Last Plane to Jakarta vs. Amnesiac

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Now that John's marathon explication of Amnesiac is done with, it's time to figure out who was keeping track and what they thought along the way. Worthwhile? Change your perspective on any elements of the record? Any of the theoretical bases of John's readings strikes you as particularly apt or particularly cloddish? Plus we should discuss the fact that the last entry, up this week, makes the same Radiohead / Finnegan's Wake connection that Brent Pitchfork did, way back in the day. That's the important thing.

Nitsuh, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

also john, keep in mind it's gauche to appear on a thread discussing yr own work. ;)

jess, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

No way, Jess! The Momus Rule works for music but why bother for criticism? Cf "Article Response" threads? Down to brass tacks! Revision, explication! FITE!

Nitsuh, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Well, if nothing else, this means I'll actually have to go and read it. This shows you how much time I spend here and not elsewhere when it comes to web stuff.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I'll have to reread the thang in its entirety (the next-to-last entry in particular), but I enjoyed it immensely. I just so happened to listen to Amnesiac while driving around this water treatment plant last week. Except for all the plant machinery, there was nothing but tight winding roads bordered by barren trees, with the iced-over river winding parallel to the road past the trees. The entire trip to & from the plant (through some decrepit areas of New Britian into secluded woody pockets of upscale suburbia into the actual plant property) struck me with a sense of ominous foreboding that was both unsettling and comforting. Listening to that record (in conjunction w/ John's Big Themes of death & desolation & despondency circling through my head) complemented the trip quite well.

David Raposa, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Ned, do you really need to flaunt your "life" in front of us internet phreex? *inserts wink emoticon here ... no, wait, here*

David Raposa, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

*beats David down* I meant HERE ON THIS SITE as opposed to other ones, ie I spend most browsing time here while probably spending the same exact time on the Internet as you lot. Feh.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Are you sure you don't mean Brent Sirota, Nitsuh? (Brent D. is traditionally accorded the epithet "Brent Pitchfork".)

Josh, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

Of course John would not presume to enter this discussion, but if he did, I imagine he'd only do so to point out that the final line isn't a Finnegans Wake reference but a line from an old children's song, one of those songs that never stops: "I knew a man named Michael Finnegan/He had whiskers on his chin-again/Along came the wind and blew them in again/Poor old Michael Finnegan begin again," at which point the thing is sung again, infinitely if one so desires. Same sort of thing as the circular structure of Finnegans Wake but not on such a grand scale and lacking Joyce's great-big-design.

Certainly Not John, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I really enjoyed it. It made me wish I knew the album better, but someday, when I do, I'll go back and read it again. The spare use of HTML/Flash effects was incredible, really raised the bar. I can't believe I haven't seen that kind of thing before w/ music writing.

Mark, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I agree with mark. I went back and read the whole thing and listened to the album along with it, and it certainly made me rethink alot of my previous notions about the album an dhow the tracks were layed out. The sequencing certainly does make a whole lot more sense on an emotional level to me now. bravo john.

Brock K, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

i'm curious to read this text ... i always thought of amnesiac as being completely aconceptual, and i always thought radiohead did too. seems a bit like a b-sides collection.

where can i read this, especially the finnegan's wake bit?

fields of salmon, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

radiohead/finnegan's wake??? does anyone have a link to that??

tyler, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I'm especially impressed w/ the Plane's utilization of web tricks as a whole - there are other reviews on the site that deploy the same Javascript sleight-of-hand as the "Like Spinning Plates" write-up (I forget which, though - just check out the Plane already). More important than that, though, is the pacing of the articles - splitting up the essays into "pages" to make them A) easier to read and B) easier to digest.

I would also like to second the praise offered by Mark & Brock re: the actual reviews in question. I have to bite my tongue sometimes, since my knee-jerk reaction when I read "we are..." is to think "Well, I'm not...", but that's nothing. The bit in the latest / last entry, where the words turn in on themselves while actually kicking the reader out (that is, "revealing" that we're intruders, not welcome) made me smile.

If there's any feeling I instinctively take away from John's project, it's that I feel twinges of guilt when I listen to Amnesiac and ENJOY it. (I enjoy it very much; now, I wonder if I really should.)

David Raposa, Monday, 21 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

As resident ILM Radiohead obsessive, I should probably weigh in. I'm not as articulate about this as I'd like to be, but John's Amnesiac articles are probably my favorite writings on the internet. They managed to be insightful, personal, and dramatic without becoming convoluted or silly. They reinforced and changed some ideas that I had on an album I already loved and didn't think I could possibly love more (this is beginning to sound like an infomercial). I just really loved the way the album was approached on so many different levels, examining the narrative and the sonic properties of the album as a cohesive and purposeful whole. I'm just glad that someone could more eloquently express the feelings of bleakness and death-obsession that permeated the album than I.

Melissa W, Tuesday, 22 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I was hoping this thread would lure Mel out.

My feelings run parallel to Dave's, if maybe more guiltily so. John's take centered on a very literary reading of the record, constantly clocking how Yorke's narrators place themselves and how they address the listener and what they actually have to say -- which I think was fantastic, especially in the midst of basically all Radiohead press over the past year taking a Studious Rock Band Uses Electronics to Kill Rock angle and just putting the lyrics down to "alienated" or "finds modern world soulless and oppressive." This also surely does a lot to reconnect sonic readings of the songs with the actual literal meanings of them -- it can keep us from, say, seeing "Knives Out" as this shimmering familiar respite mid-record as opposed to reading it for what it actually has to say.

If we're talking an "author is dead, look at text" stance on this, that's a magnificent project, and we don't have to get into all of this genre talk about how much the sonic presentation actually matches up with the actual text. The fact that Yorke is the conceptual center of the band helps as well, in that we can assume he's not writing contrary to his own music. But there is some part of me that interested in how the sonics played into it, and how those decisions fit with the album itself as a closed piece of work. This isn't a complaint about John's project, as I can't see going about that discussion in a song-by-song format ... and I think the results he got were an ideal way of breaking through all of that genre-talk and getting at the record itself, and a good corrective to most everything else that's been written about the record ... but there were spots where I was very interested in what he actually would think, if he happened to step back and talk in those overall-aesthetic terms. I.e., he displayed way more close, hard-won insight into the record than everyone else making the generalizations, so I was curious as to what his generalizations might be.

Nitsuh, Tuesday, 22 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

My only major complaint would be the view of song as weaker or stronger depending on lyrics or lack thereof. Particularly with Dollars & Cents and Hunting Bears, there was insight to be had on the lonely desert atmosphere of the latter song, and the former was dismissed as a weak song on the basis of repetition of Thom's typical lyrical themes. Dollars & Cents, on a purely sonic level is one of the most intense and beautiful songs on the album. But on the other hand, I know what every little tiny detail of the album sounds like already. Someone telling me what it sounds like is hardly of interest to me anymore, but lyrical analysis can be interesting and insightful and can still reveal things to me about the album that I have not thought about.

Melissa W, Tuesday, 22 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

simeon reynard he say that amnesiac its just outakes stuff that was too crap to go on kid a.

james joyce didnt he write useless? saw winsor davis talking to ladida gunner graham about him on aint half hot mum on uk gold.

XStatic Peace, Tuesday, 22 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

I agree with all the praise so far - I thought the entire project was excellent. Perhaps for the first time reading about a piece of music actually helped me enjoy it more. I had some half-formed, elusive ideas about the record, and John seemed to have a knack of pinning these ideas down exactly.

And - like Nitsuh said - these articles render all the Generic Radiohead Reviews obsolete, thankfully.

As a brief aside, the way the piece on "Like Spinning Plates" manages to convey how, uh, grotesque and horrible the song is without just saying "this one is about children being killed in wars" was fantastic. Perhaps more thoughts later.

clive, Tuesday, 22 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

dont feel obliged.

somnolence by name somnolent by nature.

XStatic Peace, Tuesday, 22 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

anyway u is all talkin shit. tom york writes lyrics by putting bits of paper in a top hat and pulling them out like magician. mark lamar said so on never mind buzzcocks last night so lisen to proper authority people who know what there talking about.

XStatic Peace, Tuesday, 22 January 2002 01:00 (twenty-four years ago)

five years pass...

Anyone know where to find said marathon explication these days?

rogermexico., Monday, 1 October 2007 01:56 (eighteen years ago)

Is this thread about his Flash review or his long essays? I seem to have confused the matter with my post five years ago, and I apologize for that. I am crazy about that Flash review though and I think of it often.

Mark Rich@rdson, Monday, 1 October 2007 03:04 (eighteen years ago)


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