Taking Sides: Radiohead vs. Weezer ("the American Radiohead?")

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Fuck'em both, I say, but just now...walking up Broadway behind two NYU students (resplendent in the indie rock uniform....messenger bag spackled with 1" pins), I heard one say to the other, "Well, y'know, Weezer are pretty much certifiably the American equivalent of Radiohead."

Suffice to say, I don't care enough to agree or disagree, but it strikes me as a rather wrong statement. But maybe he was speaking in terms of their popularity? Or maybe just because the lead singers are both hapless geeks.

What say you?

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:55 (twenty years ago)

I say this particular NYU student should be killed messily by vole insertion.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:57 (twenty years ago)

My thoughts exactly....even before he opened his mouth.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:58 (twenty years ago)

he was probably talking about feelings

― The Sensational Sulk (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:58 (twenty years ago)

Can I agree with great haste re: Dan and Alex's perceptions?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:58 (twenty years ago)

the only thing they have in common is that I never want to listen to either of them.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:58 (twenty years ago)

NYU students are not the most reliable source of critical wisdom. The sonic similarities between the bands are few & far between, and while their audiences may have significant overlap, that doesn't imply any sort of musical confluence.

I think both bands are fairly crap, btw.

― Ian John50n (orion), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:59 (twenty years ago)

Well both these guys are tortured, rich, private-schooled twats, but at least the tortured, rich, private-schooled twat on the left can still write good songs.

― PB, Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:59 (twenty years ago)

the American equivalent of Radiohead is Wilco

― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:59 (twenty years ago)

I don't even hate Weezer!

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 16:59 (twenty years ago)

This is like saying "Creed is the American Joy Division", i.e. it demonstrates a woeful lack of understanding of either band's sound.

― Tantrum The Cat (Tantrum The Cat), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:00 (twenty years ago)

My roommate says The Flaming Lips are the Radiohead of a world where the sun shines.

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:00 (twenty years ago)

private-schooled twats
good mix of US and UK terminology!

― The Sensational Sulk (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:00 (twenty years ago)

i second the wilco idea.

― AaronK (AaronK), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:01 (twenty years ago)

A.M. = Pablo Honey
Being There = The Bends
Summerteeth = OK Computer
Yankee Hotel Foxtrot = Kid A
Ghost Is Born = Amnesiac

I will not be buying Wilco's Hail To The Thief

― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:01 (twenty years ago)

My roommate says The Flaming Lips are the Radiohead of a world where the sun shines.

that might be a better analogy.

Weezer was the alt-rock Cheap Trick, but dumber and with less good songs.*

*but I still like Weezer

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:01 (twenty years ago)

"Linda Ronstadt is the American Gang of Four!"

― The Ghost of A Confused NYU Student (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:02 (twenty years ago)

Radiohead wouldn't be seen dead at the Playboy Mansion for one. I hate Weezer so much, they are fucking awful. Radiohead have The Bends so they win.

― Czan, Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:03 (twenty years ago)

This really belongs here, I suppose.....

POO: idiotic things you've overheard said about music

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:03 (twenty years ago)

I will say this: I have been around dudes who've feigned greater than natural interest in both these bands to get into the pants of surly "arty" chicks. In that sense, Weezer is the American Radiohead, and vice versa. But there are more bands that serve this function than just these two.

― dr. ruthless, Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:03 (twenty years ago)

Radiohead wouldn't be seen dead at the Playboy Mansion for one.

This isn't a point in their favor, surely?

― Ian John50n (orion), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:03 (twenty years ago)

Marilyn Manson is the American Marc Almond!

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:05 (twenty years ago)

TS: Bill Maher vs Jon Stewart

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:05 (twenty years ago)

I'm actually very curious to understand though WHY this kid made such an outlandish connection.

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:05 (twenty years ago)

(we could do this all day)

xpost

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:05 (twenty years ago)

I think the thing that struck me the most about the comment -- more so than its inaccuracy -- was that it was being said by an individual who was evidently taking great pains to present himself as a "music fan". How could you invest so much time and energy into something, yet still get it so wrong?

Granted, I only heard this one snippet....maybe he was reaching for a larger point. Or not.

Fuck it, he was an idiot. Insert that vole!

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:05 (twenty years ago)

Er, HOW.

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:05 (twenty years ago)

Radiohead wouldn't be seen dead at the Playboy Mansion for one.
This isn't a point in their favor, surely?

-- Ian John50n (dr.carl.saga...), April 26th, 2005.

I couldn't respect any band that within ten miles of the place.

― Czan, Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:06 (twenty years ago)

How could you invest so much time and energy into something, yet still get it so wrong?

This is a microcosm of the average student's college experience.

xpost.

If I were in a band, I would make it my goal to play (or just hang out) at the Playboy mansion.

― Ian John50n (orion), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:07 (twenty years ago)

actually saying Rivers Cuomo is the american equivalent of Thom Yorke might not be far off.

― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:08 (twenty years ago)

Perhaps this kid recognized Alex over his shoulder and, being secretly familiar with his reputation from years of lurking on ILM, was simply grasping an opportunity to help launch another of those verbiose tirades we've all come to love and crave.

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:08 (twenty years ago)

I'm actually very curious to understand though WHY this kid made such an outlandish connection.

My guess: he was being funny.

― mrjosh (mrjosh), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:09 (twenty years ago)

I mean, he was being funny, intentionally or not

― mrjosh (mrjosh), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:09 (twenty years ago)

if it weren't for my horse, i wouldn't have spent that year in college.

― AaronK (AaronK), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:09 (twenty years ago)

Fuck it, he was an idiot. Insert that vole!
Most students are idiots.

― jellybean (jellybean), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:10 (twenty years ago)

Weezer was the alt-rock Cheap Trick, but dumber and with less good songs.*

I've been saying this for years! It is good to find agreement.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:10 (twenty years ago)

I still think he was sharing a tip with the other kid about how to score.

― dr. ruthless, Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:11 (twenty years ago)

both bands became vehicles for their emotionally fragile singers obessions after they got famous.

― The Sensational Sulk (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:12 (twenty years ago)

well clearly this guy will get no play from the men of ilx.

(x-post)

― miccio (miccio), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:12 (twenty years ago)

I think the pictures Alex chose are very telling, very good reflections of the singers' (and, consequently, the bands') signature sound. Thom is trying to block out the chatter of an evil broken world, "MAKE THE BAD PEOPLE STOP SAYING THESE THINGS", whereas Rivers is all smiling up a storm, "Hi! I'm a musician! Which of your younger sisters would you be more mad at me for buttfucking?".

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:14 (twenty years ago)

I think the picture on the left perfectly captures how Yorke would feel if he heard his band had been compared to Weezer.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:17 (twenty years ago)

http://www.boomspeed.com/jasonandreas/Images/dyslexics.jpg

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:22 (twenty years ago)

I don't know what it means, I just found that thru a "Radiohead fan" google image search.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:22 (twenty years ago)

I think it has something to do with The Matrix Revolutions

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:25 (twenty years ago)

Are Weezer the American Ash?

― 57 7th (calstars), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:28 (twenty years ago)

If people in Britain are totally unaware that Weezer exists, then yeah I guess they could be.

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:30 (twenty years ago)

Weezer are the American Oasis, right? Vaguely respected early work, utter crap down the line?

― Ian John50n (orion), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:35 (twenty years ago)

"Crystal Gayle is the American Diamanda Galas."

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:42 (twenty years ago)

Ian OTM

― Al (sitcom), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:44 (twenty years ago)

Oasis never had a resurgence, though.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 17:45 (twenty years ago)

Skipping 23 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

Taking yourself seriously isn't a negative thing.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 26 April 2005 22:53 (twenty years ago)

"Creep" and "Undone The Sweater Song" are considered slack-rock anthems of sorts. And both bands attract really stupid fans - Weezer a bit more than Radiohead, especially those who caught onto either band since the turn of the decade. So yeah, they're pretty much the exact same band. It's uncanny.

― billstevejim, Wednesday, 27 April 2005 03:16 (twenty years ago)

At least Weezer don't take themselves seriously.

You should read Cuomo's infamously Ayn Rand-ian grad school application before making that statement. (Or was it a hoax? No matter). He only wants you to think Weezer don't take themselves seriously.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 03:51 (twenty years ago)

http://rockbites.org/images/maximilianHecker2.jpg http://www.ethixgear.com/media/productImages/vegan%20trucker%20hat%20-%20amanda%202_thumb.jpg

"Have you heard the new Beck album?"
"Nah. Pitchfork gave it a 6.6 or something."

― poortheatre (poortheatre), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 03:56 (twenty years ago)

[actual conversation heard last week]

― poortheatre (poortheatre), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 03:57 (twenty years ago)

It's that last part that gives me the horrors.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 03:57 (twenty years ago)

This is like saying "Creed is the American Joy Division"

"I travelled far and wide through prisons of the cross,
What did you see there?
The power and glory of sin,
What did you see there?
The blood of christ on their skins,
I travelled far and wide thorugh many different times."

V.S.

"He looked me right in the eyes
Direct and concise to remind me
To always do what's right
He looked me right in the eyes
Direct and concise to remind me
To always do what's right

Again I stand. Lord I stand,
against the Faceless Man
Again I stand. Lord, God I stand,
against the Faceless Man"

It's actually kind of funny cause I couldn't find any Creed songs with such explicit religious talk as Joy Division's.

― Cunga (Cunga), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 04:22 (twenty years ago)

You should read Cuomo's infamously Ayn Rand-ian grad school application before making that statement. (Or was it a hoax? No matter). He only wants you to think Weezer don't take themselves seriously.

Where can I read this?

― Cunga (Cunga), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 04:27 (twenty years ago)

I think it's still on his myspace.

It's quite disturbing... he like broke down every Beatles song and made a bunch of charts and devised a formula for the 'perfect pop song," off of which he based Maladroit and Green.

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 04:30 (twenty years ago)

this is simultaneous the most hilarious and infuriating thread ever.

― latebloomer: But when the monkey die, people gonna cry. (latebloomer), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 05:12 (twenty years ago)

I thought he broke down mostly Nirvana and Green Day songs (the RS article also says Oasis), not Beatles.

― Al (sitcom), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 05:19 (twenty years ago)

I may be mistaken...

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 05:20 (twenty years ago)

I think Radiohead is probably a better band in terms of music and innovation ... but I'd rather listen to Weezer anyhow. I don't get the comparison, though, except in that they're both sort of mainstream bands that it's considered smart or hip or whatever to like.

― Lyra Jane (Lyra Jane), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 13:45 (twenty years ago)

I don't get the comparison, though

I think anyone who does get the comparison should share their drugs with the rest of us.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 13:56 (twenty years ago)

And both bands attract really stupid fans

Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 17:06 (twenty years ago)

I seriously couldn't think of two bands more dissimilar, really.

I'm with the Wilco/Radiohead comparison though.

― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 17:20 (twenty years ago)

He could have said Radiohead/Stryper.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 17:26 (twenty years ago)

xpost, i agreed with this before, and still hold to it, but wilco jumped on radiohead's bandwagon/followed their lead by a good couple years there.

― AaronK (AaronK), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 17:33 (twenty years ago)

"Have you heard the new Beck album?"
"Nah. Pitchfork gave it a 6.6 or something."

that chill me to the bone. I've heard similar stuff...it's scary that an indie bands sales and financial state can ride on one fucking Pitchfork review.

At least Weezer don't take themselves seriously.
I couldn't say this about Radiohead.

-- zeus (zeuszk...), April 26th, 2005.

Taking yourself seriously isn't a negative thing.

-- The Ghost of Dan Perry (djperr...), April 26th, 2005.

Dan severly OTM....Almost every truly great artist of all time took themselves deadly seriously....Do you think that Miles Davis didn't take himself seriously? Most bands that don't take themselves seriously are crappy bar bands.

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 17:48 (twenty years ago)

xpost, i agreed with this before, and still hold to it, but wilco jumped on radiohead's bandwagon/followed their lead by a good couple years there.

I'm not sure that's really true....it seems more likely that Tweedy was being influenced by all the Thrill Jockey/O Rourke stuff that was going on around him....

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 17:50 (twenty years ago)

I didnt mean that wilco was influenced by radiohead's music itself, more like they were influenced by the Radiohead's direction and success of that direction.

― AaronK (AaronK), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 17:58 (twenty years ago)

The Japanese Butthole Surfers

http://www.bulletsofautumn.com/boredoms/bore003.gif Bubblebop Shot
52 Boredom (club mix)
Sun, Gun, Run
Z & U & T & A
TV Scorpian
Pow Now Now
J.B.Dick + Tinturner Pussy
G.I.L `77
Jup-Na-Keeeeeel
Catastro Mix `99

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 18:16 (twenty years ago)

I heard one say to the other, "Well, y'know, Weezer are pretty much certifiably the American equivalent of Radiohead."

I'm actually very curious to understand though WHY this kid made such an outlandish connection.

I think anyone who does get the comparison should share their drugs with the rest of us.

Both bands were generic copies of American alt-rock when they debuted in 1993/1994, and everybody with taste realised it at the time. Those that fell for it, but later didn't want to acknowlege that they were duped by the major labels' A&R department, instead just acknowleged the acts to be integral bands in their musical development, making the bands look important. Because the first albums were so successful, there were/are many people who fall into this category. Making a second album that was kinda arty prevented both bands from becoming Bush.

I don't do drugs.

― Vic Funk, Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:25 (twenty years ago)

That argument makes no sense because Radiohead's first album is much, much stranger and removed from baseline American alt-rock than their second album.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:33 (twenty years ago)

what? That's not true at all.

― The Good Dr. Bill (The Good Dr. Bill), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:37 (twenty years ago)

VIC SO OTM

― Al (sitcom), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:39 (twenty years ago)

Weezer fans especially have willed their favorite band into 'timelessness' by refusing to let go of 1994/6

― Al (sitcom), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:40 (twenty years ago)

That argument makes no sense because Radiohead's first album is much, much stranger and removed from baseline American alt-rock than their second album.

but not British alt-rock. hence they are the british equivalent.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:42 (twenty years ago)

in the context of Vic's paragraph, I mean. I don't think they have that much in common beyond that and the fact that their last album was rendered mostly insufferable by the moaning mental case singing lead.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:43 (twenty years ago)

though wait, Bush made an arty second album too!

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:44 (twenty years ago)

In what way is The Bends a stranger album than Pablo Honey?

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:46 (twenty years ago)

For that matter, in what way is The Bends arty, period?

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:46 (twenty years ago)

this thread has officially totally derailed.

Pablo Honey is far mroe in line with American alt-rock than British alt-rock. The Bends was far, FAR more British alt-rock in sound. In what way are "Creep" and "Anyone Can Play Guitar" in line with what was going on in the UK underground in '93? In what way do "Street Spirit (Fade Out)" and "Fake Plastic Trees" sound ANYTHING like what was post-grunge was coming out of the US in '95?

― The Good Dr. Bill (The Good Dr. Bill), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:47 (twenty years ago)

Are you pretending that "Just", "High And Dry" and "The Bends" don't exist out of convenience's sake...?

Pablo Honey had monsterhit "Creep" and then a bunch of weedy, inward-gazing songs on the cusp of accessability while The Bends was tailor-made for radio accessibility (which can also be seen by the sheer number of songs from both albums that received mass-market airplay). Both albums are relatively conventional next to everything else that Radiohead has released.

Weezer's trajectory is completely different, especially when you factor in the band hiatuses while Rivers pursued his academic aspirations.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 19:55 (twenty years ago)

Dan OTM. I'm just gonna go back to my Wilco/Radiohead deal

(though my feelings re: the last albums and that both singers are totally hopeless remain)

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:08 (twenty years ago)

miccio, you should teach a course at NYU on forming imprecise and slightly batty musical analogies so that Alex in NYC's acquaintances can learn how it's done.

― Al (sitcom), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:09 (twenty years ago)

if you don't like it, go to russia

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:11 (twenty years ago)

stop confusing me, Rivers. first the Alan Alda picture and now this.

― Al (sitcom), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:14 (twenty years ago)

dude why don't you offer a better example of an american equivalent to the group led by a poet-wanna-be with eventually revealed minor mental problems that started as a relatively traditional example of their genre then got progressively quirkier and art-rocky with each album climaxing with a loved-hated controversial fourth release and an exceptionally detached fifth rather than acting offended that I waste my time noting similarities.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:18 (twenty years ago)

haha I wasn't specifically challenging the Radiohead/Wilco thing! that one sounds relatively solid to me. but you have to admit you're pretty fond of pointing out these kinds of dichotomies that other people often don't see.

that was pretty much the kind of tantrum I couldn't muster for the Akon/Amerie discussion!

― Al (sitcom), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:24 (twenty years ago)

dichotomies that other people don't often see != "imprecise and slightly batty"

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:25 (twenty years ago)

batty is up for debate but don't tell me you're in a lab with a protractor figuring these things out.

― Al (sitcom), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 20:27 (twenty years ago)

whatevs. I find similarities between bands almost as amusing as what makes a person feel the need to call out another's quirks. TS 4 U.

And speaking of TS (which everybody forgot this thread was!): I'll take the blue album over Pablo Honey, Pinkerton over The Bends, and the green album over OK Computer but Kid A over Maladroit by a nose. Amnesia, Hail To The Thief and Make Believe I won't take, thank you.

― miccio (miccio), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 21:19 (twenty years ago)

You're daft miccio.

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 21:20 (twenty years ago)

I think the Flaming Lips/Radiohead comparison works best, despite the two bands' different career trajectories.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 21:21 (twenty years ago)

Take your ritalin, Miccio

― Open your eyes; you can fly! (ex machina), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 21:30 (twenty years ago)

I liked the Wilco analogy, actually--that was a pretty great call.

Are you pretending that "Just", "High And Dry" and "The Bends" don't exist out of convenience's sake...?

Pablo Honey had monsterhit "Creep" and then a bunch of weedy, inward-gazing songs on the cusp of accessability while The Bends was tailor-made for radio accessibility (which can also be seen by the sheer number of songs from both albums that received mass-market airplay). Both albums are relatively conventional next to everything else that Radiohead has released.

Once again, all far more in keeping with UK rock at the time than US.

"on the cusp of accessability"? The only even remotely experimental song on that album is "Blow Out," and even that is a stretch. The rest is about as textbook post-grunge as the UK produced.

What country are we talking about where both albums received mass-market airplay? It certainly wasn't the US, where "Creep" is still perceived as their only big hit.

And if Pablo Honey is really this mondo-experimental album and The Bends this radio-ready collection of ace pop tunes, then explain to me why just about every review ever written about The Bends talks about what a HUGE CREATIVE LEAP The Bends was over PH?

― The Good Dr. Bill (The Good Dr. Bill), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 21:53 (twenty years ago)

I'm not reading this thread as I'm hardly a fan of either band, but I've just had to listen to "Beverly Hills" a dozen times and it's among the worst songs I've heard this year.
Just sayin'.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 21:54 (twenty years ago)

what about: Weezer are the US Smiths???

― thomas, Wednesday, 27 April 2005 22:15 (twenty years ago)

That's Guns N Roses man, we did that three years ago.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 27 April 2005 22:21 (twenty years ago)

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