One man and a guitar

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(Or woman obviously.) Can it still make the grade or should we just move on with this new fangled electricity synthesisers that are all the rage?

Billy Dods, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

And is anyone doing anything new or is it just a refinement of what's gone on before?

Billy Dods, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Of course it can. There's a certain preciousness about a lot of singer-songwriters (probably born out of the lack of a group editing scenario and a defense mechanism against the vulnerability of the set- up) which turns me off though. And I don't think an unaccompanied guitar is the most attractive-sounding instrument either.

Tom, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Answer to the second question - an individual perspective, well expressed, counts as "something new".

Tom, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I thought this was a thread about Christian Fennesz.

Mark, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

it might as well be. there we go: question answered!

jess, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I daresay that a majority of people who = just themselves and a guitar would like, *ideally*, to be more than just themselves and a guitar. I daresay that the actual records (rather than solo perfs) of 'singer-songwriter' types would support this view.

So the 1+gtr format is really about necessity more than choice; which isn't to say it might not offer certain possibilities and pleasures that other formats don't.

But why do people, with no other option, play 1+gtr at all? The most interesting reason, from my POV, is: they have songs that they want to play and sing, and there's no immediate alternative way for them to do it. So the question becomes: are the songs any good? Or - can the songs work in this format? Or even - do they gain something from this format?

I think that some songs do; but not all. I suppose the reason that I don't like tons of 1+gtr people is that I don't rate most songwriters that highly.

the pinefox, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

People who need loads of gear to create something might still be 'musicians', but they're also pathetic.

dave q, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Yes indeed, they should stick with crystal meth.

Tom, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Do violins and tubas and xylophones and things count as loads of gear?

dleone, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

If it's Spiritualized, then 'yes'.

dave q, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Surprised by pf's statement that it's of necessity rather than choice. In what way? Is it financial i.e still prob one of the cheapest ways for someone to produce music or is it ego driven i.e need to be in control and/or unwillingness to compromise with other individuals (no splitting up through musical differences) or in some cases an inability/fear of working with with other people?

Billy Dods, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

>>> (no splitting up through musical differences)

BUT of course this means that when the time comes you have to split up WITHIN YOURSELF, uh-oh! singersongwriter format as recipe for CRAZYNESS.

I guess I mean very practical factors, Dodsy - not elaborate choices. Many people who write songs just don't have orchestras at their command.

the pinefox, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I don't much like singer-songwriters who perform solo. There's too much 'me' and too little tension between instruments and people. Too much focus on lyrics results which is bad.

I DO like minimalism and making the most of few resources. That's different.

Dr. C, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Well if we're talking about one man and a guitar, then there's only one who makes the grade - my great personal friend Derek Bailey. He IS the future.

Evan Parker, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I am glad to see EP has settled his differences w/DB, but he forgot to mention another close chum of Mr. Keiji Haino. Or Hans Reichel. Or Keith Rowe. Or Fred Frith. Or Eugene Chadbourne. Etc. Etc. I still think the guitar has plenty of possibilities left in it - it's all down to the players, now (plus audiences who won't settle for the same old same old, of course...)

Andrew L, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I'm not sure if the alternative implied in the question is one person and a synth, or one person plus other other people. The responses to the question so far seem to reflect the latter.

In any case, surely the challenge of the one+guitar format to the performer, & when it works the attraction to the listener, is that the focus is concentrated on the *song*: without lead guitar, electronic wizardry, rhythm section or whatever to distract attention or cover up any deficiencies. If the songwriter is proficient at their craft the format will be successful.

Maybe Tom's problems with the sound of an unaccompanied guitar stem as much from poorly constructed material (in an almost naked state) as the genre itself.

David, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

So much has been done already on the guitar, that I think one's approach has to be fairly extraordinary (not technically so, just innovative and/or interesting) in order to excite me (and probably lots of other people) very much at all.

My cranky advice: Stop learning goddamn chords on your goddamn acoustic guitar. Stop taking lessons, and cancel your subscription to Guitar World. Immerse yourself in non-guitar music for a while, then come back to the guitar and treat it like a new instrument, one you've never played before. Take off the two lowest strings and end your reliance on power chords. Each time you find yourself strumming a faux-"funky" syncopated barre-chord pattern, kick yourself in the ass, hard. And lay off the distortion pedal for a while. No Nirvana. No Zep. No Hendrix. (You'll never sound like him anyway, so just give it up.)

Clarke B., Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

The problem with David's argument is that there's no reason one man on a Casio keyboard should be any less a naked presentation of *the song* than one man on a guitar, surely?

Tom, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Tom is right.

However I can't think of a solo perfomer+Casio that I would like to listen to.

The other flaw in my post was going away to do the washing up after a few score people between the beginning & the end of it.

David, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I don't know if it works so good on headphones, but given a 50- capacity room and all other things being equal I think I'd take the good singer with the nice guitar playing over the MIDI genius any day. Unless I wanted to dance. linking to my apropos Listening Chamber selection... now.

Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I think the problem is that one person is suddenly meant to cover all of the necessary parts of the song with only two tools to do it, which is obviously a bit limiting -- unless you're able to write in really idiosyncratic ways, you're going to feel a lot of pressure to just play the song's basic chord pattern and, well, sing. Whereas, given extra instrumentation, the same song suddenly has a lot more opportunities to be interesting: interesting arrangement, interesting dynamics, interesting instrumentation, etc. There are more variables to work with. Playing solo, even just having someone clap on beat frees you from providing the rhythm, and literally opens up whole new worlds of options.

Think of it in terms of the most basic conventions of music: rhythm, harmony, melody. You want rhythm, so you play these standard rhythmic guitar patterns with your right hand. You want harmony, so you play these standard harmonic guitar chords with your left. You sing the melody. You don't have body parts left to add anything fascinating to that. In order to pull it off, you have to be good not just in the writing and the presentation of your songs, but your very ability to conceive of them, based on a completely different way of offering up the "necessary" elements of the pop song. And let's face it: not a lot of people are able to dig down and reconceptualize the basic structures of music, and even fewer are able to do it in a way that's accessible or fun to listen to.

And the Pinefox is completely correct: most of the solo performers you see are non-famous, and many of them are performing solo simply because they don't happen to have met anyone else who plays an instrument and is interested in working on anything. Finding other people for musical projects is a bit difficult, you know -- not only do they have to be decent enough to spend time around, they have to play particular instruments, play them well, be interested in playing roughly the same stuff you're interested in, be available at the right times of day, etc. ... It's not exactly easy.

Nitsuh, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

are they allowed to have lots of pedals and suchlike? i've seen some impressive sounds come out of one man and his guitar put through various effects boxes...

electric sound of jim, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Note: my favorite solo-guitar performer since certain Cat Power tracks is a guy I knew in college who now plays under the name The Intelligibles. He used to do Baileyish stuff, but is now much closer to pop / grotty low-fi bedroom-indie conventions. Weirdly proving that it's not quite as much of a feat to make solo guitar-and- voice stuff work as I might have made it sound above.

Oh, wait, he's not my favorite -- that Richard Youngs record about the dog is.

Nitsuh, Wednesday, 12 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

one man + a guitar = giving yourself sonic limitations can hone your sense of trad. melody writing [tho whistling works bttr for me]

often go back to guitar between recording lots of synth/sample stuff to get away from ^textures^

i like playing acoustic for myself but i can't bear listening to others do it.

, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Note for younger readers: throughout the 1970s, the Melody Maker used to read exactly like this.

Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Nitsuh is correct re. practicalities.

He is also correct re. limitations. But so is Mr Moore, who also points out that 'The Material' becomes crucial once such limitations are imposed.

(NB: they only feel like limitations if you're coming from the direction of having Lots Of Other Stuff Going On. If you're coming from the direction of Not Being Able To Play Guitar, then suddenly adding a gtr to your singing is a VAST EXPANSION OF SONIC POTENTIAL. Seriously.)

Clarke B's list is presumably not meant very seriously - but still:

>>> Take off the two lowest strings and end your reliance on power chords. Each time you find yourself strumming a faux-"funky" syncopated barre-chord pattern, kick yourself in the ass, hard. And lay off the distortion pedal for a while. No Nirvana. No Zep. No Hendrix. (You'll never sound like him anyway, so just give it up.)

I don't get it. What acoustic performers rely on power chords? Or have distortion pedals? And who says every guitar player goes for crap funky rhythms? I think I have missed a comic component somewhere.

the pinefox, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Dear Mr Parker Evans,

Fuck off cunt.

Yours sincerely

Derek B

Derek Bailey, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

For further discussion on acoustic players using power chords, see my upcoming Gillian Welch thread.

Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

Hamell on Trial
Mark Mulcahy

All I can say is listen...

Dave225, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I'm not sick of guitar part of the one man and his guitar thing. It's the god awful whining that usually accompanies it that bothers me. That and the hushed reverence.

N., Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

on saturday i am dressing as santa and busking wiv acoustic in tha toon -nee hushed revirancz thar !!!!

i once busked wiv sax + made money - in lisbon - i dont know how to play sax.

bongos and a dancing puppet = wot turin brakes lack

, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

As far as I can tell, "new fangled electricity synthesisers" are just as played out as one man and a guitar. There's still plenty you can do with either that hasn't ever been recorded. One man and a synthesizer gives you more options, obviously, since you can program them to have a whole backdrop of music to play with. That's sort of an unfair battle, though. At least give the guitarist a beat box or a fat boy with a microphone. Still, I'd like to hear some convincing synthesizer blues, folk, country or jazz. You might need one of those slidey knobs on your synth to squeeze a little more emotion out of it, but I bet you could do something relatively not terrible that would sell almost nothing, most likely.

Nude Spock, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

N, what's wrong with hushed reverence? I want to hear music, not people talking. Some people deserve reverence, and hushedness.

As said before, the greatest test of songs, tunes, melodies, is having them stripped (almost) bare. Sometimes extra instrumentation only hides the fact that THE SONGS ARE RUBBIDGE.

My favourite artiste of the last year records most material using this format. I like it.

Ally C, Thursday, 13 December 2001 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

three years pass...
http://www.artofliferecords.com/al10112.jpg

awesome awesome awesome

charleston charge (chaki), Saturday, 19 February 2005 08:07 (twenty years ago)

i think this is the most beautiful solo guitar album ever
ihttp://www.artofliferecords.com/al10112.jpg ihttp://www.artofliferecords.com/al10112.jpg ihttp://www.artofliferecords.com/al10112.jpg ihttp://www.artofliferecords.com/al10112.jpg

charleston charge (chaki), Saturday, 19 February 2005 08:08 (twenty years ago)

oops

charleston charge (chaki), Saturday, 19 February 2005 08:10 (twenty years ago)

six years pass...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP6Iz6xbC5A&feature=player_embedded

scott seward, Monday, 4 July 2011 02:22 (fourteen years ago)

This guy is great. I love to hear bluegrass-types play solo.

banjoboy, Monday, 4 July 2011 06:36 (fourteen years ago)

What's dope is that he plays this kind of music and also has a BC Rich Warlock sitting behind him.

earlnash, Monday, 4 July 2011 06:43 (fourteen years ago)

haha yessssssssss

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Monday, 4 July 2011 06:44 (fourteen years ago)

http://i.imgur.com/458bk.jpg

i used to have a poster of this painting on my wall in 2006 -- this thread reminded me of that

markers, Monday, 4 July 2011 07:04 (fourteen years ago)


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