Has Sonic Youth lost the untethered, nearly sloppy feeling it had in the 1980's, with those billowy passages of improvised overtone noise, guitars in odd tuning and the tribal drums walloping? Has it

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No, sez Ben Ratliff in a concert review.

― john'n'chicago, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 13:51 (twenty years ago)

I thought a certain amount of 'sanitizing' helped them, starting around Daydream Nation (and I first saw SY opening for the Minutemen in '84/5). When I last caught them in Central Park a couple summers ago, what had finally caught up with them is Kim's vocals seeming irrevocably silly.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:04 (twenty years ago)

I have been finding kim's post dirty vocal contributions, the into to a thousand leaves in particular, to be tremendously irritating and altogether superfluous.

― hmmm (hmmm), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:08 (twenty years ago)

speaking of kim, check out her legs in the accompanying photo! damn!

― john'n'chicago, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:09 (twenty years ago)

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2005/04/13/arts/13soniL.jpg
Kim is biting from my wardrobe

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:09 (twenty years ago)

kim still looks better than most of you rock nerd dudes.

― maria tessa sciarrino (theoreticalgirl), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:14 (twenty years ago)

Upon listening to "A Thousand Leaves" and "Sonic Nurse," no.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:15 (twenty years ago)

also, i totally wore that same skirt/dress when i was a competitive figure skater. ha!

― maria tessa sciarrino (theoreticalgirl), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:17 (twenty years ago)

! (To the figure skater part, of which I was unaware.)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:31 (twenty years ago)

somewhat recent proof of my skills here:
http://herjazz.org/movies/maria_skating.avi

― maria tessa sciarrino (theoreticalgirl), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:36 (twenty years ago)

I last saw SY at the Showbox in Seattle; they scheduled this show in accordance with Lollapalooza being cancelled. I found this concert to be extremely kick ass. In fact, original/different voices like Kim's, in my opinion, are an important element to the progression of rock music. For instance, listen to Robert Plant's voice. According to me father, who was my age at the time of Led Zeppelin's peek, most music critics acclaimed that his voice was the downfall of the band (not to mention the thievery of blues elements from the African American music culture). Plant has influenced many artists prior to his time, such as Guns 'n Roses own Axel Rose. In turn, Rose has influenced the vocals of most late 80's, early 90's grunge rock vocalists, such as Chris Cornell of Soundgarden. Now, being that Kim Gordon has been around longer than the late grunge scene, she has most definitely consciously, and subconsciously, influenced many modern rock acts. In conclusion to my hour long rant (sorry, it's early, and I have only had one cup of coffee and no music) all music that has existed previous to this given moment has most likely changed/influenced music that will exist tomorrow, and then on, making all musical elements (even Kim's 'odd' vocals) essential to the progression of modern music evolution.
Oh crap, this is suppose to be about the sterilization of their sound, well, i think that most artists will change through life experiences, and that if their music is a true reflection of their current situation, then maybe it may sound sterile to some being that they aren't in their early 20's anymore. I know that as I grow older I find myself listening to more variety of music, some of which may be seen as sterile.

I think that Sonic Youth still has an edge that most other bands don't, and never will, have.

― Mucus Membrane, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:39 (twenty years ago)

kim still looks better than most of you rock nerd dudes.

Kim has been looking better with age for a while now!

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:45 (twenty years ago)

I found this concert to be extremely kick ass.

I wish Ratliff would have just written this.

― john'n'chicago, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:54 (twenty years ago)

i think sanatized is a terrible word. they have developed in the last few years a sound which is both tighter (perhaps cleaner) and more expansive. i see it as sonic youth feeling comfortable with the demolition carried out by the early music and excited to now explore a new landscape on the burnt ground.

they closed the encore on sunday with xpressway to yr skull, a personal favorite. its seismic shifts in texture and tremendous noise still thrilled the part of me that wanted the feelings of complete rush and rigor mortis cum deliverence. but at the same time a whole set of that material, much less and an album, would be boring. especially if it was anything less than xpressway, making ht nature scene, etc.

that said, the direction they have taken isn't for everyone.

theres always wolf eyes and magik markers for those who want the old sound.

― b b, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:57 (twenty years ago)

Has Marias skating become sanitized in relation to her earlier incarnation as a lame(w/ accent) wearing years?Or is her desire to outskate black frame glassed boys too intense for pure entertainment drive?

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 15:05 (twenty years ago)

syntax police to thread

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 15:09 (twenty years ago)

! (To the figure skater part, of which I was unaware.)
MARIA IN ISABELLE BRASSEUR IMPERSONATING SHOCKAH! Oh wait, Brasseur was a couple's skater...um, Kristi Yamaguchi then?

― Ian Riese-Moraine. To Hell with you and your gradual evolution! (Eastern Mantra), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 15:11 (twenty years ago)

As for Sonic Youth, I've amazingly only heard one song by them. ("Kool Thing" of course...) I think at one point I might've heard Murray Street at the house of one of my exs, but I can't remember and I just might be recalling her praise for it.

― Ian Riese-Moraine. To Hell with you and your gradual evolution! (Eastern Mantra), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 15:13 (twenty years ago)

breaking your leg in three places will definitely sanitize ya.

― maria tessa sciarrino (theoreticalgirl), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 15:14 (twenty years ago)

Kim looks fine, but her choice of wardrobe...well, I'd like to say I'm above that, but I'm not. Still, bad call.

― Eppy (Eppy), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 15:34 (twenty years ago)

what had finally caught up with them is Kim's vocals seeming irrevocably silly.

I think this has is true to a certain extent -- one of the reasons I don't rate Murray Street as highly as some is that I think "Plastic Sun" is sort of embarrassing. But even though "Mariah Carey and the Arthur Doyle Hand Cream" skirts that line, ultimately I think her contributions on Sonic Nurse sound much more rejuvenated than she has in the past few years.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 15:47 (twenty years ago)

OTM Jaymc. "I Love You Golden Blue" is the best Kim song since "Kissability."

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 16:04 (twenty years ago)

I like the early version of Plastic Sun where she says something like "rip me off with your Britney Spears."

Thurston opened for Wolf Eyes 2 weeks ago, in some side project band thing he has. The other guy in the project made Thurston superfluous.

― David Allen (David Allen), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 17:28 (twenty years ago)

Listened to one of their newer albums recently. I think it's not so much that their sound has become "sanitized," but that the songwriting has become pretty mediocre and their jams just aren't all that compelling.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 17:34 (twenty years ago)

http://ecstaticpeace.com/multimedia/fly_tm.mov

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 17:41 (twenty years ago)

i can't open maria's skating thingy. : (

― hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 18:50 (twenty years ago)

it should be noticed that i do not entirely agree with the following article, since i think people have been cutting this particular band slack since the dull half of *daydream nation*, at least, but still:

http://www.villagevoice.com/music/0236,tracker_writer.inc,36349,.html

― xhxuk, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:00 (twenty years ago)

I respectfully disagree with her retarded article.

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:06 (twenty years ago)

Sonic Nurse has grown on me in a major way in the last three weeks.

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:07 (twenty years ago)

i was wondering when *that article* was going to be brought up...

― maria tessa sciarrino (theoreticalgirl), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:09 (twenty years ago)

the 3 year anniversary of that article being published is coming up!

― hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:11 (twenty years ago)

Oh, Amy, so much to answer for...

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:13 (twenty years ago)

I'm less angry about Amy's idea that Sonic Youth should break up than I am about Chuck's idea that Daydream Nation is only half good. That's about as wrong as wrong can get.

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:15 (twenty years ago)

polyphonic, have you just recently started reading chuck, or what?

― hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:17 (twenty years ago)

i love that article. i love amy phillips!

― maria tessa sciarrino (theoreticalgirl), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:22 (twenty years ago)

Did Amy Phillips review Sonic Nurse anywhere? Anyone know?

― mcd (mcd), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:25 (twenty years ago)

I think Amy Phillips is a great writer.
I loved her Lightning Bolt review, where she said the music reminds her of retarded unicorns cavorting about.

― Brooker Buckingham (Brooker B), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:35 (twenty years ago)

the best thing to come out of that article was sfj's response.

― j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 19:37 (twenty years ago)

polyphonic, have you just recently started reading chuck, or what?

I have a lot of respect for Chuck, despite his various quirks. I'd rather state my disagreements with him than just shrug it off dismissively.

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:05 (twenty years ago)

I like Amy as a writer, she's just wrong.

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:05 (twenty years ago)

chuck eddy's hardly the first person i've met who thinks sonic youth 'lost it' around the time of daydream nation.

― j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:08 (twenty years ago)

Sonic Youth can do whatever they want, but I completely agree with her take on that album.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:10 (twenty years ago)

chuck's just upset cuz can't dance to guitar feedback.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:12 (twenty years ago)

Wait - which is the "boring half" of Daydream Nation again? Murray Street is the best thing they've done since at least Dirty if not DN itself.

― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:14 (twenty years ago)

Wait - which is the "boring half" of Daydream Nation again?

You guys do realize that only one side of the CD has music on it, right? ;)

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:17 (twenty years ago)

I'd say "Total Trash" through "Rain King" is the boring half of Daydream Nation (Providence excluded).

― The Sensational Sulk (sexyDancer), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:20 (twenty years ago)

I'm curious if Amy still thinks its a coincidence that SY started to sound less than godly when she got out of high school. I'd ask her but I'm guessing she's pretty tired of hearing about this shit.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:22 (twenty years ago)

You guys are being awfully literal. It's not like every second of Daydream Nation is TOTALLY COMPELLING and people have no right to prefer the tightness of an album like Sister.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:22 (twenty years ago)

the best thing to come out of that article was sfj's response.

personally the best thing to come out of that article was your "jailbait" thread, blount! First ILX thread I ever saw!

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:24 (twenty years ago)

MEEEEEEMMMREEEEEEZ

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:25 (twenty years ago)

>Wait - which is the "boring half" of Daydream Nation again?<

The half that doesn't include "Teenage Riot," "The Sprawl," "Hey Joni," "Kissability", or "Trilogy: The Wonder." (Okay, that's *more* than a half. So who knows, maybe I'm cutting the album slack myself, too!)

>chuck's just upset cuz can't dance to guitar feedback<

Nah, that ain't it...I can't dance to the guitar feedback on Sister or Confusion is Sex, either, and I like those albums just fine!

― xhuxk, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:25 (twenty years ago)

THANX FOR BRINGING THAT UP TONE

― j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:25 (twenty years ago)

no, thank you.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:26 (twenty years ago)

Sorry but I can't go along with any definition of the boring half that includes "Candle".

― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:29 (twenty years ago)

It's not like every second of Daydream Nation is TOTALLY COMPELLING

I'm going to have to disagree with you there, Tim.

people have no right to prefer the tightness of an album like Sister.

I realize that sarcasm and irony don't carry very well via the Internet, but I hope you don't think I literally was saying that people are wrong if they don't agree with my opinion. Diff'rent strokes / diff'rent folks, etc. Also, I like Sister better than DN too.

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:30 (twenty years ago)

yeah replace "Hey Joni" with "Candle"! I never really dug "Hey Joni" - odd cuz I usually like Lee tracks! Though gaw, yeah, I never really want to hear this album. I'd prefer to throw on Sister or Goo. Shorter!

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:30 (twenty years ago)

I remember hating Candle as a yout. Seem a so sissy this "candle"
I like the Whitey Album

― The Sensational Sulk (sexyDancer), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:33 (twenty years ago)

Haven't read that whole old thread on the Amy Phillips piece, but a lot of the dialogue seems to be centered around the idea that it's not a good review because she doesn't explain the exact mechanisms of how and why she feels that the album stinks. Does she have to? Can we not imply that she just thinks that the songs stink? And isn't saying that enough sometimes? She says lots of other things in the article.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:34 (twenty years ago)

I was sorta amazed I'd love "Sonic Nurse" enough to consider it my album of the year, despite heavy competition most of the year. During their "commercial" years they were sorta ok, and it wasn't until "A Thousand Leaves" that my ears started to perk up again.

Speaking of which, ATL has as many dead spots as Daydream Nation. Still love it.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:34 (twenty years ago)

"hey joni"s like the best karaoke song ever cuz you get to "KICK IT!" and plus maybe there's a girl in the crowd name joni or even just joan and you get to point at her while you sing it plus i can hit every note lee renaldo can (and more).

― j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:35 (twenty years ago)

>I'd prefer to throw on Sister or Goo. Shorter!<

Yeah, I was just thinking that I really miss my copy of their 1983 *Kill Yr Idols* EP, on Zensor Records out of Germany. That record was dope! (I'd still take Daydream Nation over Goo though, no question.)

― xhuxk, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:37 (twenty years ago)

Kill Yr Idols is slapped onto Confusion Is Sex on that '90s DGC reissue, dude!

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:39 (twenty years ago)

If "Kotton Crown" replaced "Hey Joni," DN would be flawless.

Is "Hey Joni" some obscure dig at Joni Mitchell?

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:40 (twenty years ago)

Actually it's a prop to Mitchell! Lee loves her.

I'm tempted to say that Sonic Nurse beats most of what their peers are up to now, but woo frikkin' woo.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:41 (twenty years ago)

Well, who wants to listen to an entire album of them anyway? Daydream Nation and Dirty probably both have more cool songs you can listen to than Goo.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:41 (twenty years ago)

I know there are a couple of songs that I wouldn't miss too much if they were left off DN (probably "Silver Rocket" and "Kissability" - definitely NOT "Hey Joni", which is great) but I could also do without a couple on Sister, which doesn't have as many songs to start with. I think the only song I'd leave off Murray Street is "Radical Adults Lick Godhead Style".

― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:41 (twenty years ago)

Well, who wants to listen to an entire album of them anyway?

*coughs*

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 20:53 (twenty years ago)

Actually, I can kind of see maybe sometimes wanting to listen to the earlier albums all the way through (at least sides!). Daydream Nation, though? And I probably don't like the albums after that enough to want to listen to them all the way through.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 21:10 (twenty years ago)

I still want to know where these fabled karaoke bars with Sonic Youth songs are. (In Georgia?!)

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 21:14 (twenty years ago)

Daydream Nation, though?

In a major way. It was like the holy grail for me in high school.

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 21:22 (twenty years ago)

you don't get the full EPIC effect of DA TRILOGY unless you listen to it all the way thru.

― j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 21:26 (twenty years ago)

Most karaoke bars in Miami have "Electric Youth," not Sonic Youth.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 21:36 (twenty years ago)

miami >>>>>>>>>>>>> athens

― j blount (papa la bas), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 21:38 (twenty years ago)

Kim is biting from my wardrobe

i agree onlz until i see is dan bunn not bob. bob is like skirts instead.

now i saz sonic zouth forget it.

― pinon umlow, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 21:57 (twenty years ago)

i saw sonic youth this part tuesday night at Northsix in Brooklyn. They ended a wonderful set with 20 excrutiating minutes of white noise. Thurston had this huge amp right in front of this kid in the front row's face, and he was slamming it repeatedly on the ground. Kim was tightrope-walking along her bass with high heels. I walked out with my hair blown back. They've still got it.

― rockaction (rockaction), Friday, 15 April 2005 06:23 (twenty years ago)

Dear me. They should behave with dignity appropriate to people of their advanced age.

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Friday, 15 April 2005 06:26 (twenty years ago)

I listen to 'Bad Moon Rising' all the way through all the time. Actually, thinking of it, I always listen to SY albums all the way through.

I still don't get how 'Hey Joni' gives props to Mitchell, but I like to think so (since Lee and Joni are probably my biggest idols).

― Baaderonixxxorzh (Fabfunk), Friday, 15 April 2005 08:07 (twenty years ago)

i listened to Bad Moon Rising straight through last night, then lamented its end.

frankly, if we spend this much time trying to separate wheat and chaff, we've proved SY to be fantastic...the rest is debate over which color m&m err smartie to get rid off

― b b, Saturday, 16 April 2005 13:47 (twenty years ago)

I think Amy Phillips is a great writer.
I loved her Lightning Bolt review, where she said the music reminds her of retarded unicorns cavorting about.

-- Brooker Buckingham (brooker...), April 13th, 2005.

Sorry, but I don't see this as evidence of good writing at all. Abstractions are abstractions, but it's hard for me to understand how LB would suggest something light and spry like a unicorn (even a retarded one), not to mention that the image just MIGHT have been suggested by the cover/album title "WONDERFUL RAINBOW".

― Hurting (Hurting), Saturday, 16 April 2005 14:08 (twenty years ago)

Anyone have a link to SFJ's response to Amy P?

― shookout (shookout), Saturday, 16 April 2005 16:23 (twenty years ago)

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