rank the kinks' 4 "great" albums

1 something else
2 village green pres socy
3 face to face
4 arthur

vgps is probably a more consistent album than something else, but something else overwhelms on the strength of its blockbuster songs ("waterloo sunset," "david watts," "lazy old sun," "no return," "love me till the sun shines," "two sisters," "harry rag," jesus christ i think i'm about to name the whole album, maybe vgps isn't really more consistent, it just sounds that way) ... face to face is the toughest sounding album they've ever made and has some moments of real beauty too ("rosie won't you please come home" is a fave album cut of that era for me) ... arthur has some huge moments but drags in places.

there is some consensus, though, that these four kinks albums
but c'mon, Lola and Muswell Hillbillies > Face to Face and at least = Arthur
Consensus be damned!!

not quite, though. the lost kinks album of that period was four more respected gentlemen, which was never released, but about half of which showed up on vgps. so there's not an entire missing album there. the album that was released a few years later under the title the great lost kinks album compiles recordings from both before and after that period. and is an amazing album, as well as the missing four more respected gentlemen stuff, plus some stuff that was originally intended for an also-unreleased dave davies solo album.

the album that was released a few years later under the title the great lost kinks album compiles recordings from both before and after that period, as well as the missing four more respected gentlemen stuff, plus some stuff that was originally intended for an also-unreleased dave davies solo album. and it's an amazing album.

To be honest, I don't really know 'face to face' that well, though I do have it. Actually these are the only four kinks albums I have. I think you're right about the consensus.

and that IS a stellar album. it's just not an album they ever planned to release in 1967 or 1968, but rather a compilation of miscellaneous tracks from roughly that period, released in the early '70s. that's all i was trying to say.

I've always preferred Face to Face to Something Else. So far it's just Yancey-pants and I against the world.

Also, can anyone tell me why none of these records are available on the iTunes store but they have 20 other ones?

Village Green
Face To Face
Arthur
Something Else

Some of my favorite songs are those bonus tracks so hell if I know if I'm judging the full-length itself.

Early Stones' is a mess I don't bother wading into. I have a couple greatest hits collections on tape (High Tide and Green Grass and Through the Past, Darkly), some weird things on vinyl (a Russian copy of some comp called "Sing This All Together" for ex.). Which is fine, cuz I really don't give much of a shit about their stuff up until "Let it Bleed".

The Kinks tho... they were a big headache, tracking down all the random singles, proper albums, etc.

Shagnri-La's a masterpiece.

I can't believe that, for example, "Berkley Mews" was left off the Castle CD of Lola, and now it's on that 3 CD thing. I love that album so much but I really don't feel like I should have to buy that bloated thing.

Revolver is better than Pep. F2F is better than Something Else. Upon further review, there is not incontrivertable evidence which would overturn the call on the field. The call stands, and Tim Ellison is charged with his first time out.

Kind of. It was supposed to collect every single A & B from 60's London period, but on the last disc they cheat and add stuff not from the London period rather than compress the stuff that were b-sides or rarities from that time frame. It's basically just a scam to ensure that you STILL have to buy Flowers.

"WHO CARES IF YOU'RE JEWISH AND YOUR BREATH SMELLS OF GARLIC"

Just curious as to whether you could imagine those songs having been done for Revolver and whether you would like them more then.

So little love for Face to Face - can't stop playing it at the moment; all sorts of things - the sadness of Too Much on my Mind, the rage of House in the Country, the precise dissection of class and its injuries there and in Most Exclusive Residence, Sunny Afternoon, Waikiki, Rosy..... and that thing he does in Sessionman where he breaks diphtongs up 'mus-ish-ee- an' 'chord pro-gresh-ee- an' on which Liam Gallagher launched a career....

Face to Face is amazing. Rosie is prob my favourite Kinks song.

Oh, and 'Mr. David Davies' costumes by Gail of Blackburn' is superb

I prefer "Something Else". Then it's "Village Green" and "Face To Face". Ahead of "Arthur" which is still great. The two 1965 ones are also quite nice, while their 70s output is generally much weaker.

I think I like "Something Else" - if that's the one with Apeman on it.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ea/The_kinks_lola_versus_powerman_album.jpg

for me:

ftf-vgps-se-a

all terrific.

"Apeman" is on the one that represented the beginning of the end. By the time of "Lola Vs. Powerman & The Moneygoround", The Kinks were starting to develop a more "American" and "rock" oriented style, which didn't fit them much.

They signed to RCA, had one hit single immediately, then vanished, chartwise.

Did any othere act from the sixties, that had considerable chart success, disappear so completely while still making albums/singles as before?

I guess they were having big US success, but still...

and Ray's lyrics veered ever more towards the obviously prosaic (title track notwithstanding, natch).

xp

Despite calling myself a fan and regularly defending them in pub arguments about underrated bands of the 60s etc, it shames me to admit I only own
Village Green and a 2-CD best-of comp.

With the above facts in mind, I'm thinking of investing in this. Good call? Or should I cherry-pick a choice selection of albums?

Ten albums, forty quid...

I saw an ad on some other for this set, £25. So I went for it, even though it had a long lead time. Of course, closer to the release date, they said it was 'unobtainable'...

I've seen it around ont' web for £35 but ...

Not a good buy I reckon. You lose the bonus tracks from the re-releases, most of which are available for a fiver or less. Actually FOPP had them for £3 the other day.

Re : cherry-picking. Get the 4 'greats' then Kinda Kinks>Kontroversy>debut>Powerman (all great btw)

these four "greats", though - who decided this? ilm? damon albarn? uncut readers? or 35-odd years of precedent?

Well these 4 probably are the best, most people would say. I rarely agree with that sort of canonization, but in this case I think I do. What I *don't* agree with is any kind of talk that the first 2 albums are crap, which lots of people seem to think.

oh hey look i was otm 3 years ago. well, i might not go so far as to say Lola & Muswell are better than F2F, but imho they stand tall as any on this "great" list.

it does get real spotty after that...

college = hits from the bong and listening & playing along with Lola v PM & MGR

kontoversy killed it as well.

waht about Misfits?? I constantly see the vinyl for fairly cheap but haven't ventured there yet. i recognize nary a title on it, but still v curious

How have I managed to get this far in life without ever listening to VGPS?

Of the other 3 I'd go Arthur>Something Else>F2F

I think Kink Kontroversy's a bit underrated here. xpost!

Looking at all the Beatles talk above, it occurs to me how appallingly served by theire record company the Kinks were - when i was growing up, just after the fact (early 70s) the Beatles canon was already established; jolly pop up to 'for sale', getting 'important' by Rubber Soul, essential thereafter and Pepper was the best thing evah. Similarly with the Stones; everything from BB onwards was 'classic'. This was a time, remember, before Q and Uncut and when stuff got forgotten quickly - it was damn hard to find a copy of Trout Mask or Forever changes even 5 years later. Nevertheless, Beatles and Stones and the Who to a lesser extent, were already embedded in the history that was only beginning to be written.

In contrast, the only Kinks records you saw were those Marble Arch/ MFP comps, endless repackaging of the singles and random LP tracks. I don't recall ever seeing a copy of any of the big 4 (I agree with this as the golden run - Muswell Hillbillies and Lola are good, and the first three are cool too, but these are the ones you need to know) unitl much later. To my mind, they are, unarguably, the best British group of the 60s, and these 4 records epitomise the period, while being completely different- and in a different league - from most of what was around them - much the way Chuck Berry does in relation to 50s Rn'R

To my mind, they are, unarguably, the best British group of the 60s,

Agreed.

Also, yes Pye were a pretty clueless recd company - who else did they have in the mid-60s, The Searchers, Sandie Shaw, who else? Anyway a pretty parochial affair.
It didn't help that The Kinks couldn't tour the USA between 65-9 either, hence left out of the Brit-invasion frenzy and its knock-on effects in the home market.

Pye never really got to grips with the concept of "albums."

http://www.beefheart.com/datharp/albums/official/pics/yellowbrick_pyelabel67.jpg

I got this off E-bay, advertised as "totally trashed, OK for completeists" for £2, but you know what, it's nothing of the sort. Yeah, played a bit, obviously, but it's now in the kids record play box. They are good with stuff though.

Anyway, back to the kinks...

They signed to RCA, had one hit single immediately, then vanished, chartwise.

They managed a UK comeback with "Come Dancing" and "Don't Forget To Dance" in 1983. Typically, they were then sounding more English again, playing down the American "rock" sound of their 70s output.

The statement about them being the best British pop group of the 60s, surely they were great, really great in fact. But that position is occupied and will always remain occupied. And claiming otherwise is just pathetic revisionism or contrarianism for contrarianism's own sake.

And The Beatles' patchy solo output of the 70s and 80s is way better than anything The Kinks released in the 70s and 80s too.

I've got that pye box set.

Rationally Dr. C is right that the re-releases with bonus tracks is better value, but i love it as an artifact with international CD replicas of the albums.

I would still love a re-release of "Face To Face" and "Something Else" that includes the stereo versions.

(I have a Japanese stereo edition of "Something Else", but haven't managed to find "Face To Face" in stereo although I know stereo mixes exist of most of the tracks and were once released on vinyl"

Just re- reading what Marcus had to say about Davies in Mystery Train:
'He truly didn't like it here, wherever 'here' happened to be. For a long time, Davies was genuinely only at home in his fantasies of a simpler day, where class lines were clear, where everyone knew everyone else and everyone elses place; when presumably, there was a place even for Davies'

And goes onto talk about 'dull pleas for the preservation of Village Greens'

The first sentence is bang on - the rest completely wrong, I think. Ray Davies was not deceived about the past; and the hatred for the vacant upper class prick with his House in the Country and for the forces which take Rosy away from home is clear - nor is Sunny Afternoon compassionate in any real way. Ray hates that England - what sets him apart is his completely clear eyed understanding that the new one had every chance of being much worse; the same public school flotsam would run 'swinging' London, the same vacant heiresses would waft through the 'counter' culture. The moral force in Davies' songs comes from his understanding of the hydra- headed resilience of the enemy and his refusal to be deceived even by the forces that made his career possible. Marcus is right to see 'I'm Not Like Anybody Else' as key - but wrong to think he settles -ever - for a fogey-ish ressentiment. The nearest thing to reconciliation in his work is that of the observer, unable to be happy, but able to see the happiness of others as a (provisional) validation of the world - the 'I' in Waterloo Sunset or 'See My Friends'

Xpost. Come Dancing was tied for their highest Billboard chart position in the US (with Tired of Waiting for You).

Given how much I heard it growing up, I had thought that Destroyer was a bigger hit than it was. Apparently just got played a lot on the NY Classic Rock radio station that I listened to.

Anyway:

Arthur
Face To Face
Village Green
Something Else

Xpost. Come Dancing was tied for their highest Billboard chart position in the US (with Tired of Waiting for You).

I know. But that song was a rather sizeable hit in the UK too. Actually their first Top 20 hit since "Supersonic Rocket Ship" in 1972.

What a difference two years makes. Anyway, ranking of their 4 "great" albums is:

Preservation Act 1
Soap Opera
Schoolboys In Disgrace
Preservation Act 2

...but they're all fucking amazing.

The Kinks Pye Albums Box Set (10 CDs) : POLL had the result as:

The Kinks Are the Village Green Preservation Society (Pye 12 track version, 1968) 12
Something Else by The Kinks (Pye, 1967) 7
Arthur (Or the Decline and Fall of the British Empire) (Pye, 1969) 4
Live at Kelvin Hall (Pye, 1968) 1

(nothing else got votes)