?

I was referring to "Tarkus", not Rush. Incidentally, I think the Emerson-composed parts of "Tarkus" kick ass. The Lake-composed parts...eh. But then, that's usually the case with all of ELP, Emerson picking up Lake's slack.

I don't know how long I want to defend Peart as a lyricist but I will say:

a) Given the norms of prog-rock and power-metal I scarcely think him worse than others of the genres. His lyrics do at least seem thought- out compared to many Zeppelin and Sabbath lyrics. I find the lyrical narratives of his epics more cohesive (and more amusing) than Pink Floyd's and they actually seem welded to the musical narratives. Unlike some of Peter Gabriel's and Kate Bush's (who never get as much of a rough ride), his lyrics usually flow well when sung. His utter geekiness, combined with Lee's king-of-the-medieval-elves wail, was suited to the composition of sci-fi/fantasy rock operas, I thought. I could see it being a problem for song-oriented AOR, which is one reason why I hold the opposite view about where Rush's strengths lay, though not my primary reason. I also think your comment about them throwing in random complicated bits actually applies more to the song- oriented stuff than to the epic prog stuff. (You did give the highest rating to their proggiest record though.)

b) Do you feel no warmth in your heart for a man who writes a Randian allegory about maple trees forming a labour union?

c) If I listened to the Police I wouldn't talk.

Led Zeppelin is thicker sounding than 2112 or Caress of Steel but it's a relative non-issue for me. Maybe I've just listened to too many shitty 4-track demos.

Brief overview:

1) ELP (debut s/t album): Ardent detractors' most accepted album by them. I like "Three Fates" and "Tank" has enjoyably cheezy clavinet lines in beginning and dinky moog freakout at end.

2) Tarkus- You've already heard that one.

3) Pictures at an Exhibition- Sucks pretty bad, but makes a good historical curiosity. Bonus points for entertainment value of reading credits like "Mussourgsky & Palmer"...

4) Trilogy- They bounce back a bit; probably their most consistent album overall. Lots of endless moog soloing on title track.

5) Brain Salad Surgery- Considered by general population to be their best work; fans consider it overrated. "Tocatta" and "Karn Evil 9 2nd Impression" both kick ass, though.

6) Works I- Double album. Listened to it a long time ago, can't remember too much about it, except it was self-indulgent; generally not well-accepted.

7) Works II- Ditto, probably less well-accepted than I.

8) Love Beach- Worth it for the cover alone and for "Taste of My Love", which still remains the greatest pop song EVER.

This is exactly what I wanted to hear today. 'A Time and a Place' is currently blowing my mind.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/randomsandwich/2658909657/

OMG.

That's incredible. I always had an affection for this album cover - I bought the 180 gram vinyl and framed it in college because it captured the ridiculousness and the awesomeness of prog rock so well. I can't believe how much flak this album takes - yes, the first track is over 20 minutes long, but what is it really? 3 pop songs linked with good instrumental jams, that's what! Tales from Topographic Oceans this is not!