Pet Theory II:

Message Bookmarked

Bookmark Removed

Pet Theory II: The Twin Pillars Have you ever noticed that whenever a new style of music become The Next Big Thing, the movement always has two main musical acts that, though they sound similar enough to be recognizably the same sub-sub-sub-genre, all their other traits are in opposition. If one act is clean cut, the other will be scruffy; if one is futuristic/experimental/artsy, the other will be old-fashioned/revivalist/proletarian. The traits shuffle with each musical upheaval, but they continue to be opposed in the "other pillar."
Beatles vs Stones: one a clean shaven popsters, the other are scruffy bloozshounds.
Sex Pistols vs Clash: goofy misanthropic nihilists with a krautrock tinge vs serious friendly positivists with a reggae twist. Nirvana vs Pearl Jam: Scruffy, obtuse and spiteful vs well groomed, straight-forward and 'emo'-friendly.

― Lord Custos, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

if one is futuristic/experimental/artsy, the other will be old-fashioned/revivalist/proletarian

New Order and Depeche Mode! Wait, that doesn't work.

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

This is very interesting! The philosopher of art Arthur Danto talks about a 'style matrix' which describes the way styles are differentiated from other styles. One way this can happen is that an artist can identify some stylistic feature of a past style, and then do everything else the same except that. Maybe this twin pillars thing fits in well here: the two different ways of doing something different, which are still otherwise similar, act as a way of marking out more clearly how the style is different from a previous one. Maybe by indicating that variation within the style is possible, so that it's not just some freak one-off variant on the old styles.

― Josh, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Mouse on Mars vs Autechre makes me subscribe to this theory. But what about Limp Bizkit and Staind and Linkin Park? On second thought, they exist as yangs to Radiohead's yin.

― dleone, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Not so much yangs as something else.

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Well-groomed? Well-groomed?

― Nitsuh, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

... but why TWO?

― Josh, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I'd be happier with this theory if was worded in such a way as to suggest that audiences tend to erect a dialectic in their minds rather than a dialectic having to exist by law. Also I think this the inter-genre aspect happens only if the genre is currently dominating to such an extent that its position is stable - otherwise you can get the same "pillar" result as a genre is shifting towards a different position eg. Public Enemy vs NWA.

And then there's pillar-effects that seem to have it just so that the generation in question can *have* a pillar-effect (Blur vs Oasis?).

― Tim, Friday, 11 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

...but why Two?

Its a glitch in the human thought process. People instinctively think that their must be opposites. If three equally good bands were to show up simultaneously, I suspect they would randomly ignore one band so they can 'fetishize' the other two.
Humans aren't good with odd numbers.
I personally think that in 1991 it was four bands at the top simultaneously. But most people Thought only Nirvana and Pearl Jam were worthy of that level of acclaim.

― Lord Custos, Saturday, 12 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Corollary: Lemme explain what I mean by divisions.... When the 1991 upheaval was in full swing, everybody I knew picked up "Nevermind" and "Ten" and listened to both intensely. And liked both. But then they picked one (at random) to lionize and slagged off on the other. But they kept listening to...and enjoying...both. Why Why Why do they have the need to create a schism *in themselves.*
Both pillars take the coveted Pillar Positions because most standard ISO issue music drones think they are the BEST OF BREED. Why do people have the uncontrollable urge to create dissent when both bands are *crucial* elements to the musical seachange in question.

― Lord Custos, Saturday, 12 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

To Nitsuh: Well yeah. Compared to Kurt Cobain, Eddie Vedder looked clean cut and respectable.

― Lord Custos, Saturday, 12 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I'd be happier with this theory if was worded in such a way as to suggest that audiences tend to erect a dialectic in their minds rather than a dialectic having to exist by law.
Thats exactly what I'm saying...its in people HEADS that this effect occurs.
Also I think this the inter-genre aspect happens only if the genre is currently dominating to such an extent that its position is stable - otherwise you can get the same "pillar" result as a genre is shifting towards a different position eg. Public Enemy vs NWA.
Actually the genre doesn't have to dominate to activate this effect in someones head. But when a certain Genre rules the airwaves the Pillar effect is much easier to spot.
Granted, manufactured acts lack the key differences, but people still seem to want the Pillar polarization to happen.
N*Stynk vs the Backstreet Bots or Christina Spears vs Britney Aguilera don't make good fodder for psuedo-philosophizing.

― Lord Custos, Saturday, 12 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Why on earth not? I've spent a lot of time pseudo-philosophising on those very schisms!

― Tim, Saturday, 12 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Custos, does this theory account for 2pac/Biggie or Jay-Z/Nas? Many "Twin Pillars" situations in hip hop are actually literal feuds... so does the stylistic/characteristic divide still apply? I noticed that your examples are pinpointing along an evolving lineage, but hip hop or bubblegum pop are Next Big Things that introduce completely new parameters to measure by. Surely the way the populus determines these acts may differ due to new musical climates and cultures at hand (and perhaps this is why the Britney/Christina split doesn't fit in your theory).

― Honda, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

This one I don't buy. How similar _were_ the Pistols and the Clash, really? Though the Nirvana/Pearl Jam comparison is even worse.

― Jack Redelfs, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Britney versus that scruff Christina.

Actually it all makes sense, White Stripes versus the Strokes. er....wait.

― Ronan, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

2Pac: Skinny.
Biggie: Not Skinny.

Sorry, I'm not enough of a Rap afficianto to discern how 2Pac and Biggie Smalls differ muscially. But I'm sure there IS a difference just on how one is the 'East Coast Sound', the other 'the West Coast Sound'; Two different record labels with two different production styles.
If anyone is a rap buff and can codify how these two acts differ, please enlighten a whitebread honky indie kid/classic rawk/country & western/celtic folk/goth freak such as myself.

― Lord Custos, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Who would you say Duran Duran was strapped to?

90's... what about Chili Peppers vs. Faith No More?

― static, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Hmmm. Opposite of Duran Duran...Police?
Duran Duran: Silly Fashion Fops playing goofy disco pop...
Police: Painfully Serious Artistes playing grim reggae punk...

Chili Peppers vs Faith No More? Faith No More didn't really hit big enough to compete directly with Chili Peppers. Some treat Faith No More as one-hit-wonders (for "Epic"), The Chili Peppers were still on Mothers Milk with a TWO hits out ("Knock Me Down" and "Higher Ground") even before BloodSugarSexMagik made them into momentary demigods.

― Lord Custos, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Durannies were set up against fans of some other bunch of 80s chancers. Wasn't The Police, that I'm sure of, but who it was eludes me, rather annoyingly. C'mon, fellow Annie Nightingale Request Show listeners of the early 80s, who was it?

― Jeff W, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

spandau ballet vs duradduraN

― , Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I just noticed this one, right at the top.

New Order and Depeche Mode! Wait, that doesn't work.

Interesting one. But I suspect Erasure might be slightly closer to filling the niche. But then where does New Order fit in?

― Lord Custos, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

This is why I don't really buy the theory, see. ;-)

― Ned Raggett, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.