Stylus finally gets Fiery Furnaces BB right on their "second look" THANK YOU STYLUS!

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http://www.stylusmagazine.com/feature.php?ID=1557

FINALLY!

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:10 (twenty years ago)

Yes, thank you Stylus!

Johnny Fever (johnny fever), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:31 (twenty years ago)

thanks Stylus, for saying what no one else has yet dared to. Finally, someone has called Blueberry Boat "overrated"

Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:35 (twenty years ago)

listening to kexp now, Oh my God will they ever stop with the false modesty?

Matt F: our songwriting sucks and is boring

Radio host: No! No! you're songs are great!!

Matt F: well, thanks, but we just don't have ideas.

Radio host: What! you have TONS of GREAT IDEAS!

Matt F: Well I'm certainly no musical genius.

Radio host: No, you ARE a MUSICAL GENIUS.

you get the idea.

*precious*

aridextra, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:36 (twenty years ago)

What a load of rubbish.

I know when it comes to criticism, there's a whole tricky game juggling objectivity and subjectivity in one's tone, but this piece just has that awful "look, look, do you see, if I say this is overrated in enough detail, people will slap their foreheads and come to their senses" thing going on. People who love Blueberry Boat won't come to their senses. They have listened to the album at least as often as this guy has and think the things he thinks are lame are not at all lame.

Something like this illustrates what I mean:

Some of the songs are plain lifeless: “Paw-Paw Tree,” “Mason City,” and “Spaniolated” are basically forgettable, and given the length of the album, their inclusion borders either on pure antagonism or careless insult.

I mean, yeah, like if only we could sit the Friedbergers down with a beer and give them a friendly nudge, they'd fess up that this is just why they put those tracks on the album. Criticism like that works if its rhetoric is angry and funny, but this isn't.

What can I say - 'Mason City' is so far from being lifeless to my ears. 'Spaniolated' is one of my favourite tracks too, and I was surprised to read Matthew Perpetua put it down as one of the weaker tracks. It's got this by turns urgent and dazed, dizzy and elegaic feel to it that feels like a totally right diversion at that point in the album.

It's easy, as a fan, to take all the attacks on something one loves very smugly, in a "methinks they do protest too much" way, attributing critics' constant carping to a frustration at just not getting it. I can't deny I do that when it comes to Blueberry Boat. But even if it's not that, I get things out of it that you don't. Your loss, my gain.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:37 (twenty years ago)

Seriously though - I lose objectivity here. Is it my imagination that Blueberry Boat has attracted more "All the critics are so full of it - that album is pretentious, overrated crap" comments than any in recent times?

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:39 (twenty years ago)

It's definitely up there.

miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:41 (twenty years ago)

Though as Stylus put it at #1 I think its cool to have such a fleshed-out differing opinion.

miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:42 (twenty years ago)

no cool haircuts, no ties, no glam guitars, not easy to sing along with. it makes sense. I think the album is great, really. Wake me when Stylus takes it to Arular

Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:42 (twenty years ago)

frankly I'm not satisfied with anybody's review about why its good or bad. They're just there from what I can tell.

miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:43 (twenty years ago)

Fwiw, I never did like Blueberry Boat, so I'm just happy to feel vindicated.

Arular, on the other hand, will make me defensive when people start badmouthing it later on.

Johnny Fever (johnny fever), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:44 (twenty years ago)

'Mason City' is one of the tracks that stuck out most in my mind when I first listened to the album- plus it's got all that great grifter talk right at the end. It's not at all what I would call lifeless, the song has character and personality to spare. x-post

Kevin H (Kevin H), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:45 (twenty years ago)

no cool haircuts? gear! have you seen those kids? please. I think what they are doing is unique and I give them credit for creativity, but honestly I find the music unbearable like finger nails on a chalk board. why everyone freaked out about it is beyond me and probably always will be. there is no backlash, these are just the voices of people who hated it from the get go.

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:47 (twenty years ago)

yes, as far as I can tell "arular" is worhty of the hype. Blueberry Boat, Silent Alarm, all those others, just bore or annoy

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:48 (twenty years ago)

The more I listen to EP the more I think it's their best release yet.

o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:49 (twenty years ago)

Arular is probably a worthy top forty of '05 sort of album.

Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:50 (twenty years ago)

Silent Alarm

This is where our paths split, breezy.

Johnny Fever (johnny fever), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:52 (twenty years ago)

see you on the other side fever! haha

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:53 (twenty years ago)

Anyone going to the Webster Hall show this Saturday and wants to meet up there, shoot me an email.

o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:56 (twenty years ago)

He keeps judging the record by criteria he assumes are uncontroversial, making comparison with other records that he assumes have the same aim but which achieve it better. To me, that's crappy, rockist criticism.

If I had read these reviews that praise Blueberry Boat by comparing it to The Who, then maybe it would make more sense to me.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 17:57 (twenty years ago)

I think "Mason City" and "Spaniolated" are gorgeous.

They said they were influenced by "A Quick One While He's Away" and "Rael" in the promo materials that came with the album. I find songs like "Mason City" to be good realizations of that (and I said so in my Voice review).

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:01 (twenty years ago)

But Alba, the "Quick One" comparison was repeated ad infinitum in every single blurb/review/brain-fart about BB!

The jury will be out on this album for quite a while. I have a feeling it's going to stick around. It has enough enthusiasts at this point to keep it from going away.

Keith C (kcraw916), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:02 (twenty years ago)

ugh. fifteen bucks to see FF? yikes. fools! haha. i'll be at tonic.

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:07 (twenty years ago)

I might have only read the odd blog review of BB. I'm not a big reader of reviews. I can see how if they kept saying "This is great - it's like A Quick One While He's Away," that might prompt a reaction. But like my mum said, two wrongs don't make a right.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:08 (twenty years ago)

"Seriously though - I lose objectivity here. Is it my imagination that Blueberry Boat has attracted more "All the critics are so full of it - that album is pretentious, overrated crap" comments than any in recent times?"

Well, how 'bout Arcade Fire, Alba?

Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:09 (twenty years ago)

Is it my imagination that Blueberry Boat has attracted more "All the critics are so full of it - that album is pretentious, overrated crap" comments than any in recent times?

ARCADE FIRE

Two such albums in the same year -- lucky us!

Even though I personally am not fond of BB, Alba OTM.

xpost

MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:09 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, you're quite right - that's up there too, maybe even ahead of it. But I don't like the Arcade Fire a lot so it hadn't lodged in my brain so much.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:10 (twenty years ago)

This wasn't a "finally someones has said it sucks" piece at all, there have been many detractors to BB all along. I think posting a re-review of it was just pandering to the people that seem to revel in complaining about the album which there are a ton. Of course their blog lit up with jubilant haters, I'm sure that didn't surprise the writer at all. The fact is like Keith said, the album is going to stick around because the people that like it, really like it, they will keep it in the "critical conscience" if you will. I think its great but I can also see why people dislike it, the reasons are valid. When the decade lists roll out in five years the topic sentence to many a blurb for BB will no doubt use the word divisive and for good reason.

jmeister (jmeister), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:18 (twenty years ago)

The Arcade Fire record is WAY more accessible than BB, though. Even if you are a lover of BB, you have to admit it is far from an accessible record. Any time critics jump on a difficult record like BB, there's bound to be some backlash.

xpost

Keith C (kcraw916), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:19 (twenty years ago)

I bought E.P. cause it was cheap and she has one of Dawn's old hairstyles.

I don't think I'll buy another. It was OK, good even, just that it seems the things I like are the things they don't do on album.

mark grout (mark grout), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:20 (twenty years ago)

Keith, OTM about lack of accesibilty and backlash.

jmeister (jmeister), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:21 (twenty years ago)

I don't know what 'accessible' means really. I mean, neither are going to be liked by most top 40 listeners, but I'm generally a poppish kind of person, and don't have much interest in doomy or difficult indie rock records. Yet I got hold of Blueberry Boat after seeing them live and hearing 'I Lost My Dog' on fluxblog and from my first listen was totally enthralled.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:25 (twenty years ago)

I wasx actually worried that I liked it too much on first listen - that that indicated it might be a short-lived thrill.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:26 (twenty years ago)

'Accessible' means it more or less conforms to an accepted standard of what pop music should sound like: catchy melodies, strong back beat, recognizable strong structures (verse-chorus-verse), simple cadences, chord changes (DOWN Geir!), lyrics in English, 3 minute songs, etc...

Keith C (kcraw916), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:36 (twenty years ago)

Ah, you're probably right. I just wonder why I find it so accessible personally when most other music that messes with all those criteria I can't get into at all.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:39 (twenty years ago)

Honestly, I was probably more concerned with trying to convey what I percieved to be a huge gap between people's diuretic praise of the record and its actual quality. Nowhere did I ever claim it was "terrible," because I don't think it is. I just think that for an album so wildly cherished, it doesn't work to what I percieve as their strengths (which EP does better). As far as making comparisons as "crappy rockist criticism," well, I wasn't the first one. I listened to the album a lot, and really tried to appreciate it on its own terms. It did seem that a lot of people saw this record as neo-prog pop or Who-influenced or whatever, and I just think it didn't live up to all that. Plus, I'd take being a crappy rockist any day if it means abandoning the insurmountable project of talking about music like it exists in a vacuum. I'm not trying to hate on anyone, I'm more just excited that there's some debate over it.

mike powell (mike powell), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:42 (twenty years ago)

I always feel a bit embarrassed when the writers of things criticised appear on the thread, but yeah, good for debate and all.

Nowhere did I ever claim it was "terrible," because I don't think it is.

Maybe I'm missing it, but why the quote marks? Where did anyone claim that you called it terrible?

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:48 (twenty years ago)

I slammed BB hard as often as possible when it first came out. I thought it was the worst record I'd heard in ages. With repeated listens, I've grown rather fond of it. It isn't high art, but it's unlike anything I've ever heard (this isn't necessarily a good thing, of course), and it simple oozes with charm and hidden treasure. There are a lot of things about it that I don't like, and this is why I still wouldn't put it in my top 20 of 2004, but I'm glad I own it.

polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:51 (twenty years ago)

Mike, one thing I think you were correct to point out (and even lovers of BB would probably agree) is that the "Quick One" comparisons are certainly a stretch. There is some stylistic influence there, to be sure, but I think most people (like myself) put the album on expecting to hear minatures like "Quick One" and didn't, which lead to a bit of confusion. That this comparison was included in the press kit (as Tim said) should have been obvious but I never thought about it.

Keith C (kcraw916), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:52 (twenty years ago)

I would also add that almost no record will hold up to intense critical scrutiny or praise. I've heard well-reasoned arguments against almost every album that I love, and at some point it's just a matter of taste. However, I doubt that the FFs ever thought that their fun little record, recorded in relative anonymity, would ever be the subject of such a debate.

This is true for Joanna Newsom as well. When I first saw her, she was a complete unknown, and her style and quirks seemed refreshing and fun. Now, when the bartender at my local insists that she is better than Bob Dylan ever was (!), those positive qualities can become obscured by the white noise of the public discourse.

Hopefully, in five years, when things have died down, we'll just be able to listen to the records again.

polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:56 (twenty years ago)

Alba (and I said this on the Stylus board too), this wasn't necessarily to spearhead a gang of people who think that BB was a tremendously shitty record, but it seems like a lot of people have applauded the piece by saying "yeah, I think this record is god awful too and jesus why are all the kids so stupid about it." I'm very middle of the road on BB, so I get hit by cars passing both ways. Of course, my negative criticisms of it were more tempted to burst out because I felt like I hadn't yet read anything that wasn't overwhelmingly positive, but wasn't just a bucketful of a-grammatical poison (not to say I got it right). I really like the EP. I feel like the next record could be great (in my frame of opinion). Maybe I just didn't get this record, but damned if I didn't try.

mike powell (mike powell), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 18:59 (twenty years ago)

Talking of E.P. I didn't really get this bit of your piece:

>>
Blueberry Boat, without any doubt in my mind, would’ve made a much better 45 minute record if they had someone there (I think they’re called “producers”) to cut out, at the expense of their precious yet sometimes irritating “artistry,” some of the weaker, more pointless stretches. Or maybe even a really, really good EP (something the band can do, as evidenced by this year’s EP).
>>

I mean E.P. is really a budget price 10-track, 50 minute compilation of non-album single tracks (and some bonus ones?) so how does its release prove they can make a really good E.P.?

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 19:09 (twenty years ago)

Oh, I get it - you mean the original singles that were collected on it were great. Like they work better when they are writing for a shorter form release? OK.

Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 19:10 (twenty years ago)

ugh. fifteen bucks to see FF? yikes. fools! haha. i'll be at tonic

That Tonic show does look interesting, but the last FF show I saw was one of the better rock shows I've seen in a while, so I'll gladly shell out the $15 and keep my fingers crossed that lightning will strike twice.

o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 19:40 (twenty years ago)

i must admit i've heard good things about FF's live show. Me being the FF hatah i am , am even slightly curious about it, but not enough to pay that much loot. yeah the tonic show will be fun fun fun. i'm gonna get stoned. hah.

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:16 (twenty years ago)

It's not that much more. The Tonic show is $10, unless you're on the guest list or something.

o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:23 (twenty years ago)

no it's not. i just meant 15 bucks to hear music I hate, or 10 bucks to hear music I love! but of course this is all taste we are talking about. what I should have said is, I'd probably pay like 2 dollars to see the FF just out of curiosity, but they are now too big for that kind of price tag. so i may go my whole life never seeing them live. tragedy?

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:24 (twenty years ago)

Well, if they stick around long enough, they may do a free show or play at a festival or something where you might have a chance to see them. Actually, I think they did play the Coney Island thing last year, but I didn't go.

o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:28 (twenty years ago)

they sucked at Siren

miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:32 (twenty years ago)

Oh well, no great loss then.

o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:32 (twenty years ago)

Having seen them live, I would prefer to hear them do the album in sequence with breaks. The whole show felt like one long song, and that was a little much for me.

polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:33 (twenty years ago)

that's what everyone said was so great about it though. how relentless it is. sounds like a nightmare to me, but I feel like I really ought to give it a chance

breezy, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 20:34 (twenty years ago)

I've read criticism of Blueberry Boat before, although the one in Rolling Stone was much poorer than Stylus's. Still, nothing compares to driving downtown at 11 PM, pay attention to "Chief Inspector Blancheflower" for the first time. At least for me. I can see why people take issue with it, but for me it's never seemed that inaccessible or pretentious.
And the EP is pure reward for getting through BB

WillSommer, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 22:23 (twenty years ago)

THIS JUST IN -- SERIOUS PROG FAN DOESN'T LIKE BLUEBERRY BOAT!

Eppy (Eppy), Thursday, 7 April 2005 13:52 (twenty years ago)


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