TS: Hopelandic -vs- Whatever the hell the Cocteau Twins are saying

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I'm gonna go with Cocteau Twins because it's not called "Hopelandic" and every once in a while I make out a word like "clean fish."

poortheatre (poortheatre), Thursday, 10 March 2005 08:54 (twenty years ago)

haha, I was all set to make this exact comparison on the Sigur Ros thread if a couple more people had turned up to complain ...

I'm assuming we're comparing the "language" and the sound of the words -- not the vocalists.

Still, I have to side with the Cocteaus because Liz's uses the same vocal cadence that somebody singing actual words would use. OTOH, Jonsi needs fifteen seconds to sing a three syllable "word".

MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 10 March 2005 09:26 (twenty years ago)

The Twins lyrics *are* actual words though, aren't they, just manglified when sung?

OleM (OleM), Thursday, 10 March 2005 09:45 (twenty years ago)

i remember the surprise and delight when i realized the background vocals in "primitive painters" were actually singing the same lyrics as the lead.

fortunate hazel (f. hazel), Thursday, 10 March 2005 09:47 (twenty years ago)

Cocteaus aren't necesaarily real words - I'm sure Liz said something about making up words for the sound, but I'm prepared to be prooved wrong.

Anyway, much as I love Sigur Ros, the Cocteaus win. I never find myself caring what Jonsi is singing, whilst I have fretted for hours over Liz's lyrics.

Shouldn't we be including that language the guy from Magma made up?

Jeff Cook (Bro_Danielson), Thursday, 10 March 2005 12:20 (twenty years ago)

Cocteaux! No question, no competition!

Ian Riese-Moraine lives in Carolyn's fingers (Eastern Mantra), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:54 (twenty years ago)

Cocteaus for god's sake. Sigur Ros can go fling their instruments in the fjords.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 10 March 2005 20:55 (twenty years ago)

Cocteau lyrics are totally real words -- and you can see the gradual progression of their becoming clearer and clearer from album to album. I think at the beginning she just let herself mangle the words into whatever shapes fit the performance better -- possibly because she didn't really have very developed "lyrics" for anything, and it was easier to just babble around and reshape a couple key phrases, seeing as nobody would really work out what they were anyway.

(I mean, you could make an early Cocteau lyric out of, like, I dunno, "contribute an answer" and "login name": you'd just go "con-n-n-n-treeee, con-n-n-tree bu, n-ansa n-ansa," and then for the chorus start doing the other part.)

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 10 March 2005 21:00 (twenty years ago)

KOBAIAN

the psychedelic warlord, Thursday, 10 March 2005 21:09 (twenty years ago)

Thanks warlord - That's the one

Jeff Cook (Bro_Danielson), Thursday, 10 March 2005 22:48 (twenty years ago)

I love it when somehow I can work out what Liz is singing, so Cocteaus all the way for me. A fan on the cocteautwins.com BBS at one pooint worked out that Mellonella from "Echoes in a Shallow Bay" was her listing a whole string of butterfly names in latin (ie the scientific names). Once you know that you can totally hear it, eg:

Hesperiidae
Papilionidae
Hyblaeoidae
Epiplemidae
Notodontidae
Nemeobiidae
Eupterotidae
Callidulidae

Dioptidae
Lymantriidae
Noctuidae
Endromidae
Oxytenidae
Lycaenidae
Argyresthiidae
Ctenuchidae

Nepticulidae
Hieroxestidae
Symmocidae
Blastobasidae
Heliozelidae
Limacodidae
Agonoxenidae
Compsoctenidae

Neopseustidae
Incurvariidae
Oecophoridae
Stenomidae
Thyrididae
Heliodinidae
Glyphipterigidae
Dudgeoneidae
(x2)

She likes to pick unusual words, and nabisco is spot on about the phrasing.

Trayce (trayce), Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:21 (twenty years ago)

that's awesome.... although I'm never giving up my rendition of "Ivo"

Ping-pong,
Hey Pa,
and I'll,
Gunga-doh!

poortheatre (poortheatre), Thursday, 10 March 2005 23:57 (twenty years ago)

Don't go to this site if you want to maintain a sense of awe and wonderment to Liz's singing!

Leeeter van den Hoogenband (Leee), Friday, 11 March 2005 00:01 (twenty years ago)

haha Ive seen so many bad interps of Liz's singing, I love it :D Even she has said she finds it sweet.

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 00:04 (twenty years ago)

FWIW I always thought "Ivo" went:

ping-pong
peach cloud
pandour
pompadour

or something like that.

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 00:05 (twenty years ago)

people
peach blow
pandow (pronounced: pan-dough)
pompadour

pee lee
pee swee
pe serrrnameee

Christ it really does look stupid when you sit and type it out. hahahahaha

There was one song where I could have sworn I heard the word "tampon".
I think it was on Head Over Heels somewhere.

Bimble... (Bimble...), Friday, 11 March 2005 02:32 (twenty years ago)

There was one song where I could have sworn I heard the word "tampon".

this made me laugh out loud (and not just because i'm immature).

poortheatre (poortheatre), Friday, 11 March 2005 02:38 (twenty years ago)

Oh argh what am I thinking... no no.. the first line of Ivo isnt ping pong or people.. its "Peep-Bo"! I dont know why I know this... but I'm sure thats it...

Oh dear I've spent too long on this in my youth.

They often reuse lyrics as song titles though - there are songs called "Ooze Out and Away Onehow" (which is a line from "My Love Paramour") and suchlike.

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 02:45 (twenty years ago)

I've heard all sorts of weird stuff in her singing: I could swear she's singing about Sinn Fein in one song.

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 02:46 (twenty years ago)

If someone can find and scan the Great Pop Things strip on the Cocteaus, I'd be most grateful.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 11 March 2005 02:48 (twenty years ago)

Ask and ye shall recieve, I already know where it is:

http://www.cocteautwins.com/images/cocteau_comic.jpg

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 02:51 (twenty years ago)

(Credit where tis due, this is on the cocteau's website)

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 02:52 (twenty years ago)

Hooray!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 11 March 2005 03:19 (twenty years ago)

speaking of Great Pop Things, if anyone can ever find a scan of 'Steve Albini feeds his cat' i will be very grateful...

shine headlights on me (electricsound), Friday, 11 March 2005 03:21 (twenty years ago)

I've got the book and it's in that, so I'll see what I can do.

"EAT THIS, PUSSY!"

"YUM!"

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 11 March 2005 03:22 (twenty years ago)

hehehe

shine headlights on me (electricsound), Friday, 11 March 2005 03:25 (twenty years ago)

OK now that one I would love to see.

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 03:26 (twenty years ago)

OK sorry to be all fangirlish about this but I thought this link may prove useful to somoene, I have great respect for Mike Borum as a fan and his lyrics page is pretty damn good:

http://www.etherweave.com/cocteautwins/lyrics/index.html

Trayce (trayce), Friday, 11 March 2005 06:45 (twenty years ago)

"Ooze Out and Away Onehow" (which is a line from "My Love Paramour") and suchlike.

Yes, that is true. The weird thing is that over the years you get to figure this stuff out and you realize that some of the really crazy ass things you THOUGHT she was saying when you heard her in your youth, were in fact EXACTLY what she was saying after all.

It's pretty disorienting when you begin to realize this.

Bimble... (Bimble...), Friday, 11 March 2005 06:58 (twenty years ago)

Oh argh what am I thinking... no no.. the first line of Ivo isnt ping pong or people.. its "Peep-Bo"! I dont know why I know this... but I'm sure thats it...

When it was first performed on a Peel Session, "Ivo" was called "Peep-Bo". "Beatrix" was called "Weesht". Funnily enough, my former Brooklynite lover (who used to call me "Ivo" because she knew another Ian through all her life and she didn't want to relate me to him even though he was the one who sucked...and I'd always refer to her as "my love paramour") for a while called me "weesht" and I'd call her "peep-bo". She wanted Liz Fraser to be her mommy. Obsessed? Nah...

Ian Riese-Moraine is her little weesht. (Eastern Mantra), Sunday, 13 March 2005 00:08 (twenty years ago)


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