Taking Skronky Sides: Y by the Pop Group vs. No New York

in all honesty, I didn't discover their pre-pop work until much later on, but memories of their sickly latter incarnation severely hamper my ability to be open-minded about it.

Anyway, I'm partial to Y - please note that the footage of the Pop Group in that IFC punk doc directed by Don Letts is stoking the flames of this partiality, to be sure. I love me some no-wave, but I never got into NYY in & of itself.

I was gonna say something about the Pop Group extending a tradition while NNY groops were shunning tradition, but then there's James Chance, so what the fuck do I know?

I'm just saying it's a flip of the coin of Y in some ways, and I think a fan of one would like the other.

both great tho, salut skronk!

YES!

I can't decide because I actually haven't heard all of No New York, strangely enough.

if "we are all prostitutes" had been on Y, though, it would've been closer.

Thanks, MCD!

Re. the "posh kids" questioning. Are you familiar with the word "flippant"?

NYC is kind of automatically more "posh" than Bristol.

x-post - they're not only posh, but "dilettantes!" (I mean, I know you're being flippant, but to what extent to do people actually dislike no wave for these reasons, I wonder???)

2x-post - Walter, too. The no wave band members were all "arty scenesters," were they?

"Dilettante" was adding fuel to the fire, wasn't it? I'm thinking about orthodox perception of the scene here rather than my own gut feeling, and I'm reading it backwards through mid-80s Sonic Youth artcore. I don't think either record's professed politics is a sufficient reason to prefer one to the other: I have a nostalgic preference for what I'm half-heartedly calling Pop Group's engagement versus No Wave's disengagement. Call it Focus. Sometimes of course Smudge is better than Focus. "But we have to say something."

But getting to the point I had intended to make, I'm just going to add my opinion to the consensus and say that "Y" is leagues better than anything any of the No-Wave bands put out, which is a hefty statement but one which i think is borne out by tracks like "we are time" and "savage sea."

i'd add that mark stewart's "as the veneer of democracy starts to fade" trumps both in my book.

This makes sense, actually.

As for "No New York," it always seemed to me that James Chance and DNA sections were ace, while Teenage Jesus and Mars sounded more like they were fooling around...

Actually, that's incorrect. It doesn't refer to deckchairs, but rather to luggage. The idea being that since the luggage was going to be stowed on deck, it was to be positioned on the side of the ship that was not directly facing the sun's unforgiving rays (which would cause the colors of their expensive bags to fade and bake).

That's what I'd heard, anyway. In any case, it still has nothing to do with fashion and everything to do with affluence.

Have you not? Maybe I'm projecting, but it seems to be an album that music snobs use to outdo each other in bouts of oneupsmanship. "Oh, you don't have Y on disc, eh? You're missing out, man!" "No, I actually have it on vinyl, if you must know!"

The two go hand-in-hand most of the time but the NY punk scene is obviously an exception.

http://nowave.pair.com/no_wave/nyc_images/redtransistor.jpg

The two go hand-in-hand most of the time but the NY punk scene is obviously an exception.

I can name some rich people who haven't the foggiest idea about fashion.

http://www.dirtyflower.com/wp-content/knauss1.jpg

on a musical note nobody was doing this to any great effect at this time except maybe the gang of four.

on a musical note

ive always loved the pop group's first two albums the third being poor on sound quality
but did have some stand out track

we are time, snow girl, beyond good and evil, being the finest efforts, stewarts 'learning to cope with cowerdice' is very good but the following albums lost the thread

hasnt the message always been at the forfront with everything pop group/stewart did ?

clock dva's 'thirst' album was a bit like 'y' in a more jazz noir way

I believe the message was a bit more elastic and abstract initially, but by the point of How Much Longer..., it had significantly overtaken the music (much like Bedtime for Democracy by the DK's)

New Gareth Sager (Pop Group) album is out on Creeping Bent, and it's more Pop Group-y than his CC Sager album from a few years back. It's called Slick Slack Music, and should appeal to the No Wave contingent more than the CC Sager one (though I really liked that too). It's pretty good on first listen.

Here's the NME review. Weird how little attention this guy gets...

Gareth Sager was guitarist in legendary post-punkers The Pop Group and his debut solo album follows their wobbly avant-reggae lines. Instead of sticking to minimalism, though, it piles on funk, soul, glam, and howls of invocation like a demonic game of Buckaroo. ‘Bad Bad Loser’ is like The Fall joining the dancefloor to intimidate the dancers with full throttle aggro-funk. ‘So Fired Up’ is voodoo rockabilly straight from a David Lynch nightclub, ‘Dollar Hungry’ like John Spencer doing Prince and ‘Hot Hits Vol 27’ is a genius Tom Waits/Elvis hybrid. Titles such as ‘Not Since The Accident’ and ‘Draining Swan Lake’ indicate the level of wit on display here and the album feels fun in a way you wouldn’t expect from the old guard. Sager’s the disco Captain Beefheart. Mega.

I guess nobody cares, but Gareth Sager had like four albums out last year (some on Spotify) and some songs are pretty amazing (some are not). The only page I can find on it is here:

http://www.bristolarchiverecords.com/bands/Pregnant.html

It weirds me out how under-the-radar he seems to be. Track to check would be "I Took It As Gospel" from "Hey, Dad What Do Poets Eat For Tea?" which I've had on repeat for most of today...

This would be the Spotify link:

http://open.spotify.com/track/5XuYQjkYgcUre1zQs5kGuw