Yesterday

I think "Everybody's got something to hide except for me and my monkey" should be considered the greatest pop song ever.

Gage-o: I don't think I understand your point, cos I don't know what your generation is.

I like 'Debaser', but cannot but think 'Yesterday' the greater work.

A thought on 'Yesterday': it's all there in the second line. If that instinctive melodic ascent doesn't do anything for you, you're not going to get much out of the rest of the song. If (like me) you are somewhat awed by it, the song may be important for you.

I'd like to know whether Edna W has poignant memories of hearing it in a broom cupboard in 1974, and feeling genetic race-memories of the Mersey tingle within her young blood.

Also, the lyric to 'Yesterday' seems generic to the point of glibness to me. Perhaps a victim of its own success, it seems almost content- free. Maybe it's too perfect or something like that.

I don't like it very much.

I wouldn't defend the lyric for very long.

I am almost reassured that you don't like the song. We need to differ on these things.

I only really mentioned not liking it because I thought it would reassure you. It reassures me, too.

the competition for top second line STARTS HEAH!

First, in my mind the Beatles' version is quite low-fi, like a demo almost, the guitar & vocal muffled, the strings almost 'harsh' (hence the overbearing element someone mentioned?). But that still doesn't detract from the qenius of the arrangement. The moment when the strings first come in is magnificent (a beat earlier or later? fugeddabahdit). And that 'cello figure in the refrain - lovely.

The melody in the verses is very simple, which is one of its strengths. You imagine that anyone could have written it (patently not true of course). The lyric is a bit weak, especially the "I believe in Yesterday" line (pah! you could've come up with something a bit better than that, Paul!). But who cares about lyrics anyway.

As to Macca's singing, it has a naïve, unadorned quality to it which suits the subject very well ('I'm gobsmacked she left me!'). Also, when he does (first or second time round, can't remember) the "why she had to go/ I don't know/ she wouldn't say" bit, I seem to recall there are these minute pauses, delaying the next line slightly. This gets me every time I hear it.

In short it's a very very good song indeed, brilliantly arranged, well-performed.

And it's the Beatles song pre-Sgt Pepper I hate the most. Seriously. Totally overrated.

I'm sure always read that 'Light My Fire' was the most covered ever. 'Yesterday''s record was 'most played on radio ever'

(Of course there are Belle And Sebastian songs that have moved me more than "Yesterday", because I'm me and they're them and it's it - the stripping away of context you talk about Fritz is impossible. How else am I to judge?)

I'm indifferent to this thread's *actual* subject, probably through overexposure.

Still, as impossible as it may be, I do think it is useful in evaluating something so familiar to at least try to imagine as if hearing it for the first time - or in a different context (eg as if hearing it on a B&S record).

Perhaps the lyrics to the song are a bit weak if you analyse them on their own, but I think that the tenderness of "Yesterday" comes from the perfect match between words and melody. "Yesterday" belongs to a special group of songs that McCartney wrote between 1964 and 1966, which are distinguished by a gentle, reflective quality. "Things We Said Today" is the first of these and "For No One" is the best. In all of these songs the delicacy of the form is matched by the intelligence and sincerity of the lyrics.

After 1966, McCartney descended into glibness and pastiche. His later Beatle songs which attempt to be sincere ("Let It Be", "The Long and Winding Road") are overblown and empty. "Yesterday" and its ilk have a quiet modesty to them.

Oh, and Pinefox - "Macca" in 1965, never! That's an affectation of the later years. Quick guide:

"Eleanor Rigby", "Yesterday" = "Paul" "We All Stand Together", "Pipes Of Peace" = "Macca" "My Brave Face", "Young Boy" = "McCartney"

Gage-o, I have no idea what you're trying to say. I'm quite sure that the number of people in any generation who have even heard "Debaser" is a minority. I do think "Yesterday" would win statistically with any demographic. If that's the obvious choice you meant, I agree.

A brief study of hair metal ultimately resulted in my thorough embrace of the cock-rock canon which in turn led to an embrace of the whole concepts of classic rock and canonization in general. I've been listening to Bach too. In the next few months, expect me to rave about the Rolling Stones and Pink Floyd.

Paul McCartney in Mo-Jo, December 2001.

You see, I didn't make it up.

'Try to'.

The fact that McCartney chose to change the title and lyrics suggests, on the contrary, that they are.

btw - this doesn't reflect on the importance of the lyrics in any way. He just called it 'Scrambled Eggs' because it scanned - a way to sort out the phrasing before he wrote a real lyric. Better than just going 'la di da'.

Also, as someone else noted above, this song gets trotted out in serious music circles as an example that, see, there is some good rock music out there, but it really has very little to do with rock and roll. I agree that "For No One" is better overall.

Relative importance of lyrics and music = relative importance of arms and legs, discussion wise.

As an aside, I've never really noticed before how "I've Just Seen A Face" sounds like a Simon and Garfunkel song. Spookily so. Yet it was written in early 1965, whilst S+G didn't really sound like *that* for another year or so. Coincidence? Or perhaps S+G and The Beatles were both listening to the same sources. But who?

Going further off-topic, but what the hell, isn't Ticket To Ride stupendous? That opening blast of sound, that guitar line, that hump- backed rhythm, those lyrics ("I*think* I'm gonna be sad, I *think* it's today yeah"). How much better this is than "I *know* I'm gonna be sad...". Lennon holds a tight line between self-pity and bullish arrogance("she oughta think twice, she oughta do right by me"). It's the best Beatles single. No. The best Beatles SONG.

Now, anyone agree with me that Scritti Politti's "She's A Woman" is the best ever Beatles cover, no questions asked?

the big UK hit version at the time was by Matt Monro, but it's shite