Okay, Lets attack this here Dance Album list...

a) Okay, so which ones are gems and which ones are garbage?
b) Which are best for indie-rock-addled "Dance Music Newbies" and which ones are the ones that indie-rockers "just won't 'get'?"
c) Are the obscure ones on this list really obscure classics or are they Mojo-styled hipster-cred artifact purchases for the oscurantist snobs?

'Ray of Light' but not 'Erotica'?

Also, DJ Shadow is everything I ever hated about music, but I'm not the 'dance guy' here so I'll shut up now. (BTW If Suicide's debut makes it, how about Herbie Hancock's 'Sextant'? 'Melodie Nelson' should be on there too, and why 'Kittenz and the Glitz' instead of any Moroder?)

...how about Herbie Hancock's 'Sextant'?

I dunno, dave. Must not have too many jazz afficianatos at that magazine.

Str8 up....some real herbs made that list....half them shits arent even dance.....these people are the types responsible for getting Kobe Bryant a record deal...ballcorns....anyways, on that list, I recommend Felix, Madonna, Basement Jaxx, PE, Missy....actually, just avoid BT and Rae & Christian and you're pretty safe

I've never seen -- nor can I imagine -- anyone actually DANCING to DUMMY by Portishead. Rivetting listening to be sure, but a 'dance' album? I think not.

Suicide? Throbbing Gristle? Great bands both, but what are these people smoking? That's not dance music.

I'm actually impressed. The only album I see on here which I think is out-and-out garbage is the Fatboy Slim album. There are some albums I wouldn't necessarily recommend (BT, Leftfield) and I wonder at their selection criteria (in what way is _Chill Out_ a dance album?), but I'm amazed that, out of a list of 50 albums, I have largely positive things to say about the majority of them.

Albums I'd unreservedly recommend from this list: 2, 3, 6, 9, 10, 11, 13, 14, 15, 19, 23, 24, 26, 28, 29, 30, 32, 36, 37, 46.

Some rather odd choices for what sez it's a "dance" album in that a lot of these aren't made for dancing, the DJ Shadow included. Obviously then, their definition of "dance" is synonymous with electronic production.

A. gems areOrbital - Brown Album, aka Orbital 2; Portishead - Dummy; Autechre - Incunabula. I'll lay off the filth...

B. Starters, which btw mainly are ones that I want to see propogated most, not necessarily ones that I'd think would be easy to get into: the Autechre, Portishead, Massive Attack, maybe the Plastikman (I prefer his next few albums, as his minimalism is a tad boring for my tastes w/ Sheet One), Tricky, Orbital.

the Inscrutables: Autechre, that particular Aphex Twin.

C. None are terribly obscure.

Being new to the world of techno/rave/dance/electronica/'Ardcore/whatever music, four of these acts (BT, Nicolette, Felix Da Housecat, Rae and Christian) are completely unknown to me. The rest are either public knowledge (people in comas know who Madonna is. Hell, people in comas *BOUGHT* Ray of Light.) Some (Roots Manuva, Faithless) wouldn't ring a bell with your grandma.

Let me add a caveat, and an elitist joke, to the obscurity question: my sense of obscurity has been :: ahem :: WARPED!! Hyuk hyuk!

The problem here is I have heard of just about all these groups and I don't really like dance, meaning dare I say this is a rockist's dance list.

Apparently black people aren't very good at making dance records.

Hmm... roughly 11/50 black artists. Proportionally by America or England's population this is fairly representative. By where DANCE records come from, this is utterly unrepresentative. also... Eminem? Huh? Nearly any other Dre production would be more "dance".

You have to be more purist about a dance canon. The problem is defining what can be included. It's difficult to pin it down to a reasonablly coherent set of assumptions and thus avoid tokenism. I don't think I've ever seen a good one.

Let's see...

Hip-hop has to be left out altogether. It's a massive genre on its own and you will always end up looking stupid by sticking a few token vaguely electronic/sampladelic hip-hop albums on the list.

You have to leave out what they used to call "trip-hop" too--just file it under "British hip-hop."

No rock/pop crossovers either.

Those two exclusions take care of about half this crappy list. The other half of it isn't too bad.

Also have to be more flexible about the formats--in dance music, compilations/mix albums are usually better than individual artist albums.

And then you really have to call it an electronic music canon, not dance music, because a fair bit of it is going to be stuff that is coming out of dance culture but is not actually for dancing too. Calling it electronic music leaves you open to token inclusions of Stockhausen et al, but I think you get around that by just tacitly admitting that this is a post-84 list (which also gets you out of including disco, another genre unto itself).

if it's "to look for" rather than "to dance to" maybe they mean you shd hide em in the garden with yr easter eggs!! it is a list of nice records >>><<< i only evah dance to conlon nancarrow anyway

I think the first problem with the list is its title. I look at the title and I look at the list (especially the top ten), and I can't help but think of an equivalent blues list that would include Beck and Johnny Lang in the top ten. Really -- what's a Top 50 Dance Albums of All Time list without James Brown, Funkadelic, Chic, Slave, Inner City, Carl Craig or even the Four Tops? This list really should be called something else.

i only evah dance to conlon nancarrow anyway

Just don't try fucking to him.

i swear to christ we've done this one before.

Well... it's quite obvious that "dance albums of all time" refers to the acclaimed electronically produced works of the past couple decades. Hence... no JB, Funkadelic, etc. The oddest part of the title of this list, to me, is the combination of "dance" and "albums". As somebody mentioned before, a list like this is sorta off the mark before it's even conceived... "dance" has primarily been about the tracks, singles, dubplates and soforth. What we have here is a showcase of an auteuristic cream of the crop. The democratization-of-track aspect isn't really done justice by gathering this kind of set of tokenistic picks.

Any theories as to why DJ Shadow is #1? Is it cuz he made sampling more "dance-friendly" or something?

Dj Shadow is #1 because of the big splash and influence his CD made in the dance music community, such as it is. You must remember, this is an electronic music mag, explicitly tailored to those who listen to a lot of electronic music. While an album like Shadow's or Portishead may not have been danceable, both are very popular favorites in the "culture." It doesn't matter anyway, I find decent arguments for many of the list to be #1. It's just a list.

The inclusion of Bjork Debut is just wrong. It's a beautiful album, but it's not dance, techno or any of that (okay, maybe the singles but still). Post maybe, Homogenic probably, but not Debut. DJ Shadow is overated, BT is overated, I would have gone with Dig Your Own Hole over Exit Planet Dust, although I like the inclusion of two KLF albums.

Max

Patrick half-explains it IMHO - this is a list produced by people who want to represent a "culture" of dance music that, like any culture, is anxious to misrepresent itself. In the same way that rappers will strangely spend as much time bigging up their clothing labels (eg. Wu-Wear) as their actual music, dance music lists invariably have an excessive proportion of undanceable albums like "Endtroducing". In the Wu-Tang Clan's case, it's about saying "it's more than the music, it's a way of life." Swap "music" for "dancing" and you have the exact mindset that created this list.

Jess is right this list has been done before but only the top 25

well, anybody who gives a damn about anything Muzik has to say when it comes to actual music is a complete and utter fucking moron.

Muzik is exactly the reason that people who actually know about good dance music vehelmently hate the English dance music press. If you want to know about what pants to wear to the club this season, or why the scenery of a club is infinitely more important that the music policy, read muzik.

Everybody on ilm knows how I feel about Detroit Techno, but come on, Where is Lil Louis, Phuture, Marshall Jefferson, Steve Poindexter or Jesse Saunders? The Classic Chicago artists are completely unrepresented in that list. That is not just a mistake, that is fucking criminal. How can a UK dance music mag not mention ACID HOUSE!!!

it should be called "50 historic dance records selected by people who do not actually have a clue about the history of dance music".

perhaps this is partly due to the UK definition of 'dance'? in the way that the definition of indie is quite narrow, the definition of 'dance' is very broad, but covers mostly recent (i.e. post 1988) electronic artists. Soul, Funk, Disco etc are often covered under the name 'black music' rather than 'dance'. UK dance magazines will cover Hiphop, Trip hop, Bjork, etc.

i meant all that in relation to the whole thread, not the post immediately above. in answer to that particular post, my theory doesn't excuse the lack of more important house/techno/rave records, but again it *is* a list of 'albums' rather than best tracks. i think a list of top 50 dance tracks of all time from the same magazine would include a lot more house/techno/rave and less trip-hop etc

I think "dance music" in the UK = "club music", music you would expect to be generally consumed in a club or chill-out room environment. This still doesn't entirely explain the inclusion of hip- hop.

but there are many clubs playing hip hop...?

I was about to say what Michael said about the fact that it's an albums list. Surely by now it's a truism that to focus on dance albums is stupid and evil? None of Lil Louis, Phuture, Marshall Jefferson, Steve Poindexter or Jesse Saunders released albums that are terribly well known, or even readily available. (and I've certainly tried looking for the Phuture/DJ Pierre/Photon Inc album released on Strictly Rhythm).

Hey people: it's merely fifty records so it's bound to be incomplete if you use such a broad term as "dance" = so it's useless..

Lord Custos, if you want some "dance" tips: my absolute favorite "house" album last year was Classic's "Thanks for coming by"-mixcompilation with a mix by label bosses Derrick Carter and Luke Solomon: it contained the past, present & future of my favorite house label. Check their sounds out @ http://www.classicmusiccompany.com/clhome.htm

a+ Johan www.kindamuzik.net/beats

All respect for minimalism aside, I could only listen to Plastikman if I wanted to rock my constipation out to it--Ha! Like Erik Satie, who wanted music to go along with clinking forks and china, PLASTIKMAN--music to defecate to...