C/D?: Keeping music with profane lyrics away from your kids, especially once they get old enough to understand them

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http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-0506240163jun24,1,867797.story?coll=chi-news-hed

It's a question I've asked myself a couple of times. Don't know, honestly, what my habits will be when the little one gets slightly older. God knows, by the time she's old enough to understand the lyrics, slang will probably have progressed so far that they'll seem tame.

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:03 (twenty years ago)

It's a very interesting article, actually. Some of the bugbears around here take on a different light.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:07 (twenty years ago)

Agreed, especially since the people interviewed are so obviously conflicted between what they enjoy and what they think may or may not be right for their children. It was very telling how one noted that his parents, back in their day, kept their Richard Pryor albums away from the kids, even as he was discovering Afrika Bambaataa.

Note, for non-Chicagoans: this is on the front page of today's paper, with a jump to the back page.

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:11 (twenty years ago)

Ass, titties, ass 'n titties
Ass ass titties titties, ass 'n titties
Ass, titties, ass 'n titties
Ass ass titties titties, ass 'n titties

Big booty bitches thats where it gets
Come on, hoe, let's go to the easy rest
When I see ass, titties, ass 'n titties
Ass, ass, titties, titties, ass 'n titties.

Ass, ass, ass, ass
Ass, ass, ass, ass
Ass, ass, ass, ass
Ass, ass, ass, ass

If you a light-skinned bitch that think you the shit,
I can buy you, hoe, 'cause bitch I'm rich.
I see broke-ass hoes, broke-ass hoes,
Broke-ass hoes, broke-ass hoes.

Hoes, hoes, hoes, hoes
Hoes, hoes, hoes, hoes
Hoes, hoes, hoes, hoes
Hoes, hoes, hoes, hoes

If you a freaky-dancin' ho, keep shakin' that shit
Let's see how you shake it on top of my dick
And you'll say "Assault, I'm cuming. Assault, I'm cuming.
"Assault, I'm cuming. Assault, I'm cuming."

Cumin', Cumin', Cumin', Cumin'
Cumin', Cumin', Cumin', Cumin'
Cumin', Cumin', Cumin', Cumin'
Cumin', Cumin', Cumin', Cumin'

Stankin ass bitches that need to wash up
Dont get mad when i dont want to fuck
You need soap and water, soap and water
Soap and water, Soap and Water

Water, Water, Water, Water
Water, Water, Water, Water
Water, Water, Water, Water
Water, Water, Water, Water

― Another Allnighter (sexyDancer), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:23 (twenty years ago)

My daughter isn't reading this thread until she's a lot older.

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:26 (twenty years ago)

I'll cross this particular bridge when I get to it.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:29 (twenty years ago)

Agreed, especially since the people interviewed are so obviously conflicted between what they enjoy and what they think may or may not be right for their children.

you're right, and i also think the subjects not only had a conflict with what their kids should or should not hear, but conflict with the music itself (the section talking about what hip-hop used to be, what it is now). while some of them consumed hip-hop with sex, violence, drugs, sexism, etc, in it, there also seems to be an inward battle with whether that music is appropriate at all. the nostalgia for the slick ricks and the like is one thing, but parents are having to face their own tastes and behavior for themselves. there's a fine line between being a hypocrite and being a respectful parent, (i.e. "it's ok if i smoke, as long as my kid doesn't" vs. "i shouldn't be smoking but i do, and i don't want my kid to.")

my syntax suck today.

― katie, a princess (katie, a princess), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:31 (twenty years ago)

She said some day I'd understand
what love was all about
she said I could have the kids
she was movin' out
said she finally found a man
whos dick was so much bigger
and then that scum bag mother fucker
ran off with a nigger

And to think I'd ate the pussy
where that big black dick had been
and kissed the lips that sucked him off
time and time again
its enough to make a man throw up
it sure is hard to figure
how any decent girl could ever fuck a greasy nigger

he treated her just like a Queen
she gave him all my money
it looks like the jokes on me
But I don't think its funny
that pussy ain't worth paying for
as far as I can figure
cause there's nothing quite as worthless
as a white girl with a nigger

And to think I'd ate the pussy
where that big black dick had been
and kissed the lips who sucked him off
time and time again
its enough to make a man throw up
it sure is hard to figure how any decent girl
could ever fuck a god damn nigger

So for all you nigger lovin' whores
this song is just for you

By David Allen Coe

― Another Allnighter (sexyDancer), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:32 (twenty years ago)

my daughter listens to the wind in the trees and the grass rustling against a horses hoof and crickets and milk being poured and kittens fighting over a bowl of fish...I will let her traverse her own audio terrain as she gets older but for now I am guilty of steering her away from some stuff that is not only explicit but horrible music.That siad she does ask to play bunnybrains on occasion,where oddly there are no profane lyrixx,disturbing unintelligible gibberish yes,but no real curse words.

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:37 (twenty years ago)

Reno
She took off her stockings, I held them to my face.
She had your ankles, I felt filled with grace.
"Two hundred dollars straight in,
Two-fifty up the ass," she smiled and said.
She unbuckled my belt, pulled back her hair,
And sat in front of me on the bed.
She said, "Honey how's that feel, do you want me to go slow?"
My eyes drifted out the window, down to the road below.

I felt my stomach tighten. The sun bloodied the sky
And sliced through the hotel blinds. I closed my eyes.
Sunlight on the Amatitlan, sunlight streaming thru your hair.
In the Valle de dos Rios, smell of mock orange filled the air.
We rode with the vaqueros, down into cool rivers of green.
I was sure the work and that smile coming out 'neath your hat
Was all I'd ever need.
Somehow all you ever need's, never really quite enough you know.
You and I, Maria, we learned it's so.

She slipped me out of her mouth, "You're ready," she said.
She took off her bra and panties, wet her finger, slipped it inside her,
And crawled over me on the bed.
She poured me another whisky,
Said, "Here's to the best you ever had."
We laughed and made a toast.
It wasn't the best I ever had,
Not even close.

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:44 (twenty years ago)

My daughter will not be spared Springsteen, and she will hate me for it.

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:52 (twenty years ago)

Well, she may be spared that album, for reasons other than the lyrics.

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:53 (twenty years ago)

My daughter will not be spared Springsteen, and she will hate me for it.

I'm calling child welfare right now.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:57 (twenty years ago)

how about W.A.S.P and Celine Dion and Josh Groban and Carcass..eventually kids find where u keep everything anyway so no titanium plated cd lock box is gonna stop em from findin yur 50 cents cds

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:58 (twenty years ago)

yeah cuz if she finds out u can get 250$ for up th ass its all over..no more college dreams

― dan bunnybrain (dan bunnybrain), Friday, 24 June 2005 13:59 (twenty years ago)

how about W.A.S.P and Celine Dion and Josh Groban and Carcass..eventually kids find where u keep everything anyway so no titanium plated cd lock box is gonna stop em from findin yur 50 cents cds

That's a might eclectic collection. Celine Dion and Carcass? Josh Groban and 50 Cent?

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 24 June 2005 14:01 (twenty years ago)

In the South Holland abode of real estate appraiser Robert Fletcher, his kids know that the stereo is off-limits. With videos now showcasing as much flesh as a strip club, they are the last thing he wants his sons Robert, 10, and Jeremiah, 11, and his daughter, Diamond, 8, to see.

You can't name your daughter Diamond and then pretend like you want to protect her from Strip Clubs!

― Huk-L, Friday, 24 June 2005 14:01 (twenty years ago)

The "they'll hear it/find it/see it anyway" argument doesn't make much sense to me, Dan. So does that mean by the time they're old enough to discover it on their own, you should make stuff readily accesible/within reach at a young age, or encoruage it? What's young? How young?

Honestly, I haven't thought too hard when I'll let my girl watch horror movies with me, or listen to Eminem or whatever.

(Incidentally, though this is better suited to a different thread, there have been any number of hip-hop singles I've prefered in their radio-friendly(er) version than unbleeped. Most lately the "Wait" song, but as far back as Jay-Z's "Can I Get a ...")

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 16:58 (twenty years ago)

i grew up poor and southern so maybe i'm different but i heard WAY worse things on the playground at like age 5 than anything i've recently heard in music. i think we had this one hand slapping song about "big hairy pussy that could mop the floor, she's a goddamn bitch from balt-i-more" chant we did every day. and it didn't disturb me as far as i can tell. i don't think kids can be harmed by this kind of stuff. i think what is more scary for kids is peer-to-peer relations and how cruel those can be and also the turmoil going on in kids minds as they go through puberty. anything we dream up in our adult life, and any kind of treatment we give it, is like small potatoes compared that. i think pushing for a child to stay naive and pure can also be felt by them and possibly perceived as not loving them in their entirety.

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Friday, 24 June 2005 17:21 (twenty years ago)

Susan, this is exactly what I just wondered about the post before yours. So, if they're going to encounter it anyway, should *nothing* be kept away from kids? I saw/heard/said all sorts of stuff as a kid, but none of it came from home. Doesn't that mean something? I'd like to think it's because my parents did love me and cared about how I would turn out.

(Ha ha, I showed them ...)

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 17:42 (twenty years ago)

I don't really censor what I listen to around the house. The kids don't seem to tune into music they're not interested in, and I think kids tend to treat lyrics as lyrics without contemplating what they mean. My oldest is 13 and has been steadily getting into Hip Hop (via Eminem) for the last couple of years. I figure he's old enough and mature enough to listen to what he likes now. We have the occasional discussion about lyrics, he's a bright boy, I have no fear he'll be "corrupted".

The only problem I've had is that my 3 year-old daughter was really into Outkast's "Roses" (initially because one of her nursery teachers was called Caroline), and we had a brief phase of her singing "crazy bitch" from time to time. When I told her it wasn't a nice thing to say, she laughed and said it more. So I ignored her. Problem gone. She didn't understand what she was saying, she just liked the sound of the song.

― Taste the Blood of Scrovula (noodle vague), Friday, 24 June 2005 17:52 (twenty years ago)

"kids tend to treat lyrics as lyrics without contemplating what they mean."

My niece used to watch "Bambi," completely glossing the death of Bambi's mother.

― Rickey Wright (Rrrickey), Friday, 24 June 2005 18:23 (twenty years ago)

xpost - well, i bring up the poor thing b/c the people i know now who are in a much higher income bracket monitor their kids a LOT more, plus that is just the name of the game nowadays...everyone is hyper involved in their kids life and their kids experience of youth and seem to really want their kids to BE kids forever. but when we were young there was way more autonomy and people left you alone more b/c they had to work or clean the house and they didn't revel in the fact that you were a blank slate, you had to deal and be aware, and no one cared about keeping you a kid, the point was you were expected to grow up at some point and if earlier maybe the better so you would be less of a burden. we knew about shit, and my parents didn't work to keep the outside world at bay at all...but also knew we couldn't go nuts and do most of it b/c we understood responsibility. but i guess i'm saying...it probably depends on the kids/parents/environment/$$. there are probably a lot of kids who should be kept sheltered.

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Friday, 24 June 2005 18:23 (twenty years ago)

I think it has little to do with $$$, considering kids who grow up well off usually have double-income parents, which means mom and dad aren't around as much, which means more autonomy. I don't think being rich or poor has much to do with it. So, yeah - parents, and then environment, which probably includes/reflects $$$ or lackthereof. But I imagine it's mostly parenting, which is why the vast majority of poor people don't make poor parents, and the vast majority of well off people don't exclusively raise over-pampered ninnies.

So, good parenting=instilling values/responsibility=regulating, or at least watching, what your kids consume and how they consume it. Which brings us back to my original question.

Perhaps, Susan, what you remember as autonomy was actually more than that, and your parents were more aware of what you were up to than you remember.

― Josh in Chicago (Josh in Chicago), Friday, 24 June 2005 20:05 (twenty years ago)

yes, you are right.

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Friday, 24 June 2005 20:13 (twenty years ago)

I'll cross this particular bridge when I get to it.

Exactly. My daughter's 9 months old; I figure I have at least two years before she starts to notice song lyrics.

― mike a, Friday, 24 June 2005 20:20 (twenty years ago)

This is all theoreticzal to me, but I worry more about videos than about lyrics. On the one hand, I don't want my kids to grow up with a complex or thinking sex is dirty ... but I also really don't like the way women are portrayed in most videos now. Hopefully the trend will reverse itself before I need to worry about it.

Lyrics, eh. I read everything when I was a kid, some stuff that was of questionable appropriateness, and from what I can remember I took what I could and the rest of it went ovfer my head. I think lyrics are robabl;y the same. (But, then, I don't listen to much that I'd consider offensive anyhow.)

― Lyra Jane (Lyra Jane), Saturday, 25 June 2005 01:47 (twenty years ago)

"I don't blame you
I wouldn't let hayley listen to me either"

-Eminem

― plebian plebs (plebian), Saturday, 25 June 2005 02:52 (twenty years ago)

Lyra Jane nails it. IMO the videos have a long-term subliminal and subversive effect, the hyper-sexuality and reinforcement of sexism are much harder to counteract w/discussion than objectionable lyrics. So we monitor most listening and don't sweat the inevitable profanity but watching videos is basically verboten.

― m coleman (lovebug starski), Saturday, 25 June 2005 10:04 (twenty years ago)

Are videos worse now than when Motley Crue & Scorpions had futuristic whores in & out of cages and David Coverdale was cavorting about with Tawny Kitaen in the car? I can't bring myself to watch music videos anymore so I wouldn't know, but I can't think of much worse than watching someone make out with David Coverdale.

― Kent Burt (lingereffect), Saturday, 25 June 2005 21:04 (twenty years ago)

My dad is an EXTREME super duper liberal and bought and played me NWA when they first came out (I was like 7), and explained how important they were.

― asdflkjhlh (David Allen), Saturday, 25 June 2005 21:53 (twenty years ago)

despite this appearing as a discussion, seems like we all have pretty good idea where we stand on this. so i'll just state my position then and to avoid argument etc. say i don't think anyone will change my mind: basically, i hope when i have kids there is always an open dialogue instead of forbidding them see/hear what they are interesting in seeing. i'm hoping there won't be much i'll have to keep from them. i'm sure i'll draw the line somewhere but doubt it will be anywhere near where other people's lines are.

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Saturday, 25 June 2005 22:31 (twenty years ago)

I think kids find out about sex and drugs talk anyway, so I wouldn't lock anything up.

But they also repeat what they hear, so playing a lot of stuff with "bitch" and "fuck" and "nigga" lyrics might not be good if you don't want the kid to repeat it at the worst moment. If you do play it, like David's dad, explain what it means (have fun! ;-)

― Orbit (Orbit), Saturday, 25 June 2005 22:37 (twenty years ago)

Are videos worse now than when Motley Crue & Scorpions had futuristic whores in & out of cages and David Coverdale was cavorting about with Tawny Kitaen in the car?

I can't remember that era, but I can remember the early-to-mid 1990s pretty well, and there's definitely a lot more flesh on display in 2005 than there was in 1995. It used to be maybe one video in three had a chick in a bikini, now the videos that don't have models cavorting in about that they'd wear for a Maxim photoshoot seem to be very much the exception.

Also, female performers are much more agressive about displaying their sexuality. Lisa Loeb famously wore a little black dress in the "Stay" video; an equivalent performer today would probably be in a halter top and miniskirt or tight low-rise jeans. Of course, Christina Aguilera wearing assless chaps and singing is a better role model for girls than anonymous model #9876 wearing assless chaps and writhing next to a male singer, in that at least Xtina represents female agency ... but I still would like an alternative not involving assless chaps to show up on MTV.

God, I'm turning into my mother.

― Lyra Jane (Lyra Jane), Monday, 27 June 2005 19:46 (twenty years ago)

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