Which punk/postpunk band had the best rhythym section?

Hugo Burnham/Dave Allen
Jah Wobble/Richard Dudanski
Peter Hook/Steven Morris

Honorable mention to Nick Bullen/Mick Harris (though I prefer their post-ND stuff infinitely more) for being able to play sofuckingfast and to Roli Mossiman/Jonathan Kane for playing. So. Fucking. Slow.

The Buzzcocks had a great rhythm section too

I don't know - the drumming is a bit too busy for my taste on the earlier singles. I guess he improved though.

Now, the Rezillos- there's a great rhythm section.

I love the Minutemen and I'll attest to the greatness of Watt/Hurley, but "bone crushing" isn't a pharse I'd apply to their music, nohow, no sir...

And honestly, the next thing that comes to mind is !!!. I was really impressed with their drum and bass playing when I saw them.

But I guess they're neo-post-punk.

I do think that Paul Cook/Glen Matlock were great on the Sex Pistols early stuff. Cook is a great drummer - can infuse a basic 1-2-3-4 with a bit of swing. Try the demos of Submission, for example. It helped that the Pistols played quite slow for punk.

I second Maher/Garvey. Maher IS busy, but somehow it doesn't grate.

Who said Husker Du? I can't agree there. How can you tell when bass and drums are so horribly recorded? No kick drum, weedy snare,and he doesn't use his hi-hat enough. Ugh!

and, of course, section 25 for both the better-than-PiL-in-parts doom-disco of "always now" and the we-invented-acid-house genius of "from the hip" (especially the live versions of the songs therein). again, a band where everyone was a percussive wonder.

I also nominate Refused and Gang Of Four.

(At first I was going to say Foreigner.)

xpost

The 27 drummers and 36 bassists who have played with the Cure.
Bauhaus and the Ruts seconded.
And, if Guns n' Roses and Foreigner can be on the list, then by God I'll nominate Paul Thompson and Graham Simpson, Roxy's first and finest rhythm section.

For that matter, I'll nominate Paul Wilmott of Disco Inferno, whose basslines pretty much carry their songs from a rhythmic standpoint.

Magazine

i mean, ac/dc, stooges, sonics, g'n'r were punk in the sense of dirtbaggy raw simple r&r and they had a whole lot in common musically with the punk bands, but were they punk in specific historical/social/cultural context? aside from a fluke marketing approach (not approved of by the band, for what it's worth) or modern recontextualization, nah.

Is anybody actually usually considered "punk/post-punk"? I think lots of bands are either usually considered one or the other, not both.

Maybe the B-52s, for five or ten minutes (i.e., "52 Girls"). Or Pylon, for a different five or ten minutes (i.e., "Cool.") Or yeah, maybe Public Image Ltd. Or the Slits. Or the Contortions. Or Pearl Harbor and the Explosions, or the Kings, or the Romantics, or the Knack, or Dr. Feelgood, or the Count Bishops. But definitely not Husker Du or Mission of Burma. And probably not the Gang of Four. Hell, maybe the Fall! Or Joan Jett and the Blackhearts. Or somebody.

Horrible review:
The 1-2 punch delivered by Dave Riley and Roland is like nothing you have ever heard in your life. It will leave you gasping for air and bruised in the morning. It will make your poor mother sick to her stomach. Fans of NIN listen up, this stuff will alter your existence! This stuff was alternative and indie before they were calling it that!

Also, I like really busy drummers. Mickey Jones over Levon Helm for me, any day. And I'm now preparing to get a lot of shit.

Sort of like the Music Machine crossed with Black Sabbath crossed with the Dictators, only more hardcore. (And the Cars were a better dance band than the Gang of Four or Husker Du any day of the frigging week.)

Yeah, but were they more than a decent new wave rhythm section w/ good gear that stayed in time well? I'm just not sure how a lot of these bands are separated from the pack at all.

Pistols: Start with "Submission."

Gang of Four's biggest rhythm innovation: Funk with a copy of the *Communist Manifesto* up their butts, a whole new thing! (Best song, regardless: "Damaged Goods," in its original single version. I like the first two albums and first two EPs fine. But they distrusted disco way too much; they even sang dumb lyrics about it, for crissakes.("Down on the disco floor they make their profits from the things they sell to help you cob off and the rubbers you hide in your top left pocket" -- that's from memory, but I think I got it right. What fucking puritans. They wanted us to *stop* dancing, and their rhythm section pretty much agreed.)

Slits have a great rhythm section too, even if Budgie wasn't a formal member.

See to me the gold-standard forebears in rhythm sections is LED ZEPPELIN, whose function was to rock.

Can't disagree more with this. Jesus & Tequila? Shit You Hear At Parties? The Anchor? Given 10 seconds thought I can come up with 3 Minutemen songs where Boon provided the melody. Plus Boon was the single greatest guitar soloist the US (if not world) punk scene ever produced.

I have no idea why you thought I said that he didn't provide the melody. What I was saying is that "rhythm section" generally refers to an UNDERLYING beat, bass pattern, and playing of chords on guitar or piano, etc. None of the parts in Minutemen songs are underlying - it's all surface.

I agree that all three players were forefront most of the time (no player was "underlying"), but I also see "rhythm section" as a less loaded term than you do. Rhythm section = bass & drums, and until you get to the extremes of musical experimentation, for me any bassist and drummer team is up for a nomination in this category.

-- xhuxk (xedd...), October 19th, 2005."

I did mention them first. Scroll up.

The Fall (Hanley-Hanley-Burns lineup)

Like I said waaay upthread!

No, I'm only joking; nonetheless Suicide 238572903ed.

WHY has no one mentioned Savage Republic yet?

I agree with this first sentence. I don't think that a good rhythm section has to have swing (by which I mean playing slightly ahead of or behind the beat in such a way as to create a subtle implication of counter-rhythm or syncopation), but I do think that a good rhythm section can often be distinguished from a mediocre one by a general sense of looseness or breathability - the beat breathes, it feels alive. There is a place for machine-like, dead-sounding beats too, but generally machines can do those better than people. (And in the right hands, machines can often breathe and groove better than real musicians.) Generally poor rhythm sections sound stiff because they're playing with their heads and not with their ears - ie., they're not listening to each other.

Anyway, the reason that I picked the Rezillos is not just because they lay down a solid, propulsive rhythm (which they do), but also because the bass-player plays these fast jazzy runs up and down the scales, which simultaneously keeps the rhythm moving forward while providing a counterpoint to the main melodies and creating a sense of harmonic movement.

Metal Urbain! It's not even a drum machine, it's a Korg synth! (i think)

http://www.keyboardmuseum.org/d_machines/mp35.html

Chic seconded.

I was very worried when they came over here for those shows, but they were pretty great.

As well as being in UFO he continued working regularly with Captain Sensible, unexpectedly finding himself a member of The damned again in '96 after Vanian deserted the Scabies / Shaw / Dollimore / Moose travesty line-up of The Damned and joined what had been The Captain's touring band - which then consisted of Paul Gray, Monty Oxymoron and Garrie Dreadful - with the effect that they effectively became The Damned.

He lefty later in '96 to be replaced by Mrs. Vanian, ex Gun Club and Sisters Of Mercy bassist Patricia Morrison.

Apparently he's now unable to play or tour because of problems with tinnitus.

I do quite like a lot of Budgie's work, though, esp. Creatures.

The bassline is sublime.