Tracks you liked until you heard the source they were sampled from...

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and then went singnificantly down in your esatimations because you thought either

1. Whats the point? or..
2. what a fuckin rip-off!

this happened to me most recently when i was listening to Moondog's "Bird's Lament" for the first time and now i pretty much hate what Mr Scruff did with it - it's cheap, exploitative and (even though both tracks are pretty "joyous") unltimately quite depressing.

i'm sure some more examples will come to me soon - what are yours?

― jed_ (jed), Sunday, 7 November 2004 20:40 (twenty years ago)

Len's Steal My Sunshine, sampled from Andrea True Connection's More More More.

― derrick (derrick), Sunday, 7 November 2004 20:44 (twenty years ago)

i still like it but my love for Paperclip People's "Steam" went down several notches after i heard The Flying Lizards' "Steam Away".

― jed_ (jed), Sunday, 7 November 2004 21:31 (twenty years ago)

I actually like Steal My Sunshine more than More, More, More. But then More, More, More was never a fave of mine.

― scott seward (scott seward), Sunday, 7 November 2004 21:44 (twenty years ago)

I like it more when a song is as good as the original it is sampling. Lejuan Love & DJ Man's "Jockin' Robin" for instance. Or "Another One Bites The Dust" by Sugar Daddy.

― scott seward (scott seward), Sunday, 7 November 2004 21:48 (twenty years ago)

Beck's "Jack-Ass" is nowhere near as good as Van Morrison (with Them) doing It's All Over Now Baby Blue.

― Hurting (Hurting), Sunday, 7 November 2004 21:51 (twenty years ago)

wasn't Andrea True a transexual? or a porn star? or a transexual porn star? I'm gonna wait until late 90s nostalgia hits -- due in a couple years -- before I listen to "Steal My Sunshine" again.

― lovebug starski (lovebug starski), Sunday, 7 November 2004 21:52 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, she was a porn star.

― Rickey Wright (Rrrickey), Sunday, 7 November 2004 23:30 (twenty years ago)

"Beck's "Jack-Ass" is nowhere near as good as Van Morrison (with Them) doing It's All Over Now Baby Blue."

I actually prefer The Chocolate Watchband's cover of Them's cover of "It's All Over Now, Baby Blue".

― scott seward (scott seward), Monday, 8 November 2004 00:16 (twenty years ago)

LTJ Bukem's "Inner Guidance", which samples Nick Ingman's library-lounge-jazz instrumental "Throng".

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Monday, 8 November 2004 00:19 (twenty years ago)

Also the Beastie Boys' "So Whatcha Want" (Southside Movement's '75 version of "I've Been Watching You")

I still like "Jack-Ass" even after hearing the holy-shit version of "It's All Over Now Baby Blue", but the Them Again sample I think he was really unable to improve on in retrospect was "I Can Only Give You Everything" for "Devil's Haircut"; that guitar sample sounds kind of oafish now (though all the other weird percussive bits and the harmonica are still great).

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Monday, 8 November 2004 00:22 (twenty years ago)

None. If I like a track, I like it, period. Doesn't matter where a sample was taken from - as far as I'm concerned, it's a case of turning chicken shit into chicken soup. And it doesn't change my opinion about the original either - I still hate everything about Spandau Ballet's "True", just as I did before P.M. Dawn turned it into a moderately enjoyable track. (I said "moderately.")

― Myonga Von Bontee (Myonga Von Bontee), Monday, 8 November 2004 06:37 (twenty years ago)

I liked "U can't touch this" MC HAmmer, until I heared the Rick James track.

Then I thought..
1. Whats the point? ..
2. what a fuckin rip-off!

― mark grout (mark grout), Monday, 8 November 2004 10:37 (twenty years ago)

They're both great.

― Chewshabadoo (Chewshabadoo), Monday, 8 November 2004 15:51 (twenty years ago)

sampling is bad it is not true and authentic only people who don't learn real intsruments sample

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Monday, 8 November 2004 16:01 (twenty years ago)

Beasties' "Shadrach" really lost value after hearing Sly's "Loose Booty." not just for me, but for anyone else who wound up hearing the original.

― Beta (abeta), Monday, 8 November 2004 16:25 (twenty years ago)

My estimation of Mulholland Dr. went down a notch after I saw Persona.

― Mike O. (Mike Ouderkirk), Monday, 8 November 2004 18:20 (twenty years ago)

Hearing Leon Haywood's 'I Wanna Do Something Freaky to You' is so incredible, when I found out it wasn't Dre that made it sound so good made me feel...confused. Both are still great tracks, but it makes me think of Dre as knowing good records more than a from scratch producer. If that makes any sense. If you hear the track, you'll know what I mean.

― pher (pher), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 01:16 (twenty years ago)

not just for me, but for anyone else who wound up hearing the original.

WRONG

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 01:58 (twenty years ago)

HARDER BETTER FASTER STRONGER.
i still like this track quite a bit, but my dp love dropped precipitously when I heard the Birdsong original.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 02:50 (twenty years ago)

I was going to start a thread about "tracks you liked even more after hearing the source" and mention that Birdsong track because it's actually kind of a sloppily-executed track and Daft Punk makes it sparkle with robomagic

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 03:01 (twenty years ago)

(see also: George Duke's "I Love You More")

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 03:01 (twenty years ago)

only on ILM!

― jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 03:43 (twenty years ago)

Obviously, I totally disagree.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 03:54 (twenty years ago)

"Sloppily produced"? It's the SAME FUCKIN' SONG with a vocoder and a paint job.
Not that there's anything wrong with that necessarily but don't dis on Edwin.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 03:56 (twenty years ago)

you are correct.

― jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:22 (twenty years ago)

Well the Edwin track seems to drag in comparison; I think Daft Punk upped the tempo just a bit and basically made it bounce and strut harder. In typical Patrin terms:

"Coke Bottle Baby"
http://www.vrelegume.co.yu/slike/101/klasika/m6.jpg

"Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger"
http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclecars/plymouth-superbird/images/plymouth-superbird-1a.jpg

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:27 (twenty years ago)

yeah i don't think either of them are particularly good really.

― jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:31 (twenty years ago)

I think both of them are great (maybe just maybe "sloppy" = its own charm, wha?), it's just that, you know. It's nice to have big fucking airfoils sometimes.

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:33 (twenty years ago)

"Bittersweet Symphony" has to be the worst example of this (although I never really liked his lyrics/singing, I loved the strings/melody.) Someone had told me that it was just a faint bit of the melody they borrowed, but when you hear the Oldham Orchestra original, it's like fuck they just looped the whole damn thing!

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:34 (twenty years ago)

yeah what's with all the people saying it's not even the original track its just a section of a cover when its just the whole fuckin thing with singing. 100% royalties the stones was robbed.

― jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:44 (twenty years ago)

really though why do people lie about these things?

― jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:45 (twenty years ago)

Maybe it's me, but that green car just looks ugly.
In any case, even tho' I'm aware that these guys lift their source tracks from elsewhere; the sheer CHUTZPAH of the total steal of this song is so overwhelming that it really turned me off to DP.
That and that amazingly lousy remix album.
I'll be back on the bandwagon with one solid cut.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:49 (twenty years ago)

One 8-second section looped for a bit before getting chopped around, dropped out, dropped in, benihana'd and vocoder-as-Eddie-VH-solo'd over = "total steal"? Maybe in a "huge fucking bargain" sense.

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:52 (twenty years ago)

the intro alone! Jeez.

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:53 (twenty years ago)

You neglect to note that Edwin's track ALSO loops this section throughout.
I can respect your love for HBFS, I'm saying that I felt like this was THEIR song and now I really don't.

NOT 1. what's the fucking point?
but DEFINITELY 2. what a fuckin rip off.
Only her hairdresser knows for sure.
I don't hear much difference at all.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 04:57 (twenty years ago)

Do you even know how sampling works?

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:01 (twenty years ago)

Or why groups sample? To recontextualize obscurities, emphasize and potentially improve on a specific segment of music, that kind of shit?

Listen to the full version of "Cola Bottle Baby" and pay attention to what he does once it's time to break from the groove -- a subtle transition into the pseudo-chorus (with that "fizzfizzfizzfizzfizz" descending riff), some okayish guitarism, and how it's mostly a diversion from the main groove -- which, unlike Daft Punk's take, eventually wears out its welcome.

Now listen to the entire second half of "HBFS".

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:06 (twenty years ago)

You can find out more at your local library.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:06 (twenty years ago)

(New thread: "tracks you liked until you got into a stupid argument about plagiarism on ILM")

xp Oh man that was so Momus

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:07 (twenty years ago)

(low blow, sorry)

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:09 (twenty years ago)

I'm gonna wait until late 90s nostalgia hits -- due in a couple years -- before I listen to "Steal My Sunshine" again.

Have you avoided VH1 for the past couple months?

― djdee2005 (djdee2005), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:12 (twenty years ago)

Dude, I'm listening to Birdsong RIGHT NOW and phiss phizz is MUCHO appealing.

unlike Daft Punk's take, eventually wears out its welcome.= I think this apple should taste more like an orange.

I have also heard of this "sampling" you speak of.

I'm just getting snippy now, sorry bout that.

My point: HBFS was my FAVORITE DP song and discovering that what I loved MOST about it (close tie with the pitchshifted wurlitzer spin of "our work is never over" near the end of the track) was pretty much taken WHOLE from another VASTLY underappreciated artist. It's like I found that Prince lifted the guitar riff at the start of When Doves Cry from some unknown blues cat. It would make me feel a little less drawn to the song AND the artist.

You might see that as being naive or disingenous; in this case, I don't.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:15 (twenty years ago)

It's weird 'cause it's almost the same case with me and I am a total dork for weird late '70s discofunk but upon hearing the Birdsong track I thought "oh, neat" and didn't have my entire worldview shattered into tiny tiny bits.

Maybe I just don't think sampling a really good hook instead of writing it yourself is a total dealbreaker.

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:20 (twenty years ago)

Not quite my entire worldview. just my DP love.
I think if it had just been the bass or just been the drums or just one element, but it just irks me that when I play cola bottle for people they go, "Hey Daft Punk!"
Strangely enough, I'm totally NOT a 70's discofunk dork and totally AM all about sampling a really good hook.
Maybe our worldviews were switched at birth.
I think I have a DNA helix to exchange with you MC T...

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:25 (twenty years ago)

no way man, you think the Superbird is ugly

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:29 (twenty years ago)

Anyways, can we agree that "Digital Love" >>>>>>>>>>>>> "I Love You More"?

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:30 (twenty years ago)

the "you can get it!" part is lifted too though right? not sampled but copied?

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:30 (twenty years ago)

i think i had a point to make about this but i can't do it without singing you various bits of each song in person.

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:31 (twenty years ago)

MC T: Yeah, I agree with you on that one.
The George Duke has its own appeal but that really IS apples and oranges.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:49 (twenty years ago)

OK, I'm going to bed before I suddenly decide I want to ramble on about how great Elastica's "Connection" really is

― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 05:52 (twenty years ago)

"Crazy in Love", except I'd already heard "Are You My Woman?", so I never caught the fever for it in the first place.

― Begs2Differ (Begs2Differ), Tuesday, 9 November 2004 06:13 (twenty years ago)

one year passes...

"Steal My Sunshine" is like 5,000 times better than "More More More." The part Len took is like the only good part of that song, though it is a really really good part.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 30 November 2005 22:09 (nineteen years ago)

nahhh the chorus of "More More More" is great! there is some cheese in the verses and they overdo it on those trumpets, but still.

― Renard, Wednesday, 30 November 2005 23:53 (nineteen years ago)

"Steal My Sunshine" and "More More More" are both in my all-time top 100. Brilliant sample choice from an equally brilliant source track.

― The Good Dr. Bill (The Good Dr. Bill), Wednesday, 30 November 2005 23:57 (nineteen years ago)

"Call On Me" is a good enough song, but the great thing about the source ("Valerie") is how the melody builds up to the "call on meeeee/call on me/call on meeeeee" part. "Call On Me" is all payoff and no build-up, which kinda sucks.

However, I'm not able to do a 360 on a song, even after hearing its vastly-superior sample source, but in comparison it becomes even more repetitive then when I first heard it.

On another note, is there a thread about songs you didn't like until you heard them sampled by someone else? I used to just really like "Upside Down," but then I heard a song that sampled it and now my respect for the song went up 1000%.

― musically (musically), Thursday, 1 December 2005 00:33 (nineteen years ago)

That Hooverphonic hit is kinda catchy until you realize that it's Hot Buttered Soul with dumber lyrics.

― js (honestengine), Thursday, 1 December 2005 01:03 (nineteen years ago)

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